[Drlee]

Jesus Christ, you've done that shit to women? I've never forced myself on anyone, I've never pressured a women into any kind of sexual act. For me, if the woman ain't into it then I'm not into it. I prefer willing partners. What in the fuck, dude?

Fucking grow up dude. I have been in the real world for far to long to let your completely feigned outrage mean anything at all. Perhaps you led a very sheltered life. It certainly sounds like it.

I am disgusted by the hypocrisy surrounding this bullshit. This particular item is all about a democratic strategy to position themselves to grab for the "woman vote". It will not work where it matters. I believe the democrats believe that women in the bright red states will surreptitiously vote for democrats because they stand on the "side of women" against the evil republican rapists. Won't work. And if they try they will get their ass handed to them yet again.

I mean really. Do they actually think that conservative women are going to drop their Christian issues, such as abortion and same sex marriage to embrace a party that will keep them from getting their asses pinched at work? Not going to happen.

And one more thing. Those of us who are honest enough to say it know that some considerable number of women want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to be pursued but they want to be able to say no. What is wrong with that? Just one thing. It means that you have to put up with a little flirting and some men do it much worse than others.

Every wealthy and or powerful man knows that a considerable number of women are available to him who would not be available if he were not rich or powerful. Both are pretty good aphrodisiacs. The behavior we want to stop is for these men to not use their power (not wealth) to trap women who do not want to play. Sounds easy, huh? Well it isn't. It goes to the very heart of why men (and some women) pursue power. Changing this is FAR more difficult than we are willing to admit.

[Sivad]

Fucking grow up dude. I have been in the real world for far to long to let your completely feigned outrage mean anything at all. Perhaps you led a very sheltered life. It certainly sounds like it.

No, not really, I've been around the block a couple times but I've never forcibly mouth tongued a woman. Forcible mouth tonguing is weird and rapey and I guess I'm just not into it. I kinda always just let the moment happen, I've never forced the issue.

[Kaiserschmarrn]

This particular item is all about a democratic strategy to position themselves to grab for the "woman vote". It will not work where it matters. I believe the democrats believe that women in the bright red states will surreptitiously vote for democrats because they stand on the "side of women" against the evil republican rapists. Won't work. And if they try they will get their ass handed to them yet again.

I've read that more conservative women than men in Alabama do not believe the allegations against Moore, so you may well be right on this. I also think you are right on the moral issue. Like it or not, from their perspective abortion is the murder of the most innocent and it's hard to get any more depraved than supporting that.

[Drlee]

I also think you are right on the moral issue. Like it or not, from their perspective abortion is the murder of the most innocent and it's hard to get any more depraved than supporting that.

They do see it as the murder of the innocent. It illicits an almost visceral disgust in them. And like it or not this will not change. IF the democrats were trying to get an advantage on this issue they would show how their government social programs are giving pregnant women the option of not having a baby and bringing that baby up in stinging poverty. They would talk about food stamps in terms of hungry babies, etc. But they are not.

Just look at the atheists on this forum. Most of them left of center and trying everything in their power to position themselves as the mortal enemy of every religious person out there. They call us stupid and deluded and then are surprised when Christian women in Alabama see a liberal as a greater threat than a guy accused of making passes at young women 40 years ago. The phrase 'clear and present danger' comes to mind.

And you know. I am a conservative republican but not anything like the yahoos who are running the show these days. I voted for Clinton and Obama. I never thought I would be confronted with the rogues gallery of candidates my party put forward this year. (I would have voted for Bush perhaps.) But sometimes when I see the hate and disdain focused on my most cherished beliefs, in a nation founded at least in great part to protect individual religious beliefs, I wonder who I ought to vote for.

Then I look with disbelief at the notion that people are guilty until proven innocent in the court of public opinion and it pushes me further and further to the right.

[Kaiserschmarrn]

Then I look with disbelief at the notion that people are guilty until proven innocent in the court of public opinion and it pushes me further and further to the right.

Just nitpicking here, but since this is something that has happened to me as well, it isn't really you and I who are moving. The left is moving ever further to the left and is also becoming less tolerant of differing opinions even among its own, e.g. I think it was Tom Perez who has recently said that no Democrat standing for office can be pro life or something to that effect.

