[Godstud]

I am the highest authority in my house.

Not counting the wife?

[One Degree]

Again, if she's willing, it isn't rape. If she isnt, it is. This isn't rocket science. It may be the case the aren't laws through which she can find justice, but that only adds to her burden. Go get a hooker.



Dr lee, happily I agree with you. Most men I know understand rape is a problem and even today's laws aren't sufficient, but correcting them is just as much a problem.

Wow, you and @Drlee are using ‘political correctness’ to shut down an intellectual debate on how our ancestors may have thought. I thought both of you were above such shallow thinking. It is amazing to me that neither of you can even let yourselves imagine a time when a woman may not have felt any shame, remorse, or guilt at being raped. She could object without thinking it was an unbearable violation of morality simply because it was part of her existence. No thought as to what is morally right because only survival meant anything. Morality is for those who are safe and secure. Survival did not allow for such thoughts.

[XogGyux]

Not counting the wife?

How old do you think I am?

[Godstud]

@XogGyux I have no idea. Please... enlighten me. I'm a young 51, myself.

If you are a bachelor, then you are indeed master of your own demesne.

[XogGyux]

@XogGyux I have no idea. Please... enlighten me. I'm a young 51, myself.

If you are a bachelor, then you are indeed master of your own demesne.

I am just 30, might sound a bit old but I literally just came out of school a couple years ago need a bit of time to make sure i have the right person and all.

[Drlee]

It is amazing to me that neither of you can even let yourselves imagine a time when a woman may not have felt any shame, remorse, or guilt at being raped.

Shame, remorse or guilt?!

A woman who has been raped is and always has been the victim of a crime of violence. She has nothing to be ashamed of. She should feel no remorse. She is not guilty of anything.

[One Degree]

I am just 30, might sound a bit old but I literally just came out of school a couple years ago need a bit of time to make sure i have the right person and all.

Then I owe you an apology for coming on so strong initially about your ‘superiority’ and ‘self righteousness’. I somehow got the impression you were a retired doctor. Your views are more expected at your age and do not deserve the aspersions I cast upon them. My apologies.

[One Degree]

Shame, remorse or guilt?!

A woman who has been raped is and always has been the victim of a crime of violence. She has nothing to be ashamed of. She should feel no remorse. She is not guilty of anything.

The discussion was never about whether rape is ‘good’. It was the example chosen to investigate how people can hold totally different views than our own on all morality. It is important to try to imagine how others think, so we realize we can’t judge them based upon our thinking. An ability that apparently has been lost today.

[Stormsmith]

Wow, you and @Drlee are using ‘political correctness’ to shut down an intellectual debate on how our ancestors may have thought. I thought both of you were above such shallow thinking. It is amazing to me that neither of you can even let yourselves imagine a time when a woman may not have felt any shame, remorse, or guilt at being raped. She could object without thinking it was an unbearable violation of morality simply because it was part of her existence. No thought as to what is morally right because only survival meant anything. Morality is for those who are safe and secure. Survival did not allow for such thoughts.

Those feelings, shame guilt etc. come after the fact. I imagine that at the time, she is thinking how can I get him/them to stop with getting hurt/killed. You seem to get this when you write about survival. Why would you ever think this was good?

[XogGyux]

Then I owe you an apology for coming on so strong initially about your ‘superiority’ and ‘self righteousness’. I somehow got the impression you were a retired doctor. Your views are more expected at your age and do not deserve the aspersions I cast upon them. My apologies.

What does age has anything to do with this... Idiocy and ignorance is universal among all ages. Case in point... Trump. in his 70's and behave like the big baby he is. Save your apologies that you don't mean. Want to show up some respect? Go read a little bit and think twice before posting non-sense.

[One Degree]

Those feelings, shame guilt etc. come after the fact. I imagine that at the time, she is thinking how can I get him/them to stop with getting hurt/killed. You seem to get this when you write about survival. Why would you ever think this was good?

I don’t think it is good. I am trying to imagine how others can think totally differently from me about morality. You and others seem to be arguing it is outrageous to imagine anyone believing in a different morality than your own. This is the very definition of being ‘closed minded’ and ‘bigoted’.

[One Degree]

What does age has anything to do with this... Idiocy and ignorance is universal among all ages. Case in point... Trump. in his 70's and behave like the big baby he is. Save your apologies that you don't mean. Want to show up some respect? Go read a little bit and think twice before posting non-sense.

