[Bulaba Khan Jones]

We know we have reached the bottom of the barrel when there are people defending a child molester and trying to compare that with a guy who gave a French kiss when the woman who consented to that kiss didn't specify that a French kiss would be OK. Gross.

[Godstud]

We know we have reached the bottom of the barrel when there are people defending a child molester and trying to compare that with a guy who gave a French kiss when the woman who consented to that kiss didn't specify that a French kiss would be OK. Gross.

I know, right?

[Drlee]

Apparently you did not look at the video of her interview on CNN. How you could blame her for what Franken did to her is sick. It was a very emotional and shameful experience to her. Sure, she should have slapped the hell out of him, but that was not her at that time. Franken believes he can just apologize and everything will be find for him, that is what is shameful.

I am not really convinced that what Franken did is so bad as all of the hoopla would indicate. In fact. If this is all that he did compared to the good he has done for women in public office he is pretty close to a feminist hero. He is accused, after all, of two things. First he took a racy picture of a woman. He was a comedian at the time. Then he (maybe) engineered a kiss from a grown woman who was being paid generously for an acting roll. A kiss! OMG. Horrors!

I agree with Stormsmith. This is really no big deal at all. Maybe he might not do these if he thought about it again but for a famous person in Hollywood his record for good behavior is truly remarkable. What I would say to the woman who is making a big deal out of these is this: Stop trivializing sexual harassment. Real sexual harassment is an issue to take seriously. If every joke or scene in a movie is to be analyzed by whether it might make someone uncomfortable we will very soon live in a very boring world.

Does every woman in the world want men to try to stop kissing them? Do they want to create an atmosphere in the marketplace where men are so afraid of their female coworkers that they shy away from hiring them? Because I can tell you with certain knowledge that this is already happening and more often than one might think.

I have told this before but the brief version is this. When I was in the army the position of my assistant came open. The position required the my assistant and I travel extensively. There were three soldiers who were considered for the job. One was a very pretty single woman who also happened to be, by far and away the one most qualified. I chose her. When I sent my decision up the chain I was called into the commander's office and told that I was out of my mind. I was single. She was single. The colonel informed me that should she make any allegation against me, true or otherwise, I would be virtually defenseless against it. He said, quite frankly, that "no one will believe you". I am proud to say that I chose her anyway, we traveled together as good friends and colleagues, and she took over this position from me when I left. This was very good for her career and probably led to her promotion earlier than normal. The point is though, that had I been exercising a modicum of caution she would never have received the job.

As un-PC as it may be, there has to be a balance. Sexual harassment has to have a definition and that definition can't be solely in the mind of one person. I felt uncomfortable is not enough.

[The Immortal Goon]

The best part of this thread and forum for that matter is how much space Trump occupies in your heads. Its obvious threads like this terrify the hypocrites.

I was actually thinking of Ronnie Reagan. But the same could be said for, say, Rep. Sonny Bono of the GOP too.

1. Franken cracks a joke about Rob Reiner and rape

Franken should be executed at a people's tribunal because he's a bourgeois enemy of the people.

This does not change the fact that Republicans and Democrats both are being babies about trying to say which side participates in rape and are obsessed with celebrity culture more.

I say that any degree of that is too much.

[Victoribus Spolia]

I am not really convinced that what Franken did is so bad as all of the hoopla would indicate. In fact. If this is all that he did compared to the good he has done for women in public office he is pretty close to a feminist hero. He is accused, after all, of two things. First he took a racy picture of a woman. He was a comedian at the time. Then he (maybe) engineered a kiss from a grown woman who was being paid generously for an acting roll. A kiss! OMG. Horrors!

I agree with Stormsmith. This is really no big deal at all. Maybe he might not do these if he thought about it again but for a famous person in Hollywood his record for good behavior is truly remarkable. What I would say to the woman who is making a big deal out of these is this: Stop trivializing sexual harassment. Real sexual harassment is an issue to take seriously. If every joke or scene in a movie is to be analyzed by whether it might make someone uncomfortable we will very soon live in a very boring world.

Does every woman in the world want men to try to stop kissing them? Do they want to create an atmosphere in the marketplace where men are so afraid of their female coworkers that they shy away from hiring them? Because I can tell you with certain knowledge that this is already happening and more often than one might think.

I have told this before but the brief version is this. When I was in the army the position of my assistant came open. The position required the my assistant and I travel extensively. There were three soldiers who were considered for the job. One was a very pretty single woman who also happened to be, by far and away the one most qualified. I chose her. When I sent my decision up the chain I was called into the commander's office and told that I was out of my mind. I was single. She was single. The colonel informed me that should she make any allegation against me, true or otherwise, I would be virtually defenseless against it. He said, quite frankly, that "no one will believe you". I am proud to say that I chose her anyway, we traveled together as good friends and colleagues, and she took over this position from me when I left. This was very good for her career and probably led to her promotion earlier than normal. The point is though, that had I been exercising a modicum of caution she would never have received the job.

As un-PC as it may be, there has to be a balance. Sexual harassment has to have a definition and that definition can't be solely in the mind of one person. I felt uncomfortable is not enough.

