[annatar1914]

What Fasces pointed out to you is not a "whataboutism" in any way. If you 're going to call this election 'fraudulent' then obviously you should look at how the current ruling government under Trump & the Republicans refused to improve election security. Trump has been working to undermine these elections for some time now and everything that is being said follows the same thread of him and his followers undermining US institutions in an attempt to fraudulently stay in power even when the situation has become utterly desperate and miserable.

Seems that President Trump did sign an executive order in 2018 making the integrity of the 2020 election from foreign and domestic fraud a matter of national security. I haven't read it, and there's probably provisions in it that are classified, but still...

Everything you're saying assumes ''a priori'' that ''Trump has been working to undermine the elections'', instead of his enemies, and so forth. That situation rather makes a court case before the Supreme Court even more necessary, in my opinion. Have them look at all the evidence, and have these legal minds draw their own conclusions.

[noemon]

I'm sure if evidence are brought the US courts will examine them. Doesn't seem to be the case with any of them.

[SpecialOlympian]

Trump has been undermining the election for the past year by saying that mail-in ballots are fraudulent. For a guy who claims to not support Trump you sure go out of your way to assume everything he says is gospel and ignore his glaring and obvious faults. How is telling his base for months that the vote will be rigged for months not undermining the election?

[pugsville]

@pugsville ,
Being a traditional Monarchist and a Socialist, believe me I don't.

The is a contradiction. How do you square that circile.

@pugsville ,
That's where you're absolutely wrong, very wrong. They very reasonably want good jobs with decent pay and medical care. They want good schools for their kids that don't teach political ideology but an education that will enable those children to thrive in the future. They want support for families and they want law and order in the streets. They want religious freedom and freedom of speech and the rest of their God-ordained rights. They want out of foreign entanglements and imperialistic wars that only serve the cosmopolitan elites.

I was referring to the who insist the election was "stolen", element of the Trump./Republican party and their media allies. They manifiestiny do not want most of those things.

That list looks like socialism.

@pugsville
A lot of what they want is extremely reasonable, and President Trump promised he'd fight for those things if elected, and re-elected.

Trump promised a lot of things. He was uninteresrted in doing most of those things you listed. He was afterall a massive lair.

@pugsville
See above.

[annatar1914]

@pugsville

The is a contradiction.

It really isn't. George Orwell was a Monarchist and a Socialist, for example. And the Russian Emigre ''Mladorossi'' group were famous for it in the 1920's and 30's, their slogan was ''Tsar and the Soviets!''

How do you square that circile.

Easily actually.

I was referring to the who insist the election was "stolen", element of the Trump./Republican party and their media allies. They manifiestiny do not want most of those things.

There is a tension obviously between Trump voters who are Nationalist/Populist voters and the GOP Conservative establishment. Really it's two parties in one, with little overlap.

That list looks like socialism.

Interesting, isn't it? But it's mainly things traditionalists and working people have wanted for centuries.

Trump promised a lot of things. He was uninteresrted in doing most of those things you listed. He was afterall a massive lair.

Which is why a significant portion of that same demographic I mentioned didn't vote for him in 2020.

[annatar1914]

@SpecialOlympian ;

Trump has been undermining the election for the past year by saying that mail-in ballots are fraudulent.

Could be a reason why he hurt his own re-election efforts, possibly.

For a guy who claims to not support Trump you sure go out of your way to assume everything he says is gospel and ignore his glaring and obvious faults.

No, not at all.

How is telling his base for months that the vote will be rigged for months not undermining the election?

One has two options when thinking about what he's been saying for months, if not years;

1. Trump is wrong and simply wants to justify his loss by saying he didn't really lose but was unfairly cheated out of a second term. Or;

2. 2020 really was a rigged election and he was right all along, that he would not be allowed by the powers that be to win re-election in 2020 without a major legal struggle.

Considering the loathing President Trump generates among so many people, it's not strange to think that #2 could be a possibility for those who think Trump is a ''Hitler'' figure who cannot be allowed to remain President, and who are themselves in the government and could do something about it.

I personally think he lost the election fair and square, on his own faults, and that the election was really his to win or lose (but he lost it because of his own personal flaws and mistakes, against an opponent he could have easily beat at one point this past year). But again, knowing the hatred some have for him and for his voters, I think #2 is a possibility.

