[jimjam]

You are regurgitating grade school level arguments

These people are finished products right off of the Rush/Sean production line. They think in sound bites and sound just like their R/S mentors. Easy to recognize. There is no point in attempting to engage them in an intelligent give and take other than out of curiosity if you are bored. I'll bet you 50 cents that this guy gets his instructions a few times a week from the Rush/Sean axis as to the latest liberal conspiracies and which liberals to hate today. Hats off to Rush and Sean. They are remarkably effective. I think Rush gets a cool $1,000,000 per week for his work.

[mikema63]

Jared Kushner and Russia’s ambassador to Washington discussed the possibility of setting up a secret and secure communications channel between Trump’s transition team and the Kremlin, using Russian diplomatic facilities in an apparent move to shield their pre-inauguration discussions from monitoring, according to U.S. officials briefed on intelligence reports.

Ambassador Sergey Kislyak reported to his superiors in Moscow that Kushner, son-in-law and confidant to then-President-elect Trump, made the proposal during a meeting on Dec. 1 or 2 at Trump Tower, according to intercepts of Russian communications that were reviewed by U.S. officials. Kislyak said Kushner suggested using Russian diplomatic facilities in the United States for the communications.

www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/world/na ... story.html

Well well...

[Drlee]

Not good. So Flynn and Kushner will face the music.

This is getting really bizarre. I wonder if they can keep Pence out of this mess. He was right in the middle of the Flynn debacle.

I have no sympathy for Flynn. He was a victim of the arrogance of rank. I have seen it so many times.

[quetzalcoatl]

I simply cannot fathom this. It goes beyond mere stupidity. Could Kushner be so dense he never realized that Kislyak comm would be monitored 24/7?

If Kushner did in fact discuss setting up a secure comm channel in the freaking Russian embassy, with the intent of evading US government surveillance, this is end for the Trump administration. There is no way to sugarcoat this. Trump could possibly ditch Flynn, but there's no plausible way to throw Kushner under the bus.

The only avenue left is to simply deny this discussion ever happened, and to hope the FBI can't conclusively prove they are lying. The most optimistic outcome is that Flynn and Kushner avoid prison time, but that is looking less and less likely.

The Post said Kushner suggested the use of Russian diplomatic facilities as a way to shield pre-inauguration discussions with Kislyak from monitoring. Kislyak allegedly then relayed the suggestion to his superiors in Moscow. The idea was supposedly broached during a meeting between Kushner and Kislyak during an early December meeting at Trump Tower.

That was based on intercepts of Russian communications that were reviewed by U.S. officials, although neither the meeting nor the communications of the Americans involved were under U.S. surveillance, officials told the Post.

Michael Flynn, President Trump’s former National Security Adviser, also attended the meeting.

Fox News

At least Hillary didn't ask the Russians to host her damn email server. WTF. Just WTF.

[Drlee]

Trump will pardon both of them.

This is beyond stupidity. One could conclude that Kushner is a spoiled rich kid with no experience and not to smart to start with but Flynn is a professional who ran an intelligence agency. At this point I do not think that treason is to strong a word.

I think it is the end. Even the dumb shits in the hinterlands can understand this is beyond unacceptable.

[stephen50right]

You don't believe in our constitution. I could point to several modern conservative positions that are unconstitutional.



Oh I get it. You mean like the freedom of gay people to marry whomever they want. The justice of knowing that the police will not unconstitutionally detain, search and discriminate against people because of skin color and the liberty to live your life without the police viewing your online records.



When are you going to display some maturity? This simple slam only works on people of very low intelligence.



I am glad you are proud of this. Your side elected him just in time for him to stand criminal charges.

No son. Here is the deal. We real conservatives know what your side is all about. The constitution has nothing to do with it. You have been duped.

So what do real libertarian conservatives believe?

They believe in balanced budgets. Trump just proposed a budget that will cause the deficit to skyrocket. They believe in keeping the government out of other people's bedrooms. Trump wants to make it legal for people to discriminate against others under the pretense of religion. And while we are on the subject, the true conservative believes in religious freedom based upon the strict separation of church and state. Trump wants to put pulpits in the political fray.

You are not a conservative. It is probably because you have not educated yourself on what conservatism really is. You are regurgitating grade school level arguments.

Many, if not most people on POFO are very smart and pretty well educated. You should be prepared to present arguments for your positions unless you merely wish to troll. You have yet to do that. Here is what you should do. Start with an easy question. Tell us how the median income American worker (who by the way earns less than $30K per year, should embrace the republican health care plan. Now remember that some of us have advanced degrees and are quite familiar with doing research so be sure to present your evidence. I want to know how those America workers are better off.

