Ethnic Struggles and Class Theory - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14557753
So, a subject that I've been thinking about a lot lately is ethnic struggles, or post-colonial cultural struggles within developed countries (name it as you wish), and I wish better my understanding of the subject thorough socialist lens. I write this post both to discuss the subject and ask if someone knows of any (preferably Marxist) sources dealing with the matter, so I can both further my knowledge and perhaps translate a few for my peers.

My interest probably grew due to this being one of the hottest subjects within Israel today (at least within my circles), especially after the last elections when the right-wing (which the "Mizrahi" folk, essentially Arabic Jews, are perceived as its prime supporters) got the upper hand, leaving the left wingers (which the "Ashkenazi" folk, essentially European Jews, are perceived as its prime supporters) quite grudged. This public discussion on the matter quickly deteriorated into quite ugly (and racist) lines on behalf of both sides, ranging from cries to stop all support for the (much poorer) peripheral regions as "punishment" to both sarcastic and not-so-sarcastic proposals to create two separate states just for us Jews.

But this discussions also re-hyped the discussion regarding the long cultural and economic oppression of the Mizrahi Jews, and I believe we are witnessing a sort of "Mizrahi Renaissance", which started a long while back but is getting stronger every day, ranging from the revisiting of Arabic roots to creating a rebellious "anti-culture" somewhat reminiscent to similar historical (and contemporary) currents in African-american culture. But enough about Israel.

The matter which I wish to discuss in the connection between the struggle of oppressed ethnic groups to preserve (and recreate) their unique culture and identity and the general class struggle. In many historical cases there might seem to be a contradiction between the two, such in the case above. Namely, ethnic issues are often used to manipulate the working class, obscuring the actual economic issues and even convincing the oppressed workers that Marxism and socialism are "alien", "foreign" and, ultimately, "white". Again, as an example, Israel is classic case as the Labor party, which in some cases (admittedly not all cases) is one of the few parties in Israel to try and defend against the very same neo-liberal forces which are killing the Mizarahi population, is perceived as "white" and defending white interests.

But I feel there is also a revolutionary spark in the ethnic struggle. While the focus on racial and ethnic oppression is somewhat misguided (technically speaking) and the "real" or deeper forces oppressing the working class have nothing to do with race (profit is colorblind), and are purely economic, their manifestations are at many cases ethnically charged (one might even say its part of the system of obscuring the economic reality of capitalism). Cultural hegemony, colonial relations, slums and ghettos, these are all social structures that are present and liberal nations and have a deep connections to the capitalist mode of production, but the "little person" experiences them as ethnic or racial issues. What I'm, trying to say is that ethnic struggle is deeply connected to class struggle and I believe it should therefore be embraced, and from within it a wider, proletarian movement can be built.

Why embrace it? Well, as I see it, the attempt to not only defend but revitalize a local (as in specific, communal) and historical culture, not to mention fuse it with themes of modern oppression, and recreate a local and independent ethnic identity, seems to me like one of the most important rebellious acts in opposition to the globalized culture being sold by the neo-liberal global market. More so, I believe that the required conditions for creating class consciousness can be met exactly by such cultural action: creating organic local culture as a trigger for the growth of strong communal bonds that can evolve into unions and worker parties.

I'd be glad to hear opinions on the matter, or be given additional sources that deal with the connections between ethnic struggle and class consciousness, as I wrote above, if anyone knows of any.
#14557763
Especially in this issue, James Connolly is a giant.

The 1897 Socialism and Nationalism is especially famous and worthwhile.

I think the first foundational keystone to worry about is that whatever movement you have, it is progressive in that it solves the problems of the working class. Too often people that try to mix nationalism and socialism (and this is possible in certain circumstances, as Connolly proved) get bogged down in tradition and fetishization of a past that never existed (or maybe even did). The result is an artistic movement designed to alienate and divide instead of an emancipatory movement designed to liberate and unify.
#14558484
Thanks, he seems interesting. Has a good understanding of political revolutions in general, in addition to those with national flavour.

The Immortal Goon wrote:I think the first foundational keystone to worry about is that whatever movement you have, it is progressive in that it solves the problems of the working class. Too often people that try to mix nationalism and socialism (and this is possible in certain circumstances, as Connolly proved) get bogged down in tradition and fetishization of a past that never existed (or maybe even did). The result is an artistic movement designed to alienate and divide instead of an emancipatory movement designed to liberate and unify.

Those are good points, but I actually am part of a rather 'progressive' socialist movement. Thing is that as the whole ethnic issue of the Mizrahi jews began raising attention, it became obvious that there is much ignorance and hostility to the matter, ranging from claims that any inequality is our own fualt to plain belief that our culture is inferior. I'm trying ethnicize my movement, to make it take a clearer stand in defense of Arabic and peripheral culture rather than joining the detached admiration of Europe.
#14572096
The Awakener wrote:Thing is that as the whole ethnic issue of the Mizrahi jews began raising attention, it became obvious that there is much ignorance and hostility to the matter, ranging from claims that any inequality is our own fualt to plain belief that our culture is inferior. I'm trying ethnicize my movement, to make it take a clearer stand in defense of Arabic and peripheral culture rather than joining the detached admiration of Europe.