[annatar1914]

I'm sure if evidence are brought the US courts will examine them. Doesn't seem to be the case with any of them.

So far, perhaps. But this isn't over, not yet.

[JohnRawls]

You don't live here so I will help you. This isn't happening. You're right that I don't think Bernie is perfect, but Biden was by far the worst candidate the dems had. He's a racist, sexist, warmongering segregationist who loves austerity and the drug war. He's going to do nothing for 4 years and blame McConnell's intransigence and then we'll have a red wave in 22' and president Tucker Carlson in 24. I would be very happy with some simple social democracy so I'm not a complete purist, but based on who he'e floating for cabinet positions we are going to be pillaged by tech vampires until everything has been stripped from us.

Why is he a racist, sexist and warmongering segregationist? Those are some big claims.

[Red_Army]

Why is he a racist, sexist and warmongering segregationist? Those are some big claims.

He was against integrating schools and eulogized Strom Thurmond. He personally wrote the racist crime bill that is responsible for thousands of black people being incarcerated. He has been accused of rape and his handling of the Anita Hill case was reprehensible and sexist. He voted for the Iraq war, supported a repressive coup in Honduras and spent a huge amount of airtime in the campaign erroneously focusing on how Trump was "soft" on China, Iran, and Venezuela.

Trump and Kamala brought up some of this, but maybe you don't remember?

[JohnRawls]

He was against integrating schools and eulogized Strom Thurmond. He personally wrote the racist crime bill that is responsible for thousands of black people being incarcerated. He has been accused of rape and his handling of the Anita Hill case was reprehensible and sexist. He voted for the Iraq war, supported a repressive coup in Honduras and spent a huge amount of airtime in the campaign erroneously focusing on how Trump was "soft" on China, Iran, and Venezuela.

Trump and Kamala brought up some of this, but maybe you don't remember?

Being accused of "rape" or the "pedo" Biden memes are just Trumps camp crazy propaganda. I am not sure how people can eat this up that easily.

The bill against crime does not make him a racist nor is the bill racist itself. Although I didn't read the bill, i am pretty sure it has nothing saying that arresting african americans should be prioritised. Again, this is your perception stemming from a different issue.

Regarding war, fair enough he is hawkish.

Regarding compromising with segregationists, well, the Democratic party was a different beast that long ago. Most people seem to forget that. Although I laugh at your suggestion that Biden, a VP to a black President, is some kind of anti-black racist or segregationist right now.

[Red_Army]

Being accused of "rape" or the "pedo" Biden memes are just Trumps camp crazy propaganda. I am not sure how people can eat this up that easily.

Tara Reade's allegations predate that shit and have nothing to do with it.

The bill against crime does not make him a racist nor is the bill racist itself. Although I didn't read the bill, i am pretty sure it has nothing saying that arresting african americans should be prioritised. Again, this is your perception stemming from a different issue.

I'm sure all of the black and brown people who were unjustly arrested and imprisoned for years and all the families that these incarcerations destroyed find this distinction very important

Although I laugh at your suggestion that Biden, a VP to a black President, is some kind of anti-black racist or segregationist right now.

As I said before Kamala brought this up herself in a debate... I'm not claiming he's still a segregationist, but that he's been on the wrong side of history for his entire career and that is all the information to go on. Your "gut" instincts about him not being a piece of shit because of PR optics are significantly less valid than his record as a senator and VP.

[Doug64]

Well I don't have a scanner and I never needed a copy of my ID to vote by mail, only to open bank accounts. Nobody here ever questioned the process. At this point you're just obsessed with finding fraud everywhere.

Imagine that, you need a copy of your ID to open a bank account but not to vote! And after this clusterfuck of an election, you can bet there a going to be a whole lot of people questioning the process for mail-in votes. As I said, Georgia is already the opening salvo, it won't be the last.

A case that is “dismissed with prejudice” is completely and permanently over.

A case dismissed with prejudice cannot be retried in another lawsuit, but the decision itself can be appealed.

In any sane society, Obama would indeed be regarded as one of the most respected and popular politicians in the world. America is, however, not such a society. Anyone from the "Obama team" is therefore not going to be able to "unite the country", through no fault of their own.

