Fetal heartbeat and the abortion fight - Page 8 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15006097
There is no reason to respond to the majority of Snapdragons post a she developed no arguments. She simply did the old playground "not". It is amazing how little some people know about their subject:



In England and Wales, the offence is created by section 1(1) of the Infant Life (Preservation) Act 1929:

(1) Subject as hereinafter in this subsection provided, any person who, with intent to destroy the life of a child capable of being born alive, by any wilful act causes a child to die before it has an existence independent of its mother, shall be guilty of felony, to wit, of child destruction, and shall be liable on conviction thereof on indictment to penal servitude for life:

Provided that no person shall be found guilty of an offence under this section unless it is proved that the act which caused the death of the child was not done in good faith for the purpose only of preserving the life of the mother.

(2) For the purposes of this Act, evidence that a woman had at any material time been pregnant for a period of twenty-eight weeks or more shall be primâ facie proof that she was at that time pregnant of a child capable of being born alive.[6]


According to British law it stops being an "embryo" at around 24 weeks. Do you want to reconsider your off-hand attitude toward the life of this person so you can join that of the overwhelming majority of you countrymen? Countrymen who enacted this abortion law:

Section 1(1) of the Abortion Act 1967

In England and Wales and Scotland, section 1(1) of the Abortion Act 1967 now reads:[2]

Subject to the provisions of this section, a person shall not be guilty of an offence under the law relating to abortion when a pregnancy is terminated by a registered medical practitioner if two registered medical practitioners are of the opinion, formed in good faith -

(a) that the pregnancy has not exceeded its twenty-fourth week and that the continuance of the pregnancy would involve risk, greater than if the pregnancy were terminated, of injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman or any existing children of her family; or
(b) that the termination of the pregnancy is necessary to prevent grave permanent injury to the physical or mental health of the pregnant woman; or
(c) that the continuance of the pregnancy would involve risk to the life of the pregnant woman, greater than if the pregnancy were terminated
(d) that there is a substantial risk that if the child were born it would suffer from such physical or mental abnormalities as to be seriously handicapped.


Rather than cut and paste the rest of it I will simply go on to say that a woman in the UK does not have a "right" to an abortion. She has the prerogative to ask for one and two doctors may choose to allow her to have it. Or not. It is also an offense for her to attempt to abort herself. Late term abortions are strictly controlled in the UK and absolutely NOT available on demand.

Many US states have more liberal abortion laws than the UK does.
#15006143
Drlee wrote:There is no reason to respond to the majority of Snapdragons post a she developed no arguments. She simply did the old playground "not". It is amazing how little some people know about their subject:


There is no need to reply to anyone here.
That sounds like a hissy fit to me.




According to British law it stops being an "embryo" at around 24 weeks. Do you want to reconsider your off-hand attitude toward the life of this person so you can join that of the overwhelming majority of you countrymen? Countrymen who enacted this abortion law:


No. It stops being an embryo at 12 weeks gestation, when it becomes a foetus until it has been born, when it legally becomes a person.


Rather than cut and paste the rest of it I will simply go on to say that a woman in the UK does not have a "right" to an abortion. She has the prerogative to ask for one and two doctors may choose to allow her to have it. Or not. It is also an offense for her to attempt to abort herself. Late term abortions are strictly controlled in the UK and absolutely NOT available on demand.



Stupid isn't it? It's very, very easy to get an abortion in the UK, however.

The woman has to pretend to be depressed and the doctors have to pretend to believe her.

Many US states have more liberal abortion laws than the UK does.


I'm sure, but they still make it hard for women to access them.
#15006579
A Time when Evangelicals Could Hear and Respect Diverse Views on Abortion

There was a time in the not too distant past when the majority of Protestant Christians, including those who called themselves evangelical, did not consider the point at which a fertilized ovum or developing embryo or fetus becomes a human being to be clearly defined, indisputable, and settled for all time.

There was a time when different viewpoints were accepted and respected and did not serve as a litmus test to determine who was a “real” Christian. A time when many evangelicals thought that the United States Supreme Court’s 1973 Roe v. Wade decision might be considered a good and compassionate ruling as it overturned the varied restrictive abortion laws of the states that so often drove desperate women to seek out illegal, unsafe, “back-alley” abortions. Instead, declared the court, the constitutional guarantee of privacy leaves it up to a woman, her doctor, and her own moral agency to make decisions about terminating a pregnancy.

