[SpecialOlympian]

The Obama whose administration did everything they could set Trump up for destruction before he was even sworn in? That Obama? Biden, the vice-president that suggested the Logan Act be used against Flynn when Flynn was simply doing his job as an incoming member of the next administration? That Biden?

Flynn is an incompetent moron who was fired by both Obama and Trump's administration, and was apparently involved in some plot to kidnap a Turkish US resident. Like, he's so incompetent that as a general he doesn't even get to do the MIC consulting grift now that he's a private citizen. He's all in on Q and his post politics and military career is going to be doing Q events and signing books for gullible rubes.

What is this fascination with Flynn being a triumphant martyr and actually not a huge dumbass? He was known for repeating FWD:FWD:FWD: style email shit about Muslims all the time, to the point where his subordinates joked about his "Flynn Facts." He got himself fired for lying to Pence. Like, it's not surprising that he got cut loose because he is a moron.

[Saeko]

What is this fascination with Flynn being a triumphant martyr and actually not a huge dumbass? He was known for repeating FWD:FWD:FWD: style email shit about Muslims all the time, to the point where his subordinates joked about his "Flynn Facts." He got himself fired for lying to Pence. Like, it's not surprising that he got cut loose because he is a moron.

How dumb do you have to be to get fired by the Trump administration for being a liar???

Also, who here is old enough to remember the first Georgia recount?

[Unthinking Majority]

How dumb do you have to be to get fired by the Trump administration for being a liar???

Also, who here is old enough to remember the first Georgia recount?

Georgia can count?

[Saeko]

Food for thought: The US government can deliver an effective response to almost any emergency anywhere on the face of the Earth within minutes.............

































































except within its own borders when its own people are in actual danger.

[Tainari88]

I got to say that the conservatives just doing the stupid Russiagate shit with an even flimsier Venezuela and even Chavez boogeyman is fucking hilarious.

I heard that shit from Sydney Powell and it is hilarious. They are pulling out a dead from cancer for years now Hugo Chavez and soon Fidel Castro the dead Bearded one has an inside track on Kamala Harris.

They will say AOC works for Diaz Canel in Havana and she is hiding in a socialist bunker with Bernie, stuffing ballots with socialists.

I voted for Gloria Estela La Riva. The socialism and liberation party. They are connected to Native American rights groups, human rights groups and everything I love about improving society. They were on almost all fifty state ballots and they wanted to run knowing they would lose as an alternative to the two major parties. La Riva worked on Bernie Sanders campaign. The socialists are growing in the USA and they are not losing their seats. Sanders was the only one who thought the congress needs to hold hearings on what is the procedure and response that is appropriate for a possible Trump refusal to do a peaceful transition.

The Democrats are so lame. They should be pressuring the Republicans who are not telling Trump that he is a no go for the second term.

The courts might be stacked with Republicans but they will have to be coming up with legal arguments that overturn legit ballots in various states. It is highly unlikely. The military of the USA have a lot of people who dislike Trump and voted against him in this election so that is a no go.

Chavez in Venezuela had the Venezuelan military on his side. He was a paratrooper and there are a lot of leftists in the military in South America. Contrary to popular opinion the socialists are many in Venezuela, Chile, Argentina, Colombia, Ecuador, and many other nations in the Southern Hemisphere. And in the military. in the USA it varies as well. A lot of people did not like Mr. Bone Spurs avoiding the draft Trump style of crap. He is not a military background guy like a Colin Powell or a Mattis or anyone like that. He is a lying conman from Queens.

Guiliani is a total failure at winning his cases in court for Trump.

I think Biden is going to have his hands full dealing with this new surge in Coronavirus cases and he is going to have to come up with money to bail out the enormous amounts of people who are tapped out emotionally, physically and financially with this long drawn out pandemic situation. Everyone is tired.

Time for the conman to be kicked HARD in the ass and OUT. And the Dems are going to have to stop their stupid and ineffective ways of not being tough on these sellout cowardly pieces of jello lying thieves that are all the Republican cronies who fear offending the base of deplorables that are part of that angry crowd of people who don't understand capitalism at all and keep expecting miracles from a shit system they never bothered to analyze in their Fox News existence.