The Obama whose administration did everything they could set Trump up for destruction before he was even sworn in? That Obama? Biden, the vice-president that suggested the Logan Act be used against Flynn when Flynn was simply doing his job as an incoming member of the next administration? That Biden?

I made no mention of photo IDs. What does that have to do with you wanting to live in a 1 party state?

You lie. Point to any post where I've said I want to live in a one party state. If anything, the ones demonstrating the desire for a one party state are the ones throwing around such labels as "facist" and "Nazis" and "Hitler" and "krystallnacht" and making comparisons between Republicans and the Germans of 1930, all seeking to demonize and so delegitimize their opponents. Especially, it's those trying to silence and deplatform anyone that disagrees with them rather than meeting them in open debate.

Being accused of "rape" or the "pedo" Biden memes are just Trumps camp crazy propaganda. I am not sure how people can eat this up that easily.

Like the Left bought into the Kavanaugh accusations? In the case of Reade, her accusation is better attested than Dr. Ford's ever were.

[SpecialOlympian]

Considering the loathing President Trump generates among so many people, it's not strange to think that #2 could be a possibility for those who think Trump is a ''Hitler'' figure who cannot be allowed to remain President, and who are themselves in the government and could do something about it.

I personally think he lost the election fair and square, on his own faults, and that the election was really his to win or lose (but he lost it because of his own personal flaws and mistakes, against an opponent he could have easily beat at one point this past year). But again, knowing the hatred some have for him and for his voters, I think #2 is a possibility.

OK well I don't know why you're trying to occupy both positions at once given that the Trump legal team has tried, and failed, to prove the vote was fraudulent 30+ times now. If they had evidence they had plenty of chances to show it.

[jimjam]

Obese Donald's infamous unpredictability has become nauseatingly predictable. Guess what kids?

trump lost the election! and ……. losing is what losers do.

[Godstud]

The SCOTUS will not see anything. The "lawsuits" will not meet the basic requirements for any sort of trial because there is no evidence to support them. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a complete fool.


@annatar1914 You might claim objectivity, but you've been backing Trump's horse for some time now, so it comes across as being a bit... flimsy.

[JohnRawls]

Trump is doing the best thing he can do to sink the republican party in the senate runoffs. Loeffler a Trump die hard supporter and Perdue who is a hostage and supporter of "electoral fraud in Gerogia" are in shock and panic right now. If they aren't then they should be.

[Fasces]

The SCOTUS will not see anything. The "lawsuits" will not meet the basic requirements for any sort of trial because there is no evidence to support them. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a complete fool.

You might claim objectivity, but you've been backing Trump's horse for some time now, so it comes across as being a bit... flimsy.

The card says "Moops".

[JohnRawls]

@Doug64 You do understand that this is a regular excuse: The other side used baseless claims so now we are gonna do it 10 fold. Sure thing, lie all you want.

[Politics_Observer]

@JohnRawls

Trump is doing the best thing he can do to sink the republican party in the senate runoffs. Loeffler a Trump die hard supporter and Perdue who is a hostage and supporter of "electoral fraud in Gerogia" are in shock and panic right now. If they aren't then they should be.

I know I will be voting for those who are running against Loeffler and Perdue. However, Loeffler and Perdue have a good chance of winning their elections. I put my absentee ballot in the mail tomorrow morning for the mail man to pick up with my votes for Warnock and Ossoff (if you don't already know, these are the two running against Loeffler and Perdue).

[JohnRawls]

@JohnRawls



I know I will be voting for those who are running against Loeffler and Perdue. However, Loeffler and Perdue have a good chance of winning their elections. I put my absentee ballot in the mail tomorrow morning for the mail man to pick up with my votes for Warnock and Ossoff (if you don't already know, these are the two running against Loeffler and Perdue).

I do. The polls tell a story of 2 50/50s. Which means that Democrats have 25% chance to take the senate. Although that implies that nothing will change and Trump with the current baseless accusation will not hurt both of the Republican candidates. Obviously Trumps rant is going to have a bad impact on both the Republican candidates who are either Trump die hards or vocal supporters of his accusations. Democrat candidates should be able to capitalise on this.