[Eauz]

Well for my first post here, I would like to talk about the swastika, MNC's and Killing people.

We all view the swastika as a sign of hatred, terror, and mass killings of innocent people. If I were to wear one to university, I would probably get pulled to the side, and sent home. And no, I am not a nazi propaganda guy, who is interested in killing all Jews. But I wonder, if it is wrong to wear a swastika, why is it not wrong that I wear a Nike swoosh on my T-Shirt, and Adidas shoes, eating a Mars bar chocolate bar, and carrying around my books in backpack I bought from Wal-Mart. Personally, I avoid all these things, because all those and much more are encouraging the killing and abuse of millions of people around the world. These MNC's might not be literally killing these people, but they are killing them mentally, leaving them to live a life on 10 cents per hour or even less to make the stuff we in the First World Enjoy. Yet it is alright in our society to wear these brand names, and eat the wonderful sweets. I just don't see the difference between the meaning of the swastika and the meaning of these corperations.


Now I prepare like Lasairfhionn said "to have alot of your comments ripped to shred by other members."

[smashthestate EDIT: Although this has a little bit to do with economics, this is more appropriate for the Morals & Ethics forum, as the question you asked about the difference between wearing a Swastika or brand-name, foreign made, products is one or morality. This forum is more for specific debate about economic theory, policy, etc., and not so much about the moral "predicaments" that result.]

[clownboy]

Well, since the swastika is actually a religious symbol, it's more a spiritual branding mark than a commercial identity.

And there ARE places in the world where 10 cents an hour (I'm matching your exaggeration) is a living wage equal to our minimum wage.

Another distinction is that you have a choice to not wear these symbols if you wish not to. You even have the choice (here in the US) to wear a swastika. Folks may treat you rudely, but freedom of expression does not mean freedom from consequence arising from said expression.

There ARE times when wearing a Nike swoosh in the open will cause negative reactions to your person. Hang around the Nike store in downtown Portland wearing a swoosh during one of the semi-annual "protests" and you'll get to experience it first-hand.

[Eauz]

Well, since the swastika is actually a religious symbol, it's more a spiritual branding mark than a commercial identity.

Sure, but for some people, having Nike shoes is the most important thing for them. I remember I had a friend who would only buy Nike shoes, because that product was the brand in style and he liked Nike. So, I guess wearing a cross would be reasonable, if you were a Christian.

And there ARE places in the world where 10 cents an hour (I'm matching your exaggeration) is a living wage equal to our minimum wage.

These countries might have minimum wages of 10 cents which is equal to our minimum wage, how come these countries and corperations don't treat them like they would treat us? I'm working at a Minimum wage job, but I'm not getting beat by someone, and the chances that I'll be killed or injured at work is minimal. Where as there really isn't any security for these people, and if they lose an arm, or leg, they lose their job, and health care isn't like it is in some places.

Another distinction is that you have a choice to not wear these symbols if you wish not to. You even have the choice (here in the US) to wear a swastika. Folks may treat you rudely, but freedom of expression does not mean freedom from consequence arising from said expression.

I know one has the right to wear this stuff, but home come even with people knowing about Nike's Sweat shops do we still wear the Swoosh, and we hear about the Nazi's and if you even sympathise for the Nazi's you are labeled as an anti-semitic ? I find it funny, when I see people at Wal-Mart who are searching for the perfect gift for Christmas for their 12 year old child, but they don't even think that the products they buy come from children just like their child who work for 10 cents per hour, under horrible work conditions.

So I ask why do we put a Taboo on the Swastika and the things that Hitler and the Nazi's did, but when it comes to economics, it's all about keeping prices low, letting consumers consume, and making a good profit, when not everyone profitting from this system, and human beings are becoming sick, and dieing just like the Jews were in the Concentration Camps?

It's funny how the Caucasian population ignores problems, until the problems start occuring to their own, but if it's happening to the Asians, or Africans, it's not really important. Colonialism has never disappeared.