[annatar1914]

OK well I don't know why you're trying to occupy both positions at once given that the Trump legal team has tried, and failed, to prove the vote was fraudulent 30+ times now. If they had evidence they had plenty of chances to show it.

There's no 'occupation' of 'both positions at once' for me. There's only one position, and that's the absence of civil strife. The Constitutional system is working so far, and there's no need to call the election early for one candidate over another until everything is certified and the court cases are settled. That's how the adults are seeing it, in the leadership of places like Mexico, China, and the Russian Federation. Elections do get messy in places all over the world, oftentimes with American government help, including right here in America itself. Patience and peace.

[annatar1914]

The SCOTUS will not see anything. The "lawsuits" will not meet the basic requirements for any sort of trial because there is no evidence to support them. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a complete fool.


@annatar1914 You might claim objectivity, but you've been backing Trump's horse for some time now, so it comes across as being a bit... flimsy.

Absurd. I'm not backing either horse, neither is exactly a thoroughbred. What I do know is that President Trump is not stupid, but most of his enemies are, not all, but most. I wouldn't count President Trump out just yet, his enemies badly underestimate him and overestimate themselves rather wildly.

[SpecialOlympian]

There's no 'occupation' of 'both positions at once' for me. There's only one position, and that's the absence of civil strife. The Constitutional system is working so far, and there's no need to call the election early for one candidate over another until everything is certified and the court cases are settled. That's how the adults are seeing it, in the leadership of places like Mexico, China, and the Russian Federation. Elections do get messy in places all over the world, oftentimes with American government help, including right here in America itself. Patience and peace.

Georgia's certification of the electors means Biden won. It's over.

And yes, you are occupying both positions when your words are literally, "I believe the election results were fair and definitive, but also I believe it's possible it was rigged and it needs to go before the SCOTUS." You are saying you believe in two diametrically opposed things at the same time. Which is... whatever.

Absurd. I'm not backing either horse, neither is exactly a thoroughbred. What I do know is that President Trump is not stupid, but most of his enemies are, not all, but most. I wouldn't count President Trump out just yet, his enemies badly underestimate him and overestimate themselves rather wildly.

Trump is incredibly stupid and multiple people that he appointed have expressed this. Again, for a guy who says he's not a Trump supporter you continually hold him in unrealistically high esteem, diminish his opposition, and find ways to take on his arguments. Even when those arguments are opposed to what you also claim to believe. You appear to be bending yourself into a pretzel to support the president, who you claim to dislike.

I don't know how you look at Rudy being the frontman for all of this and continue to believe Trump is some kind of genius.

[Dimetrodon]

Georgia can count?

Apparently.

[annatar1914]

Georgia's certification of the electors means Biden won. It's over.

And yes, you are occupying both positions when your words are literally, "I believe the election results were fair and definitive, but also I believe it's possible it was rigged and it needs to go before the SCOTUS." You are saying you believe in two diametrically opposed things at the same time. Which is... whatever.

No, perhaps I should clarify but i've tried to make clear that while I personally think Trump lost, and understand the reasons why he did, it's also possible perhaps that he won but was denied so far a win via fraud, considering the motive, means, and opportunity his enemies have had to do so. After all, if he's ''Hitler'', just about anything goes with some people.

Again, I'm trying to help people avoid civil strife due to a toxic and deranged political atmosphere, in which both partisan groups are dangerously escalating this atmosphere to the point of serious cataclysm.

Trump is incredibly stupid and multiple people that he appointed have expressed this. Again, for a guy who says he's not a Trump supporter you continually hold him in unrealistically high esteem and find ways to take on his arguments, even when those arguments are opposed to what you also say you believe.

Trump is quite intelligent, but he is also extremely arrogant and supremely self-absorbed, which nullifies much of the good that his intelligence would do him. I do oppose him, and the ''Conservatives'', and the Liberals, but what I don't do is underestimate anybody just because I don't like them. He's cunning, has predatory instincts, I won't be counting him out just yet and i'd advise others to think likewise.

I don't know how you look at Rudy being the frontman for all of this and continue to believe Trump is some kind of genius.

Spectacles can be quite a distraction can't they?

[Dimetrodon]

Food for thought: The US government can deliver an effective response to almost any emergency anywhere on the face of the Earth within minutes.............except within its own borders when its own people are in actual danger.