Well said. I think we all, no matter our political persuasions, should be able to give a general assent to everything you said above.

[Finfinder]

I was actually thinking of Ronnie Reagan. But the same could be said for, say, Rep. Sonny Bono of the GOP too.



Franken should be executed at a people's tribunal because he's a bourgeois enemy of the people.

This does not change the fact that Republicans and Democrats both are being babies about trying to say which side participates in rape and are obsessed with celebrity culture more.

I say that any degree of that is too much.

Reagan was a two term governor of California before he was president.

[maz]

Although the liberal establishment is trying to stop the bleeding and save Sen. Franken, he's toast.

Al Franken Largely Cut From David Letterman’s Mark Twain Award Gala

Sen. Al Franken (D-Minn.) is being largely edited out of Monday night’s broadcast of the Kennedy Center’s Mark Twain Prize ceremony honoring talk show host David Letterman, PBS said.

He said he's not going to step down.

Star Tribune: Franken won't resign, staffer says

Minnesota Democratic Sen. Al Franken has no intention of stepping down, a Franken staffer told the Star Tribune on Saturday.

A spokesperson for Franken told the Minnesota paper "no" when asked if the senator would resign in the wake of a woman saying Franken forcibly kissed her and groped her while she slept in 2006.

"He is spending time with his family in Washington, DC, and will be through the Thanksgiving holiday," the spokesperson said. "And he's doing a lot of reflecting."

Franken's office did not immediately respond to a request to confirm or clarify the spokesperson's comments to the newspaper.

[Stormsmith]

This incident will not be the end of Franken. He's too good a senator.

[Rich]

As described by Leanne Tweeden this is a clear case of sexual assault. Its disgusting the way that Liberals try and minimise this. Are lefties so ignorant that they don't know the difference between a stage kiss and forcing your tongue into a woman's mouth. As described by Tweeden he badgered her into agreeing to a stage kiss and then he used physical force to assault her.

However a few of us are not rabid hypocrites. Al Franken should not be forced to explain events that happened ten years ago. Al Franken should be given the benefit of the doubt, reasonable doubt even though there is no evidence that any women is trying to frame him up, the way the evidence for a frame up against Moore is starting to mount .

[Zagadka]

Reagan was a two term governor of California before he was president.

Odd, you lot usually forget that when you talk about California as a liberal leftist state

[Oxymoron]

Men's careers are being destroyed because of a organized and premeditated feminazi assault. The right and the left men of power should really come together before this goes any further.

[maz]

However a few of us are not rabid hypocrites. Al Franken should not be forced to explain events that happened ten years ago. Al Franken should be given the benefit of the doubt, reasonable doubt even though there is no evidence that any women is trying to frame him up, the way the evidence for a frame up against Moore is starting to mount .

I agree. The photo of Sen Franken speaks for itself and appear to validate Tweeden's accusations, but we have to give him the benefit of the doubt that he is not the same man that he was 11 years ago.

If the troubling photo of Franken didn't exist, I would consider Tweeden's claims as questionable as any of the other unsubstantiated #Metoo.

What is making things very hard for Franken were his relentless attacks on Trump, his pompous, holier than though attitude and his positioning himself as a prominent feminist ally.

Men's careers are being destroyed because of a organized and premeditated feminazi assault. The right and the left men of power should really come together before this goes any further.

There is much evidence to support that this is a feminist power grab.

You can already see leading feminists picking and choosing which sexual assault claims are valid and which ones need to be exonerated.

Lena Dunham Defends ‘Girls’ Writer Accused Of Raping 17-Year-Old

Actress Lena Dunham has come out in support of Murray Miller, a writer and producer for HBO’s “Girls” who is accused of raping an actress when she was 17.

Aurora Perrineau told The Wrap she has spoken to police about her alleged assault by Miller in 2012, when he was 35 and she was a teen. She said the two met at a hotel in Los Angeles with two of her friends before they all went back to Miller’s home.

I’m a feminist. I study rape culture. And I don’t want Al Franken to resign.

As a feminist and the author of a book on rape culture, I could reasonably be expected to lead the calls for Al Franken to step down, following allegations that he forced his tongue down a woman’s throat, accompanied by a photo of him grinning as he moves in to grope her breasts while she sleeps. It’s disgusting. He treated a sleeping woman as a comedy prop, no more human than the contents of Carrot Top’s trunk, and I firmly believe he should suffer social and professional consequences for it.

But I don’t believe resigning from his position is the only possible consequence, or the one that’s best for American women.

[Rich]

If the troubling photo of Franken didn't exist,

Even the photo is not conclusive proof, although it is backed up by a certain level of confession. Men (or women for that matter) should not be expected to explain events, or alleged events, years or decades ago. witness testimony is notoriously unreliable even for events that have just happened. Councillors and therapists can plant or distort memories, in their keeness to help the client find the truth. Once planted we can not tell the difference between fake memories and real ones. Al Franken should not be subjected to a witch hunt, even though he hypocritically contributed to it. Even though he's been a cheer leader for the Campus feminist Inquisition.