You won't do any of this. You are incapable. You lack either the education or motivation to do it.

I reiterate my earlier complaint. There is not a single conservative presenting here who is capable of defending Trump's budget or his health care "plan". That is a direct indicator of the intellectual bankruptcy the Republican Party is experiencing.

Well your rambling post is proof that a broken clock is right twice a day.

Yes, there are similarities between conservatives and libertarians. But it can be said that libertarians are conservatives who have suffered brain damage thru extensive use of illegal drugs. That does have merit as virtually every libertarian out there loves getting stoned on the wacky weed and high on other mind altering substances.

The bottom line is being a libertarian is a belief in a fantasy world that will never exist in the real world, unless you go off and live in a cave somewhere. You might like that. You'd get to curse and scream at the wild animals, and they can also be your new friends, sharing in your libertarian beliefs as you patiently grow a new cannabis crop for yourself to enjoy.

Send us your cave address when you're settled in, and we'll send you a postcard. The squirrels will deliver the mail to you, the crows if it's sent airmail.

Meanwhile, as a conservative in the real world, I'll sit back and enjoy President Trump doing a wonderful job, and looking forward to gaining more congressional seats in the 2018 midterms to further the Republican Party agenda.

[jimjam]

Let us not forget the "trump budget" in addressing the Republican Quagmire. This "budget" apparently has a $2,000,000,000,000 math error (or was that a $4,000,000,000,000 error ). Apparently the over used magic of trickle down economics somehow fits into this mess (maybe) to make everything .......... just fine . Here is the sad sack, Mick (ey ) Mulvaney, who is the fall guy for Trump's wishful thinking and incompetence:


Mathematically challenged^

White House budget director Mick Mulvaney told a Senate committee that the administration’s tax plan doesn’t bank on any revenue stemming from faster economic growth. Four floors below that hearing, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin gave a contradictory answer to a different Senate panel, insisting that the administration’s tax plan will partly pay for itself with economic growth.

I don't think we have ever seen gross incompetence of this magnitude. Proof that management flows from the top down.

[Drlee]

I see that Stephen50right is in way over his head. He is left with only insults. He is incapable of defending the current Republican mess. No facts. No argument.

Typical. No doubt he is a genius in Georgia.

[MememyselfandIJK]

@Drlee reply back with insults makes you look as bad as him. Don't swoop to his level -- answer with cool calm logic. I got this one.

The bottom line is being a libertarian is a belief in a fantasy world that will never exist in the real world...

Libertarianism, Communism, and so many other ideologues are impossible to fulfill due to the imperialistic meddling of the US. Face it -- a better world becomes much closer if we disarm the United States and kick it off of its special little podium of power. Until then, whenever a third world country institutes democracy, communism, whatever, and their new system looks the slightest bit promising, the US overthrows the system, smacks on an embrago -- whatever.

...unless you go off and live in a cave somewhere. You might like that. You'd get to curse and scream at the wild animals, and they can also be your new friends, sharing in your libertarian beliefs as you patiently grow a new cannabis crop for yourself to enjoy. Send us your cave address when you're settled in, and we'll send you a postcard. The squirrels will deliver the mail to you, the crows if it's sent airmail.

Libertarianism is hardly synonymous with anarcho-primitivism. Moreover, American Capitalist Authoritarianism is destroying the environment at an unprecedented rate -- even China emits far less than we do and at least they are doing something about it. In fact, much of the socialist community is rebranding themselves as an effective way to halt climate change. But of course, you don't "believe" in that (not that there is anything to believe in), so I will just move on.

Meanwhile, as a conservative in the real world, I'll sit back and enjoy President Trump doing a wonderful job,

This has got to be sarcasm. Trump's presidency so far is a complete flop. He has got nothing positive accomplished (unless you consider the stripping of million of regular Americans of healthcare, the propagation of multiple conspiracies, two attempts at a discriminatory travel ban, and, my personal favorite, the birth of "alternate facts" as positives). This is the most Orwellian presidency since parliament tried to mess with our tax code. At this rate, the American second Empire will lag far behind the rest of the world (Oh, have I mentioned the defunding of the sciences and the rest of his tax code in general?) and will see a decline in a way that quite resembles Spain. Oh, and if we do finally break apart, the blue states will refuse to subsidize the red states. Have fun living in capitalist-induced poverty.

and looking forward to gaining more congressional seats in the 2018 midterms to further the Republican Party agenda.