Religion historian Randall Balmer in his book, Thy Kingdom Come, writes that Rev.W. A. Criswell, a well known fundamentalist Baptist pastor who was at one time president of the Southern Baptist Convention, expressed his approval of the Supreme Court decision in these words: “I have always felt that it was only after a child was born and had a life separate from its mother that it became an individual person, and it has always, therefore, seemed to me that what is best for the mother and for the future should be allowed.”

And Dudley, in his book cited earlier, quotes a Dallas Theological Seminary professor who wrote a 1968 article for Christianity Today claiming that “God does not regard the fetus as a soul, no matter how far gestation has progressed,” basing his argument on Exodus 21:22-24. Other conservative Christian theologians made similar arguments.

Randall Balmer reminds us that two years before the 1973 Roe v. Wade Supreme Court decision, the Southern Baptist Convention, meeting in St. Louis, Missouri, adopted a resolution that called on Southern Baptists “to work for legislation that will allow the possibility of abortion under such conditions as rape, incest, clear evidence of severe fetal deformity and carefully ascertained evidence of the likelihood of damage to the emotional, mental, and physical health of the mother.”

Or consider this quotation from a 1973 book on sex education in the Christian home by an evangelical author and commissioned by a conservative evangelical publisher who had asked Dr. James Dobson (yes, that James Dobson) to write the foreword. In the book’s section on abortion, which objectively informed the reader of both the physiological and legal aspects (including the Supreme Court ruling that had just passed), there appeared this nonjudgmental paragraph:

“There are sharp differences among Christians with regard to abortion. Some consider it murder; others say the operation might be an act of mercy. Some believe that the soul enters the fetus at conception. Others feel that the zygote (fertilized ovum) is just a cell that may become a potential human being but is not yet one at the moment, and hence its removal is not ‘murder.’ The Bible is silent on the subject, although some Christians believe Exodus 21:22, 23 may indicate a developing embryo or fetus was not regarded as a full human being, since inflicting an injury on a pregnant women which resulted in its loss was to be punished by a fine rather than by death, under the ‘life for life’ law.”
(from Sex Is a Parent Affair: Help for Parents in Teaching Their Children about Sex by Letha Scanzoni, Regal Books Division of G/L Press [Gospel Light], 1973, p.147)
https://eewc.com/evangelicals-open-diff ... -abortion/
#15006660
I would like to add people who claim pregnancy and childbirth being merely an inconvenience to that motion.

I'd like to see them try it, that's all.

And what about those morons who claim men should be able to have an abortion because it's "not fair" women can do it?
#15006664
@snapdragon It's only fair that if a man gets pregnant, he has the same rights to abort the baby as the woman does.



:lol:
#15006934
My Brother Raped Me and my Anti-Abortion State Senator Didn't care

As the bill made its way out of committee and onto the floor for a vote, I went to almost every single senator's office [Editor’s note: there are 33]. I had an emotional breakdown in every office, reading my brother’s indictment word for word, looking in their faces, trying to get them to understand how much pain I was in. There’s a tendency for Republicans to say that rape and incest are such rare things that they shouldn't even factor into the conversation about abortion. But if it happened to me, it can happen to anyone.

Let me tell you: When you sit down with the person who is supposed to represent you and tell him the most painful story of your life, and he’s looking at his phone and not the tears running down your face, it starts to feel a little hopeless.

There was a moment with my own state senator, Republican Andrew Brenner, when he mentioned something about, “That’s why I believe in guns and safety.” And I said, “I was a child. You don't fix a child being raped by giving that child a gun. That’s so dumb.”

He just kept saying that he’s pro-life. So I responded, "I understand you think abortion is morally wrong, and I’m not trying to change your mind on that. But what I am trying to open your mind to is that it is equally morally wrong to force a victim of rape and incest to carry that baby to term." He said there was some logic to that. And I thought that maybe, just maybe, I’d gotten through to him—maybe he would vote for an amendment adding exceptions for rape and incest to the bill.


Well maybe if you wanted a GOP politician to care about you you should have been a fetus, you dumb slut.
#15006991
They needed to ban abortions in Alabama. The birthrate would be 0, if 11 year olds were allowed to have abortions for rape and incest.
#15007541
Godstud wrote:They needed to ban abortions in Alabama. The birthrate would be 0, if 11 year olds were allowed to have abortions for rape and incest.

"Abortion" is just another word for murder.
#15007549
Hindsite wrote:"Abortion" is just another word for murder.
It's this sort of melodramatic clap-trap that makes the pro-lifers look stupid. :lol: :knife:
#15007624
There's a delightful story of a Greek philosopher being asked by one of his students to define a man. The philosopher said that man was a featherless biped. Next morning, the student brought to the philosopher a plucked chicken.

So, with that admonitory tale before us, can someone define a human being for me?
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