[The Immortal Goon]

Reagan was a two term governor of California before he was president.

That's right.

I guess this just proves that Republicans think Hollywood celebrities should be in charge of virtually every form of government, but will continue to whine endlessly how not enough celebrities like them.

[Stormsmith]

Rich

Get a grip. It was a kiss. If she was that opposed, why did she change from saying no to yes?

Are you dead certain every woman you've kissed wanted you to?

[Hindsite]

A woman says Sen. Al Franken inappropriately touched her in 2010, telling CNN that he grabbed her buttocks while taking a photo at the Minnesota State Fair.

It is the first allegation of improper touching by Franken, who is a Democrat, while he was in office. It comes just days after Leeann Tweeden, a local radio news anchor in California, said that Franken forcibly kissed and groped her in 2006, when Franken was a comedian.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/20/politics/ ... index.html

Apparently AL Franken did not stop groping after he became a Senator. He has just moved down to the buttocks.

On Monday, CNN reported that 33-year-old Lindsay Menz from Frisco, Texas, told the network after Tweeden’s announcement that she had her own “uncomfortable” interaction with Franken.

Menz said in 2010 she went to the Minnesota State Fair with her husband and father and met various officials and celebrities while there, as her father’s business was sponsoring a local radio booth. Franken had been elected to the Senate in 2008.

When she met Franken, she said she had a short exchange with the senator and lined up with him to take a photo. According to CNN:

Franken "pulled me in really close, like awkward close, and as my husband took the picture, he put his hand full-fledged on my rear," Menz said.

"It was wrapped tightly around my butt cheek."

"It wasn't around my waist. It wasn't around my hip or side. It was definitely on my butt," she said, recalling that the brazen act lasted three or four seconds.

"I was like, oh my God, what's happening."

She said she didn’t say anything to the senator but later told her husband and father soon after, as the two men confirmed to CNN.

Franken said in a statement to CNN that he did not remember the incident and that he felt “badly that Ms. Menz came away from our interaction feeling disrespected."

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/ ... to_op.html

[Albert]

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x69nswu
Colbert says it how it is. See the link.

[skinster]

Franken should be executed...

[Drlee]

So today it is Charlie Rose, a NYT reporter, a producer.....

Dear Women.

Be very careful. Push white men too hard and you get Donald Trump. I am sorry that all of human history has made you the target of men's desires. I am not that sorry because I am probably here because of that desire. I am fully committed to removing inappropriate behavior from the marketplace. But be very careful. You could very easily throw the baby out with the bath water.

Many will think that these exposures are all good. That they are men finally getting their comeuppance. Men are not ready to concede the game yet. The bad guys can still win.

Most of us are getting tired of the bullshit we read like the woman above who claims that in full view of her husband, Al Franken put his hand on her butt "for three or four seconds". I have two things to say to you girl. First you should have pulled away and said something right then and there. Secondly your wimp of a husband should have kicked the shit out of him for doing it. But no. Years later you want to make a name for yourself because someone touched your ass. Political assassination is what you are up to chickie. And we can all see it. Go vote for Moore and make yourself feel better.

Note to women. You do not want to live in a world where men have to get you to sign an affidavit just to kiss you good night. But if you think you want to give up YOUR privilege, think again. Yes men have some privileges but then so do you. You get far more deference than you deserve.

I am kind, polite and considerate to women. I was also single for over 50 years. In that time I was in many very confusing situations. I encountered a whole lot of games that women and men play in our weird mating rituals. Men and women alike are often confused by the process. Now here is what to do. Let's add a whole new dimension to this. Let's make kissing too soon an "offense" that can last a lifetime. Let's make second base a political home run decades later.

Sexual harassment in the market place is a real thing. It can be defined and it ought not to be allowed. But women. If you really don't want that adorable, kind 6'2" doctor with his office down the hall to ask you out then make the rules iron clad. Because from a man's perspective we can get really good really fast at understanding rules. We are raised to do that.

I often hear women complain that "all the good ones are taken". Here is another thing. The "good ones" do not need you. There is a line for them and there always has been. Rich, powerful and famous men are another thing. They may well not be the good ones. Might it not be at least a little of your responsibility to give them a wider berth. Again. I am not condoning sexual harassment. But we had better realize that the way to prevent it is to be adult, realize what is happening and make a decision, on the spot, to fight or blow it off. That is a lesson we need to teach women, not men.

[Stormsmith]

Basically I agree.

First, look at the men. Franken is doing minor, but annoying stuff. I think he would be easy to modify if he were made to feel embarrassed by his actions. Just slightly loudly telling him to keep his mitts to himself would probably do it.

But Weinstein and Rose are doing their thing for power. You'd need to be prepared to lose your job maybe more. Looking for a new job would be a good idea, if the boss won't help. But what is clear is that the more women that have been abused increases your claim.

This stuff is everywhere - universities, the armed forces, cops etc.

But overkill for minor offences isn't the right way to go. Neither is putting up with it, if you don't have to. Dont make scene, just pick up your dinner plate and move to a different table. Some single guy will ask to join you and probably pick up the tab.