Because we're a kleptocracy but playing the World Police Department allows defense contractors to make money. Helping Americans doesn't really help Corporations much, so our lobbied government will not act. We have a party that thinks helping people is communism and another party that is ineffective.

[Red_Army]

Why would the Democrats rig an election and let Republicans keep the senate?

[Unthinking Majority]

Apparently.

Maybe not so well. They did need a recount.

[ralfy]

Both parties have been employing a combination of neo-conservatism and neo-liberalism since Reagan's admin. Biden is no different from Bush and Obama, who bailed out the rich and engaged in warmongering. Trump thought he could counter such but couldn't because the officials who worked for him mostly cme from the same admins, and his own social status was gained thanks to provisions that gave advantages to the rich thanks to past Presidents.

[Sivad]

voter fraud is so minimal that in a statewide race it can account for 500-1000 ballots.

That's local elections. When the number of mail-in ballots sent out increases like in a statewide election, the opportunity for fraud increases also. In the case of this election where there was an unprecedented number of ballots sent out it could easily account for 50,000-100,000 ballots in many states. And that's just one form of fraud on one side of the process. In addition to voter fraud, electoral fraud also includes shit like ballot stuffing and computer tampering on the counting side.

But all that is beside the point, I posted the article in response to your claim that voter fraud is vanishingly rare. It's not rare, it's common and widespread, it does swing elections, and it definitely occurred in many of the key counties in this election.

Its solutions also demand that large swathes of individual, registered voters possibly be disenfranchised by being forced to vote in person or obtain an ID they may not have the means to obtain (for example, states where IDs can only be obtained on the third Thursday of every month or where DMV offices do not have full hours)

That's bullshit, we don't have to compromise election security, all we have to do is make it easier for people to get an ID. We could just let post offices issue state IDs or start DMV mobile services, there are a million ways to make ID services more accessible.

I also question the authenticity of the article because that Voter Impression scheme is a pretty God damned risky move to pull off en masse. All you need is a few infrequent voters to come in and cast their ballot and alarm bells are going to go off somewhere. I sincerely doubt that is being pulled on any sort of mass scale

The article stated that it was a rarely used, desperate, last ditch measure.

[Sivad]

Why would the Democrats rig an election and let Republicans keep the senate?

It all comes down to opportunity. There has to be a key city or county controlled by a democrat machine in a close election in a swing state or they can't pull it off.

[SpecialOlympian]

That's local elections. When the number of mail-in ballots sent out increases like in a statewide election, the opportunity for fraud increases also. In the case of this election where there was an unprecedented number of ballots sent out it could easily account for 50,000-100,000 ballots in many states. And that's just one form of fraud on one side of the process. In addition to voter fraud, electoral fraud also includes shit like ballot stuffing and computer tampering on the counting side.

But all that is beside the point, I posted the article in response to your claim that voter fraud is vanishingly rare. It's not rare, it's common and widespread, it does swing elections, and it definitely occurred in many of the key counties in this election.

It is, and the article you provided from an anonymouse source from a pro-Trump rag explicitly states 500-1000, if done by an organized group actively committing crimes, for statewide elections. It is clearly stated that 500 to 1,000 votes seems to be what's possible on the level of NY, a populous state:

“An election that is swayed by 500 votes, 1,000 votes — it can make a difference,” the tipster said. “It could be enough to flip states.”

I also disagree that any of the methods, excepting possibly old people homes, are more reliable in a large election, which is more likely to be monitored than your local city-council ballot.

That's bullshit, we don't have to compromise election security, all we have to do is make it easier for people to get an ID. We could just let post offices issue state IDs or start DMV mobile services, there are a million ways to make ID services more accessible.

I fully support that. However, it is state legislatures who purposely make it difficult to obtain IDs. Also I imagine there would be some difficulty in federal institutions like the USPS issuing state IDs. But that's beside the point, because election integrity is not the purpose of voter ID laws, and it never was. Some states purposely make it difficult to obtain IDs, specifically by closing or shortening the hours of DMV offices.

You are presuming that places where people are registered, but have lost or expired IDs they can't replace due to time, transportation, or infirmity, are not trying to prevent people from obtaining them. They actively discourage this and then demand voter ID laws.

