[Puffer Fish]

NO. If it happens within a marriage there is a far HIGHER level of violation and I already provided you with evidence of that, which you ignored, because it doesn't conform to your idiotic, nonsensical pro-rape argument.

I don't believe you can seriously believe this.

You are just trying to make an argument.

Are you saying that if most women were given the choice, they would choose some other random person to rape her rather than her husband? That sounds absurd. Of course she wouldn't.

[Puffer Fish]

Rape either occurs, or it does not. It's much like murder, in that regard. The person was raped. No grey area exists. There is no "sort of" rape.

Tons of grey area can exist.

This is not really the best example, for obvious reasons, but there are countless situations in the Muslim World that would not be regarded as rape that would be regarded as rape in Western countries. There are situations that would be classified as "rape" in many Western European countries that would not be considered rape in most of the U.S.

Sometimes women can really not be absolutely the most clear in their consent. Sometimes there can be implied consent, or assumed consent, or all sorts of borderline situations of consent, where the man might partially be in the wrong.
Or there might be alcohol involved, where both of them are not really in a position to be giving informed consent.

To really have this full discussion with you, we would need to start a separate thread. But this thread is specifically about sex and consent in marriage (and possibly other long-term committed relationships). Where the woman has already consented to sex before, on numerous occasions, and where they are in a long-term sexual relationship.

The reason why the woman denies consent is also not always totally irrelevant. Even if the man violates sexual boundaries with her, she can be a LOT MORE violated in some situations than others. She might have been perfectly satisfied to have sex with him, except for one trivial reason.

Automatically lumping it all together as rape, and saying the man is just as guilty as another rapist, is absurd.

Some of these situations are a hundred times less bad than a normal rape.

I really think that by you trying to include it into the category of rape, you are trivialising rape, trivialising what it is.

[Godstud]

You are a rape advocate who looks for ways to justify rape. You make convoluted arguments that all come back to your fuck-in-the-head premise that "rape isn't that bad".

Rape is rape. It's as many grey areas as murder.

[Puffer Fish]

You are a rape advocate who looks for ways to justify rape.

I think that's just an ad-hominem attack. I also think that's just in your imagination.

You make convoluted arguments that all come back to your fuck-in-the-head premise that "rape isn't that bad".

I would not say that's true. You are way overgeneralising.

For one thing, keep in mind we are talking about BETWEEN HUSBAND AND WIFE.

I don't support sex between a man and any woman who has not chosen to have sex with him (and has done nothing to choose sex with that specific man).

Rape is rape. It's as many grey areas as murder.

I already explained to you how it is possible for murder to have many grey areas. So now we are just going around in circles.

[Godstud]

I think that's just an ad-hominem attack.

I am insulting you straight out because you are a lying rape advocate. I have also more than responded to your bullshit with actual sources, which something you NEVER produce.

I also think that's just in your imagination.

You are wrong. I am not the first person to point this out.

For one thing, keep in mind we are talking about BETWEEN HUSBAND AND WIFE.

That is irrelevant. Explicit consent means something, even if it is inconvenient for wanna-be spousal rapists.

Marriage does not give consent to sex for every day of the marriage, and not even on the first day.

I don't support sex between a man and any woman who has not chosen to have sex with him (and has done nothing to choose sex with that specific man).

Then STOP DEFENDING SPOUSAL RAPE!

Stop looking for excuses for rape to be less of a crime.

Stop making threads that demonstrate your advocacy for rape.