The old guard of Democrats are less purist but they are on the way out in the not so distant future, so this is very likely to get worse before it hopefully will get better.

[maz]

White women in Alabama have made up their minds about Roy Moore

A recent Washington Post poll shows that nearly 6 in 10 white women in Alabama are likely to vote for Roy Moore, the Republican Senate candidate facing allegations of sexually assaulting multiple teenage girls when he was in his 30s.

After the 2016 presidential election, women on the left called out the 53 percent of white women who helped elect Donald Trump over Hillary Clinton, the first female nominee of a major political party. Trump also faced more than a dozen allegations of sexual assault during his campaign.

Last spring, actress Tina Fey warned white, college-educated women who had supported Trump that their votes would have negative consequences for them.

“A lot of this election was turned by white, college-educated women who now would like to forget about this election and go back to watching HGTV,” Fey said during an April Facebook Live fundraiser for the American Civil Liberties Union. “You can’t look away because it doesn’t affect you this minute, but it’s going to affect you eventually.”

But other contests over the past year have suggested Republican white women in the Trump era may be more likely to support candidates who oppose abortion rights, favor defunding Planned Parenthood and support the president's conservative vision. Most white women in Virginia — 51 percent — backed Republican Ed Gillespie, whom Trump endorsed, in the state's gubernatorial race. Gillespie went on to lose to Democrat Ralph Northam.

[Decky]

Just nitpicking here, but since this is something that has happened to me as well, it isn't really you and I who are moving. The left is moving ever further to the left and is also becoming less tolerant of differing opinions even among its own, e.g. I think it was Tom Perez who has recently said that no Democrat standing for office can be pro life or something to that effect.

The left has been moving to the right in the western world for decades now. Go peddle your nonsense elsewhere. Nationalisation, trade unionism, state owned housing and all other pro working class left wing issues have been totally abandoned for middle class centrist identity politics shit.

[Kaiserschmarrn]

The left has been moving to the right in the western world for decades now. Go peddle your nonsense elsewhere. Nationalisation, trade unionism, state owned housing and all other pro working class left wing issues have been totally abandoned for middle class centrist identity politics shit.

Once and for all, your left is dead. The term left is now by and large equivalent to progressive. The latter have taken over I'm sad to say and you'll have to come to terms with that reality.

[Decky]

Tell it to the DPRK. They are now armed with a nuclear deterrent to protect them from the yanks and can now begin to scale back on military spending in order to start working on their economy and achieving world socialism.

[Kaiserschmarrn]

Tell it to the DPRK. They are now armed with a nuclear deterrent to protect them from the yanks and can now begin to scale back on military spending in order to start working on their economy and achieving world socialism.

I was a bit impatient in my last post so disregard it please. I just can't be bothered to make the distinction between leftists and progressives in every post. Call it laziness, but the reality is that everybody knows who I'm talking about.

[Stormsmith]

As a woman I guess you're an authority, I'm sure you can attest that every young women enjoys old weirdo tongue forced in their mouth? Every hot girl knows old weirdo tongue is the best tongue you'll ever have inside you.

Please be sensible. Of course she has the right to her reaction after the fact, but she must take responsibility for her own ad hoc actions. She consented, full stop.

Shame Al wasn't wearing his Karnak hat.


On Abortion

In the pre-protestant days, the best Catholics thinkers seemed unified in thinking abortion was sinful, but most were realistic enough to understand that in some instances abortion was acceptable. As an example, a couple enduring a famine and trying to cope with feeding their kids might view the addition of a child as life-threatening threat to the existing children. The situation viewed abortion as sinful but not a mortal sin.

Up here, it was difficult to get a legal abortion. As a result, desperate women sought "back alley abortionists". Some women died, some lost the ability to have children. It was illegal to prescribe the pill etc to single women. They had to hope their lovers used condoms, because they couldn't prove paternity.

Happily, a guy named Henry Morgentaler changed his career from GP specialising in family planning to taking on the government. Starting in the late 1960s, he fought and won the right to abort. He endured a lot of flak, but now, 50 years later it's widely accepted.This acceptance I believe was largely due to the press who covered the story exhaustively, which brought about a multi-year, national conversation. I am hopeful with the spread of the Internet in places like the southern states and the continuance of sites like PoFo, social issues such as abortion will be discussed and resolved in a fashion like we witnessed over same sex marriages

Republican women might espouse disdain over abortion, and adopt a holier than you attitude, but every woman knows abortion has its place in society, although it might be one of things most quickly forgot in post menopausal women.