[clownboy]

These countries might have minimum wages of 10 cents which is equal to our minimum wage, how come these countries and corperations don't treat them like they would treat us? I'm working at a Minimum wage job, but I'm not getting beat by someone, and the chances that I'll be killed or injured at work is minimal. Where as there really isn't any security for these people, and if they lose an arm, or leg, they lose their job, and health care isn't like it is in some places.

Because, as you can find evident here, those other countries get more than a little peeved when we try to tell them not to do THAT. Funny thing - they seem to think it THEIR CHOICE on how to run their country and not yours.

I find it funny, when I see people at Wal-Mart

What the heck are you doing at Wal-Mart if you truely feel the way you do?

It's funny how the Caucasian population ignores problems, until the problems start occuring to their own, but if it's happening to the Asians, or Africans, it's not really important. Colonialism has never disappeared.

WHAT? What the heck does this have to do with being pink??

Last time I was at Wal-Mart (admittedly, years ago) was in Oakland. Weren't many pink faces among the shoppers that day.

[Eauz]

Uhh, well capitalism is linked to this problem that they don't want minimum wage. Capitalism forces these countries to achieve great in economics, and a growing economy like the Developed world. Thus, to achieve this, they need capital, and investement that comes at a cost. So, wages are lower, creating the product cost less, and there aren't many laws against bad business performance thus the investment will come into the country.

Odd how that works eh?

What the heck are you doing at Wal-Mart if you truely feel the way you do?

Funny thing is, maybe you haven't seen this before, but there are things called "Malls", which have everything related to capitalism. And because the only place I can pay my phone bills to write you this post, is at the Mall. And Because Wal-Mart is like 3/4th of the Mall, it's KIND of hard NOT to see people going in and out of Wal-Mart.

WHAT? What the heck does this have to do with being pink??

Last time I was at Wal-Mart (admittedly, years ago) was in Oakland. Weren't many pink faces among the shoppers that day.

What are you talking about? I mean, Caucasians cry about whatever happens to themselves, but really don't care about others. The developed countries are a big supporter and enforcer of terrorism, yet we cry and complain about terror when it occurs to us. This terror we create comes in more forms than war, such as business, economic, and social to our own people, as well as the rest of the world.

[clownboy]

Eauz -

Every Wal-Mart I've ever seen has been a stand-alone store. Where do you hail from that all the faces coming and going are pink? The racial makeup here in America is widely diverse.

Capitalism doesn't force anyone to do anything. You can opt out whenever you want - just stop buying and selling things. Your problem - the people around you WANT things.

[Eauz]

Where do you hail from that all the faces coming and going are pink? The racial makeup here in America is widely diverse.

Well if you looked at "Location" you would know. And seeing as you are from the USA, you SHOULD know where that location is. And it doesn't help, living in the Maritimes where most people are 60 year old white people. The only reason my city has asians, blacks, Latino's is because it's a university city.

Anyways, you're getting off topic about the moral question about not wearing the swaztika, yet we can wear MNC's products. Unless, you have no idea... ?

[clownboy]

Well if you looked at "Location" you would know. And seeing as you are from the USA, you SHOULD know where that location is. And it doesn't help, living in the Maritimes where most people are 60 year old white people. The only reason my city has asians, blacks, Latino's is because it's a university city.

Anyways, you're getting off topic about the moral question about not wearing the swaztika, yet we can wear MNC's products. Unless, you have no idea... ?

If you spend much time here, you'd know that the "Location" listed is not always accurate. So you DO live in Canada right? And it WAS you that took this down the "racist" route. So sorry that didn't work out for you.

I answered your "moral question" already. For a more terse reply - there ARE symbols that have come to be commonly reviled. The swastika is one of those. Reality doesn't matter strictly here, it's all about perception. The general perception of the thing defines it in this particular arena.