2018 is going to be a massacre, but democrats won't be the victims. Republicans are loosing their grip on previously safe states. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if another socialist (democratic socialist, but it is better than nothing) or two got into congress after Sanders' highly popular movement or a scientist-turned-politician did the same -- In fact either situation could be quite a pleasant recovery and regrowth after 4 years of Trump (if he and Pence even last that long).

[jimjam]

I see that Stephen50right is in way over his head. He is left with only insults. He is incapable of defending the current Republican mess. No facts. No argument.

Typical. No doubt he is a genius in Georgia.

Wow! Good to see that you are still with us after that brutal take down from Stevie The Hammer. I thought for sure that you were cowering beneath the dining room table nursing your wounds with dose after dose of wacky weed.

Seriously, the guy is an interesting specimen. An obvious graduate with honors from the Fox Fake News Hate A Liberal regimen.


His Master's Voice ^..................

[stephen50right]

@Drlee reply back with insults makes you look as bad as him. Don't swoop to his level -- answer with cool calm logic. I got this one.



Libertarianism, Communism, and so many other ideologues are impossible to fulfill due to the imperialistic meddling of the US. Face it -- a better world becomes much closer if we disarm the United States and kick it off of its special little podium of power. Until then, whenever a third world country institutes democracy, communism, whatever, and their new system looks the slightest bit promising, the US overthrows the system, smacks on an embrago -- whatever.


Libertarianism is hardly synonymous with anarcho-primitivism. Moreover, American Capitalist Authoritarianism is destroying the environment at an unprecedented rate -- even China emits far less than we do and at least they are doing something about it. In fact, much of the socialist community is rebranding themselves as an effective way to halt climate change. But of course, you don't "believe" in that (not that there is anything to believe in), so I will just move on.


This has got to be sarcasm. Trump's presidency so far is a complete flop. He has got nothing positive accomplished (unless you consider the stripping of million of regular Americans of healthcare, the propagation of multiple conspiracies, two attempts at a discriminatory travel ban, and, my personal favorite, the birth of "alternate facts" as positives). This is the most Orwellian presidency since parliament tried to mess with our tax code. At this rate, the American second Empire will lag far behind the rest of the world (Oh, have I mentioned the defunding of the sciences and the rest of his tax code in general?) and will see a decline in a way that quite resembles Spain. Oh, and if we do finally break apart, the blue states will refuse to subsidize the red states. Have fun living in capitalist-induced poverty.


2018 is going to be a massacre, but democrats won't be the victims. Republicans are loosing their grip on previously safe states. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if another socialist (democratic socialist, but it is better than nothing) or two got into congress after Sanders' highly popular movement or a scientist-turned-politician did the same -- In fact either situation could be quite a pleasant recovery and regrowth after 4 years of Trump (if he and Pence even last that long).

<<< I got this one. >>>

Yea, whatever you "got" I wouldn't want to catch it.

Drlee should be worried that you as a communist likes what he says, as he professes to be a conservative.

Frankly, I am glad that you disagree with everything I say, because I find communism to be absolutely repulsive...a tyrannical form of government that historically has been oppressive and subversive towards its people. Unacceptable to me, and everyone else who cherishes freedom and liberty.

You go right ahead and continue to rail on about President Trump - that's one way my side knows he is doing a great job. If you start liking what Trump does, then we will know that Trump is in trouble, but that just ain't gonna happen.

[MememyselfandIJK]

Frankly, I am glad that you disagree with everything I say, because I find communism to be absolutely repulsive...a tyrannical form of government that historically has been oppressive and subversive towards its people. Unacceptable to me, and everyone else who cherishes freedom and liberty.

How can you cherish freedom and liberty if you support a president who attacks Muslims, Trans, Mexicans, and Women? Doesn't sound like freedom or liberty to me. And I apologize for being oppressive if I refuse people the right to lose health insurance, starve to death, or exploit others in the name of capitalism. Look up the classical definition of liberty and you will know exactly what I am talking about.

You go right ahead and continue to rail on about President Trump - that's one way my side knows he is doing a great job. If you start liking what Trump does, then we will know that Trump is in trouble, but that just ain't gonna happen.

In that case "Wow Trump is such a great guy. Lets have fascism, run away capitalism, religious hypocritism, and best of all, opression" /s
In all seriousness, what has Trump done for you? He has done nothing but turn America into a banana republic.