[Drlee]

J

ust nitpicking here, but since this is something that has happened to me as well, it isn't really you and I who are moving. The left is moving ever further to the left and is also becoming less tolerant of differing opinions even among its own, e.g. I think it was Tom Perez who has recently said that no Democrat standing for office can be pro life or something to that effect.

This is right. It does feel a bit like I am sitting in the middle and they are running in both directions. I am concerned that the democrats are becoming even a little more insular than the republicans.

As I see it, the problem is not who is running for office but who to vote for. The republicans stunned me this last cycle by not running a living soul for whom I could vote. On the democratic side I had a conservative hawk, Clinton, and a liberal iconoclast to choose from. Either was a perfectly reasonable choice. Once Bush left the race (with less than 10% in the polls) who was there for whom a sentient person could vote? That we consider any of them now is only a reflection of who won.

It will be interesting to see who the democrats choose in the next go-around. I am going to give you better than even odds that unless Biden runs it will be a woman. I only hope that they can find a centrist one. I can't imagine who that might be. Warren? I feel an affinity with her because she was a republican before 1996.

What I do know is that unless they can find a way to attract Christian women they are going to lose and lose big. The republicans could run a pro-life dog with a note in his mouth and win where it matters. If the republicans are vulnerable anywhere it is in Florida and Pennsylvania. We can see from Virginia that there is a serious groundswell of support for leftish candidates. But 2018 is a long time away and this gender based outrage has, I fear, peaked to early.

So Moore is going to win on Tuesday. He will be seated. The republicans will not even think of opposing him. Even the republican national committee has resumed funding his campaign.

I really hope that someone can get through to the anti-religion types at the democratic national committee and tell them that a) they are correctly seen as anti religious and the most people they need to get elected are b) religious.

I was a bit impatient in my last post so disregard it please. I just can't be bothered to make the distinction between leftists and progressives in every post. Call it laziness, but the reality is that everybody knows who I'm talking about.

This is not a concern you share with most republicans these days. The are so tribal that they refer to anyone who is not wearing a red MAGA hat as a liberal.

Republican women might espouse disdain over abortion, and adopt a holier than you attitude, but every woman knows abortion has its place in society, although it might be one of things most quickly forgot in post menopausal women.

I agree with this. I only wish they voted this way. That is why I want the democrats to have a campaign aimed straight at women asking them to vote this fact rather than their religious beliefs. But in the end I think that running on abortion is a non-starter for democrats. What they ought to do is run on the what a nation that has legalized abortion can do to make it possible and perhaps even preferable for any woman to choose to have the child. An example: If I was running against Moore I would pummel him with the republican tax plan that did away with the deduction for children. I would call him anti-family. I would beat him with taking money away from poor women who are pregnant by showing them that they will be more likely to abort because of economic reasons.

They won't go this way though. They are simply not smart enough to do it. I am telling you I could teach them how to win. But nobody is really listening. They are too busy going to their drum-circle and organic-whale aquaculture classes.

[jimjam]

I have been reading this thread and find it to be an excellent discussion more or less devoid of the usual cheap shots and one liners of the type I frequently deploy simply as a method of venting. The convergence of politics and sex results in a particularly volatile mix in light that very few of us are apolitical or eunuchs. I find the subject matter to be somewhat ill defined as it seems that POFO and America appear to be entering uncharted territory. Myself? I really do not know .......... there are many and various values and thoughts of different sorts ebbing and flowing.

Perhaps from the pondering of such issues flows the strength of democracy ...........

[Hindsite]

Republican women might espouse disdain over abortion, and adopt a holier than you attitude, but every woman knows abortion has its place in society, although it might be one of things most quickly forgot in post menopausal women.

Yes, murder and other crimes do have a place in this society. But Christians, like me, are wishing for a really moral society in the future. Praise the Lord.