Again, for a non-existent problem that people only seem to care about when Republicans lose. One of the only cases I've heard of voter impersonation was hilariously reported by John Fetterman:



If voter fraud was even a fraction of the problem the voter ID people claim it is, you would think the Trump campaign wouldn't have lost 30+ lawsuits. But here we are, and the same people who can't accept a Trump loss have simply veered into another alternative reality with equally imaginary problems to console themselves.

In fact, the evidence of voter fraud on any level is so small this election cycle that Rudy is veering into insane conspiracy theories where a 7+ years dead Hugo Chavez engineered mass ballot changes through a Venezuelan voting software company. That's how little evidence he has to work with on this supposedly widespread problem that needs to be addressed immediately.

[ingliz]

the decision itself can be appealed.

To what end?

SCR Rule 42:2.

When a petition for a writ of certiorari, an appeal, or
an application for other relief is frivolous...

For the Supreme Court, a frivolous claim is one that lacks an arguable basis in fact or law

this Court has been presented with strained legal arguments without merit and speculative accusations, unpled in the operative complaint and unsupported by evidence.

— Judge Brann, Trump v. Boockvar, Opinion Nov 21, 2020

[XogGyux]

This is unacceptable. Trump have plenty of evidence to win the case for fraud yet this poor guy keep losing cases. What 30+ cases? isen't that fishy? Don't you guys suspect that Rudy Guilliany and Sidney Powel are part of the deep state trying to further embarrass this president?
Think about it... Trump got impeached by Rudy's dirty trick... now he is losing court cases and gettin embarrassed due to Rudy's embarrassing arguments.
What Trump should do is fire all his lawyers, and present the case himself and the evidence himself. Nobody else. He is smart and powerful, he can do it.
On top of that, he should also make sure his arguments to the suppreme court, delivered and argued by himself, be televised so that we can all see first hand the evidence instead of being warped by the deepstate and ,mass news media.

[Tainari88]

@XogGyux you mean to tell me that the man has to clean up after himself? He has not done that once in all his life. Here he is...he can't even be bothered to fold up and put away his own umbrella. Someone there has always been wiping up and cleaning up and picking up after his messy snobby privileged pendejo self his entire life. He is not going to bother with doing the deed himself. Lol.

Also PoFo get a grip....Brazil, Mexico and many third worldish nations have more accurate, faster and better counting of ballot systems than the USA does. One has to examine why in Brazil they can do an accurate count fast with a very good mathematical stat on accuracy and the USA can't figure it out at all with a lot more money?

Something ain't right folks. The electoral college has to scrapped, and a very efficient paper trail ballot system needs to be implemented. Every time I have to go and deal with Mexican immigration, banking, or another official scene they take your photo and fingerprint you and do a signature match as well as voice recognition now. They also force you to go to Mexico City and answer 300 questions and meet with officials from the Mexican government for a long time before they accept you as a citizen and you got to vote. It is not a choice. They will make your life difficult if you don't vote in elections after becoming a citizen.

This entire scene is very interesting to me here. Because Mexico does go for popular votes ONLY. No way of overturning that result at all. In the past the fraud was all party officials disappearing ballot boxes and replacing them with the desired votes and lying. The other tactic used was going to poor barrios and giving out groceries and money for votes cast in their favor. Sort of like stimulus checks that McConnell the senate nightmare did not do for Trump. If he had sent a big fat check prior to the November 3rd election in the USA instead of thinking in his right wing bullshit that the poorer voters near homeless status got to work for their 'security' and did not bribe them with stimulus checks from Donnie who probably would have held them up to get his signature printed on the checks? They did not do the classic Mexican buy off the elections move.

Or they could have done a lot of other classic dirty tricks from all over the world. The USA voting system is seriously bad....in that it is not updated at all. it needs reform.

But, talking to the Trump loyalists? He is an anti-establishment hero. He is an asshole conman. A liar, a grifter, and a fake with zero statesman skills. When someone like that comes to power and you are forced to defend such an immoral, lying piece of crap as the only one capable of disciplining some plutocratic ass-kissing neoliberals with corrupt behaviors you know you are in deep, deep trouble.