Drlee should be worried that you as a communist likes what he says, as he professes to be a conservative.

That doesn't mean that we can't agree that Trump's budget is a joke.

[stephen50right]

How can you cherish freedom and liberty if you support a president who attacks Muslims, Trans, Mexicans, and Women? Doesn't sound like freedom or liberty to me. And I apologize for being oppressive if I refuse people the right to lose health insurance, starve to death, or exploit others in the name of capitalism. Look up the classical definition of liberty and you will know exactly what I am talking about.


In that case "Wow Trump is such a great guy. Lets have fascism, run away capitalism, religious hypocritism, and best of all, opression" /s
In all seriousness, what has Trump done for you? He has done nothing but turn America into a banana republic.

That doesn't mean that we can't agree that Trump's budget is a joke.

You can spin Trump's policies and record any which way you like. As you are a communist, we all fully expect you to do precisely that.

In any event, Trump supporting and upholding the US Constitution, something Barry boy rarely did, is a good foundation for Trump's presidency right now...and that's what Trump is building on.

[Drlee]

Drlee should be worried that you as a communist likes what he says, as he professes to be a conservative.

Why would we not agree. It is a joke. What is scary is that you, an avowed conservative, do not agree.

Communists are not something to be feared. They do not threaten you or I. There is no danger that the US will "turn into" a communist country. That does not for a moment mean that an American conservative could not share beliefs with a communist.

Government health care is a good example. The US, Turkey and Mexico of the OECD nations do not have it. The rest do. Is it your assertion that the UK is a communist nation?

Equal pay for equal work is my idea of a value I share with many socialists and communists. Trump disagrees. Who is right?

How about a real argument Steve. We are still waiting.

And I see you have gone back to your racist "Barry boy" stuff. Racism is a sure sign of a very low IQ.

[jimjam]

In that case "Wow Trump is such a great guy. Lets have fascism, run away capitalism, religious hypocritism, and best of all, opression" /sIn all seriousness, what has Trump done for you? He has done nothing but turn America into a banana republic.

Certainly trump's lies, failures and scandals are piling up at an astonishing rate but I remain an optimist. Let's conjecture that trump eats one Whopper too many and drops dead of heart complications. Death by Whopper. President Pence ? Trump at least manages through sheer chaos and incompetence to block the Republicans from their usual task of making the rich richer at the expense of the poor, sick and elderly. Witness Mitch McConnell's request for "less drama".

[MememyselfandIJK]

Certainly trump's lies, failures and scandals are piling up at an astonishing rate but I remain an optimist. Let's conjecture that trump eats one Whopper too many and drops dead of heart complications. Death by Whopper. President Pence ? Trump at least manages through sheer chaos and incompetence to block the Republicans from their usual task of making the rich richer at the expense of the poor, sick and elderly. Witness Mitch McConnell's request for "less drama".

You certainly do bring up a good point my friend. Pence would probably be way worse.

You can spin Trump's policies and record any which way you like. As you are a communist, we all fully expect you to do precisely that.

Trump's policies are terrible no spin needed. However, this is what @Drlee was talking about. You can't attack the people, you have to debate ideologies.

[Stormsmith]

You can spin Trump's policies and record any which way you like. As you are a communist, we all fully expect you to do precisely that.

In any event, Trump supporting and upholding the US Constitution, something Barry boy rarely did, is a good foundation for Trump's presidency right now...and that's what Trump is building on.

How about writing an argument. Doesn't have to be an essay, two premises and a conclusion will do. Just show us you're capable.

[stephen50right]

How about writing an argument. Doesn't have to be an essay, two premises and a conclusion will do. Just show us you're capable.

<<< Why on earth would we, the union workers give up our rights? Follow the money. Who benefits from union-busting? Business. Who supports business? Politicians who want money from Business. >>>

Here's a premise for ya. Union workers in the private sector voted for Donald Trump in droves, and the turnout will be even greater for Trump in 2020.

Conclusion - no coming Republican quagmire. Blue skies ahead for my side and I'm lovin' it.

[MememyselfandIJK]

How about writing an argument. Doesn't have to be an essay, two premises and a conclusion will do. Just show us you're capable.

@stephen50right If I was a teacher grading that I would give you an F.

Blue skies ahead for my side and I'm lovin' it.

Nothing quite like the calm before the storm of 2018.

[Stormsmith]

Valid premises can't allude to the future. Try again.