[Stormsmith]

I agree with this. I only wish they voted this way. That is why I want the democrats to have a campaign aimed straight at women asking them to vote this fact rather than their religious beliefs. But in the end I think that running on abortion is a non-starter for democrats. What they ought to do is run on the what a nation that has legalized abortion can do to make it possible and perhaps even preferable for any woman to choose to have the child. An example: If I was running against Moore I would pummel him with the republican tax plan that did away with the deduction for children. I would call him anti-family. I would beat him with taking money away from poor women who are pregnant by showing them that they will be more likely to abort because of economic reasons.

They won't go this way though. They are simply not smart enough to do it. I am telling you I could teach them how to win. But nobody is really listening. They are too busy going to their drum-circle and organic-whale aquaculture classes.

I think the abortion issue oughtn't be given air time . Everyone presupposes Dems are okay with abortion. In the pro choices' favour is the courts are siding with them, and forcing a re-opening of clinics, plus a growing awareness that abortion by pharmaceuticals available online may circumvent the closed-circuit scenario. And everytime it's raised, except for the ultra rightist, they assume the moral high ground.

I think support for the Obama-Holder effort to sort out this gerrymandering mess will untimely yield good results. And I wonder if you could get rid of those superpacs. I am aware of the SCOTUS position on corps, money and so on, but most parliamentarians hate the lengths they must go to to raise the capital to run for office. There might be bi-partisan support, but would the Koches et al just run private ads?

I also think the press gave Trump enough free air time to make him into a movement. The money they made off Trump will cost each of you dearly.

Warren is interesting. Trump sliced through his 16 competitors like a sharp sword vivisecting butter in a warm room. He tried to with the Dems who faired, I thought, a shade better. Of them, Warren faired the best, and could do again. She's knowledgeable and less cautious a speaker than HRC, and people saw her as more sincere, less calculating. Feisty. This chick has good energy. Barry Sanders had strong appeal amongst young people who are curious about socialism. I wonder if Trump would resurrect complaints about Joe Biden faux pas.

[Hindsite]

No, not really, I've been around the block a couple times but I've never forcibly mouth tongued a woman. Forcible mouth tonguing is weird and rapey and I guess I'm just not into it. I kinda always just let the moment happen, I've never forced the issue.

I tried that French kissing thing with my wife once, but I did not like it as well as the regular kissing, so I never tried it again.

Warren is interesting. Trump sliced through his 16 competitors like a sharp sword vivisecting butter in a warm room. He tried to with the Dems who faired, I thought, a shade better. Of them, Warren faired the best, and could do again. She's knowledgeable and less cautious a speaker than HRC, and people saw her as more sincere, less calculating. Feisty. This chick has good energy. Barry Sanders had strong appeal amongst young people who are curious about socialism. I wonder if Trump would resurrect complaints about Joe Biden faux pas.

Warren brings back "Pocahontas" as her nickname.

[Drlee]

Joe Biden with Warren as VP would be an unstoppable ticket. Two bulldogs against a fractured party.

I think the republicans know that they can't win the presidency in 20. Trump will bring them down even if they dump him as dumping him will kick sand in the faces of his lowbrow supporters. Pence has the Charisma of a bus driver and his overt religious beliefs will not play with independents.

The race in 18 is for control of one of the houses of government. If the democrats get both the house and the senate (and it is doubtful that they will get either) then Trump will pivot to the left like a merry go around. If he hasn't been impeached by then he will be their bitch. Pence could try to block their initiatives and would be successful. But the democrats would put forward one popular middle class benefiting bill after another and force him to veto them or fold. Veto and they loose big time in 20, fold and the democrats win. I think that the republicans are just awakening to this.

By the way. Banon's threat to primary moderate republicans is playing right into the democrat's hands. They would far prefer to run against far-right candidates in the light red districts.

I don't know if they dems can take the house and senate in 2018. I am not even certain they can expect gains. The ability of the US voter to vote his/her tribe is nothing short of disgusting. Only the women can save us and I fear they will do too little too late.

[Hindsite]

I don't know if they dems can take the house and senate in 2018. I am not even certain they can expect gains. The ability of the US voter to vote his/her tribe is nothing short of disgusting. Only the women can save us and I fear they will do too little too late.

I guess you haven't heard that the Dems are a very corrupt party.

[Albert]

[Drlee]

I guess you haven't heard that the Dems are a very corrupt party

Post your proof. Mouthing off again, right?