[clownboy]

And you SpiderMonkey took everything I said fully out of context. What you quoted were direct responses to assertions QatzelOk made.

He asserted their was a "right" to marry, I showed there was not.

He asserted that one of our States believed in the majority in homosexual marriage, I showed that was not the case.

These were not an "appeal to tradition" but statements of fact. Does it HAVE to stay that way, no - but most of us here in the US think it should.

[Brooklyn-Mecca]

This is not about comparing pedophelia or beastiality to homosexuality. Its about changing the definitions of long held traditions. .

Interesting that you apparently have not considered the points I made.

The "long-held traditions" that you mention also include a white wedding gown symbolizing virginity. Like I proposed, why don't we make non-virgin females wear black wedding gowns to symbolize their "impurity"? I mean, we can't break traditions, can we?!



Judaism and Christianity re-defined marriage...why can't we continue adding our own changes to it to "get with the times"?

[QatzelOk]

Judaism and Christianity re-defined marriage...why can't we continue adding our own changes to it to "get with the times"?

Brook/Mec, I hear your lament loud and clear. But I think the answer is that American society is not cutting edge like it used to be after WW2.
The metric system, social medicine, marijuana liberalization, gay marriage, church and state separation... In how many other ways does America lag behind the rest of the developed world? And the worst part is, your nation is constantly forcing other [poorer more helpless] countries into the same backwards social situation by using its money as a carrot and its DU as a stick.

[Warrior Monk]

Homosexuality is abomination in the eyes of the Lord God.

Any civilization that tolerates this Satanic and evil behavior wil be destroyed by the Lord (e.g. Sodom, Gomorrah, Athens, Rome).

AIDS is a Biblical plague.

[QatzelOk]

And the Metric system? What part of Deutoronomy or Numbers cautions the holy against the abomination that is the International decimal system?

[Warrior Monk]

I have a question for Bible-haters, God-haters, and Anti-Christian racists.

Do you support incestual marriages, bestial marriages, and necrophiliac marriages?

[clownboy]

And the Metric system? What part of Deutoronomy or Numbers cautions the holy against the abomination that is the International decimal system?

Nothing of course. However, as the world's largest customer we get to measure however we wish. If the rest of the world wants to sell us stuff (and they do) they will do so in terms the customer (us) understands. Any business person worth their salt will convert cms to inches on packaging when selling to Americans.

[QatzelOk]

Clownboy, that works both ways. If you want to sell your Oreo Lites in the rest of the world, you have to package in metric [grams]. But the rest of the world switched years ago [Canada, 1972]. Why is America so far behind?

[clownboy]

Clownboy, that works both ways. If you want to sell your Oreo Lites in the rest of the world, you have to package in metric [grams]. But the rest of the world switched years ago [Canada, 1972]. Why is America so far behind?

Yep, and we do. As for why we didn't switch locally back in the 70s - we tried it, the people resoundingly rejected the move (even when it was semi-forced upon them). We decided NOT to make the move. It's not a matter of "being behind" or ahead - it's about preference. We are comfortable with our system and see no good reason to change.

[Todd D.]

Homosexuality is abomination in the eyes of the Lord God.

Any civilization that tolerates this Satanic and evil behavior wil be destroyed by the Lord (e.g. Sodom, Gomorrah, Athens, Rome).

AIDS is a Biblical plague.

Please. AIDS is not a homosexual disease. You will be the first person to point out that nobody is born homosexual, and that is a preference, so as such there can be no biological difference between gays and straights. If that is the case, then how can AIDS be a homosexual disease?

What you fail to understand is that the legalization of homosexual marraige does not in any way force the practice on to anybody. Drinking is legal, but is considered by some to be a sin, as is premarital sex. Legality does not equal morality, and I think that it's time people get to realizing that it is not the government's job to pick what is morally right and wrong for people.

[QatzelOk]

Todd, for once I agree with you sort of. Except this:

I think that it's time people get to realizing that it is not the government's job to pick what is morally right and wrong for people.

But it is the government's duty to make the laws of the land, and to ensure that they are fair, and respect the constitution of the country in which they are made. This sometimes means going against the will of the majority. Even if a majority of Floridians support a return to slavery [unlikely this close to an election] the constitution would not allow it. Likewise, even if a majority of Canadians aren't ready for gay marriage - too bad, so sad. Our contitution's Charter of Rights and Freedoms seems to guarantee gays the same rights as born-again Christians. [The Canadian Constitution: Since 1982. doing more...]

[Todd D.]

I would agree that it is the governments job to create the law of the land, but I think that your slavery example is goofy, because it is not a moral choice, but a coersive one. Slavery infringes upon the rights of others, namely the minority.

Moral choices that I am talking about are the ones that effect nobody except people consenting to the activities that are being partaken, in this case homosexual marraiges.

[Monkey Angst]

Homosexuality is abomination in the eyes of the Lord God.

Hmmm... <thinks> Nah. It isn't.

[QatzelOk]

I think that your slavery example is goofy, because it is not a moral choice, but a coersive one. Slavery infringes upon the rights of others, namely the minority.

Moral choices that I am talking about are the ones that effect nobody except people consenting to the activities that are being partaken, in this case homosexual marraiges.

I would compare slavery to the lack of marriage rights of gay couples. Both slavery and denying gays rights have been defended using selective bible quotes. Blacks are a minority here, so are gays. The majority can always, especially in times of duress, try to venalize a minority. But a good constitution can mediate this popular superstitious reactionary scapegoating before it has a chance to poison civil society.
And the Florida example was a 'What if?" just to demonstrate how the constitution takes precedence over whatever popular prejudices are rampant at the time.

[Todd D.]

Ok, I can agree with that, since I do think that Gay Marraige is at least partially comparable to slavery, though obviously no where near the degree.

[Monkey Angst]

Ok, I can agree with that, since I do think that Gay Marraige is at least partially comparable to slavery, though obviously no where near the degree.

Hell, I think all marriage is comparable to slavery...

[Todd D.]

Heh, you may have a point there.

[Brooklyn-Mecca]

...Anti-Christian racists.

Anti-Christians are racists?