It sounds like we can distinguish two strands of your "ethnicized movement": One has a progressive/socialist character, the other has an ethnic character.

How do you see this movement in relation to other movements -- for instance, in relation to i) progressive/socialist movements that are not "ethnicized", and ii) ethnic (Arabic, Mizrahi) movements that are not progressive/socialist?

Can we say that you're working toward two distinct ends, that happen to be related in the current socioeconomic order?
#14572104
Perhaps you could say something about how the "cultural" issue is wound up with the economic issue.

I mean, on the one hand there's cultural attitudes of individuals -- for instance, attitudes among Mizrahis and non-Mizrahis about Mizrahi culture and people, about Ashkenazi culture and people, about Ethiopian, French, Chinese culture and people, and so on. And there are various ways such attitudes are intentionally or unintentionally projected or challenged by the media, the government, the school system, the religious authorities, the advertising agencies, the artists, and so on. I tend to treat all that on the level of culture, value, taste; though of course there are "hard" social consequences and sources of such attitudes in a society.

What about those consequences and sources? I mean -- is it harder for Mizrahis to get a job, a loan, an education, or a home? At points like this, the progressive's egalitarian orientation intersects with concerns about ethnicity.
#14572429
Hey American serf, you should know these boards frown upon double posting, try to avoid doing so in the future. Anyway:

American Serf wrote:How do you see this movement in relation to other movements -- for instance, in relation to i) progressive/socialist movements that are not "ethnicized", and ii) ethnic (Arabic, Mizrahi) movements that are not progressive/socialist?


The point is I see us relating to both, ideally, as they are inevitably part of the same whole.

American Serf wrote:Can we say that you're working toward two distinct ends, that happen to be related in the current socioeconomic order?


I think TIG's guy answered at quite well in regards to Irish nationalism. In short he said that Irish self-determination cannot truly be achieved without socialism, but neither can Irish socialism be achieved without breaking the sovereign ties with Britain (perhaps the latter was my interpretation, but that's how I see it nonetheless). I believe the case is the same for my movement, you can't have one without the other*, as cultural hegemony is a tool capitalism uses to keep the oppressed divided and weak.

American Serf wrote:What about those consequences and sources? I mean -- is it harder for Mizrahis to get a job, a loan, an education, or a home?


As in most cases of ethnic oppression, yes.

American Serf wrote:At points like this, the progressive's egalitarian orientation intersects with concerns about ethnicity.


Indeed, but my point is that that's not all there is to it. Fighting social inequality without addressing ethnic issues might just end up strengthening the cultural hegemony and capitalism with it. A socialist movement, as I see it, must culturally align itself with the oppressed, otherwise it is not only bound to fail in gaining their support but might just be ineffective.

*As a side note: I've heard if more 'white' socialism than, say, black (or any other oppressed) capitalism, so perhaps it is the socialist movements that need to do a more thorough introspection.
#14572902
The Awakener wrote:Indeed, but my point is that that's not all there is to it. Fighting social inequality without addressing ethnic issues might just end up strengthening the cultural hegemony and capitalism with it. A socialist movement, as I see it, must culturally align itself with the oppressed, otherwise it is not only bound to fail in gaining their support but might just be ineffective.
I agree, pursuing social justice must involve addressing such ethnic issues wherever they persist.

However, in some societies you'll find households that belong both to the wealthy class (the dominant, not an oppressed, economic class) and to a marginalized ethnic minority (an oppressed, not the dominant, ethnic class). So who is "oppressed" -- the working class, the proletariat, yes; and this includes an ethnic dimension that must be addressed. But what about rich people who belong to an "oppressed ethnic minority"? I'm not sure there's a definitive answer to such questions; it's a nuanced issue; opinions will vary, and so will the details of context.

In any case, we might agree that social justice will not be achieved so long as it is not achieved along ethnic lines, so long as such lines endure. As a practical concern, it's probably safest to say that the extent to which the reformer should focus on the ethnic dimension in pursuing social justice for all, must vary along with the context.


The Awakener wrote:*As a side note: I've heard if more 'white' socialism than, say, black (or any other oppressed) capitalism, so perhaps it is the socialist movements that need to do a more thorough introspection.
I'm not sure about this comparison. Consider: A quick online search for the number of black millionaires in the US turned up figures ranging from 35,000 to perhaps over 800,000, though most hits I saw cited a single article that had the figure at 109,000 households. By comparison, there are only 1,500 US voters (of any flavor) registered with the Socialist Party, according to that party's Wikipedia page. Of course that's just a couple numbers -- but arguably a meaningful comparison. If anyone has good sources on this data, please note them here.
#14573015
Awakener wrote:I think TIG's guy answered at quite well in regards to Irish nationalism. In short he said that Irish self-determination cannot truly be achieved without socialism, but neither can Irish socialism be achieved without breaking the sovereign ties with Britain (perhaps the latter was my interpretation, but that's how I see it nonetheless). I believe the case is the same for my movement, you can't have one without the other*, as cultural hegemony is a tool capitalism uses to keep the oppressed divided and weak.


I think that this is about right.

There's a whole group of theories around this concept, but generally speaking, the idea is that capitalism is a global system. Without overturning the economics in your country, you become like any number of places open for sweatshops and exploitation. Capitalism will win, even if you have your own flags up.

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