Lol. Maybe think of it as a mental version of phylogeny recapitulates ontogeny. We all go through similar processes of moral intellectual development. As we age, most of us have gone through enough changes to better understand how our ‘truths’ are subject to change. When we are younger, or resist mental growth, we tend to believe our ‘truths’ are permanent and universal.
My apology was sincere due to I would not expect you to have this experience. It is not impossible, but certainly not likely. You stated you are just out of school. Many of us consider you are just now leaving a fantasy reality and will now be faced with the brutal reality.

[Stormsmith]

The discussion was never about whether rape is ‘good’. It was the example chosen to investigate how people can hold totally different views than our own on all morality. It is important to try to imagine how others think, so we realize we can’t judge them based upon our thinking. An ability that apparently has been lost today.

As you can guess, I am an absolutest, but I can easily understand people who think as relativists. For those unfamiliar with these terms, absolutists always think of something is right or wrong, whereas relativists see mitigating factors everywhere. Rape, by its definition is always wrong. There are no mitigating circumstances. None.

I don’t think it is good. I am trying to imagine how others can think totally differently from me about morality. You and others seem to be arguing it is outrageous to imagine anyone believing in a different morality than your own. This is the very definition of being ‘closed minded’ and ‘bigoted’.

There are societies that think murder is okay, theft is okay, and rape is okay.

Happily, not many do, and no victim anywhere does. Lack of laws isn't applause for the perp, it's a second slap in the face to the victim.

[One Degree]

As you can guess, I am an absolutest, but I can easily understand people who think as relativists. For those unfamiliar with these terms, absolutists always think of something is right or wrong, whereas relativists see mitigating factors everywhere. Rape, by its definition is always wrong. There are no mitigating circumstances. None.




There are societies that think murder is okay, theft is okay, and rape is okay.

Happily, not many do, and no victim anywhere does. Lack of laws isn't applause for the perp, it's a second slap in the face to the victim.

Theft was a sign of manhood in some societies and is still used as an initiation rite by gangs. They obviously don’t consider it morally wrong, but a sign of bravery.
Edit: Disregard the above. It does not rebut any argument you made,

[Godstud]

Gangs are not any normal society but mostly outcasts of said societies. They are the detritus of any normal society, hence the name 'gang'.

[XogGyux]

Lol. Maybe think of it as a mental version of phylogeny recapitulates ontogeny. We all go through similar processes of moral intellectual development. As we age, most of us have gone through enough changes to better understand how our ‘truths’ are subject to change. When we are younger, or resist mental growth, we tend to believe our ‘truths’ are permanent and universal.
My apology was sincere due to I would not expect you to have this experience. It is not impossible, but certainly not likely. You stated you are just out of school. Many of us consider you are just now leaving a fantasy reality and will now be faced with the brutal reality.

Arrogance much?
BTW thats ad hominem. Way to fail.

Many of us consider you are just now leaving a fantasy reality and will now be faced with the brutal reality.

Many of you would be wrong. As usual.

[One Degree]

Arrogance much?
BTW thats ad hominem. Way to fail.

Many of you would be wrong. As usual.

It is hardly arrogance when I readily admit I, like everyone else, am subject to the same process.
What argument am I avoiding that makes this ad hominem. I am directly addressing your questioning my veracity.
Your absolutism in declaring me wrong is evidence of the truth of my point.

[XogGyux]

It is hardly arrogance when I readily admit I, like everyone else, am subject to the same process.
What argument am I avoiding that makes this ad hominem. I am directly addressing your questioning my veracity.
Your absolutism in declaring me wrong is evidence of the truth of my point.

No. You are not addressing the validity of my arguments. Instead you are arrogantly pretending "I used to think like you when I was younger, I was wrong, you will change your mind" attitude. Which is not only arrogant, it is ignorant as well. Very pretentious.

[Hindsite]

No. You are not addressing the validity of my arguments. Instead you are arrogantly pretending "I used to think like you when I was younger, I was wrong, you will change your mind" attitude. Which is not only arrogant, it is ignorant as well. Very pretentious.

I think he is assuming you went to a liberal university where they fed you the liberal political propaganda and you still believe it. It is likely that if you are a smart person you will eventually see the light and no longer believe those lies.
HalleluYah

[XogGyux]

I think he is assuming you went to a liberal university where they fed you the liberal political propaganda and you still believe it. It is likely that if you are a smart person you will eventually see the light and no longer believe those lies.
HalleluYah

Again... address the point not the person or I'll have no choice but to assume you went to a church where they taught you about an invisible old magic man on the sky (and possibly touched you on your privates), to hate truth and science and that is why you don't use your brain.