[Big Steve-1]

The military is not in the business of governing. So the notion that the military will just rise up and mutiny against a Trump power grab I think is a bit unrealistic

I think it's kind of funny that you find the notion of the military rising up against Dictator Trump unrealistic, but you think the idea of Trump moving to become a dictator is completely plausible.

[Pants-of-dog]

You're suggesting, if only by admission, that Democrats are pure and trustworthy. I completely reject that. There are good people and bad people on each side of the aisle.

No, my claim says nothing about Democrats except that they are not as obvious when using lies and myths to attack democracy.

So, we agree that the Democrats are not pure and not trustworthy.

And if that is your only criticism of my claim, then you do not deny my claim.

[Big Steve-3]

No, my claim says nothing about Democrats...

Exactly correct! You're not critical of them an iota, yet you rake Republicans over the coals.

[Politics_Observer]

@Harley

Clinton should've been removed from office, but he wasn't, and somehow we managed to survive.

We will weather this, as well.

That's a good point you make. I do agree that Clinton broke the law and I like Clinton. But I am fair. He did break the law. But I also think the Republicans were playing a "gotcha" game with Clinton instead of trying to remove him over a serious violation of law like say treason for example. In my view, a sitting President should be able to be indicted and face criminal charges as any normal citizen. If a President violates the law, he should be handcuffed, arrested and be brought to trial immediately to face trial while the Vice President assumes the office of the Presidency. I don't understand why we should have this notion of impeachment.

A sitting President should simply be held to the same standards as your ordinary citizen who is not President. If he breaks the law, then he would have to immediately step down ASAP right then and there from the Office of the Presidency and face criminal charges while the next person in the chain of command assumes the Office of the Presidency. Representatives and Presidents should be held to the same standard as everybody else and should be punished for violating the law like everybody else. We shouldn't have double standards. But we do.

That being said, all we can do is see what the future will bring.

[Pants-of-dog]

Exactly correct! You're not critical of them an iota, yet you rake Republicans over the coals.

This is not relevant to my claims. I am currently focusing on Republicans because it is that sp3cific party that is currently pushing the US towards a dictatorship. Most Democrats just support dictatorships abroad.

Back to the topic:

If future POTUS act like this or worse, the US will probably become a dictatorship within our lifetimes.

[Sivad]

I am currently focusing on Republicans because it is that sp3cific party that is currently pushing the US towards a dictatorship.

It's not the Republicans that are spearheading the charge to censor the internet, strip people of their parental rights, their right to self-defense, their rights to bodily integrity and informed consent, and their religious liberties. The Democrats are the ones pushing all that(when they're not colluding with the deep state and the corrupt corporate media to soft coup a democratically elected president). They're also looking to impose extreme energy austerity via carbon prices and "green energy" mandates. The Democrats are an authoritarian nightmare, they are the "liberal fascisti" that Wells called for in his 1932 speech at Oxford.

Most Democrats just support dictatorships abroad.

You support dictatorship abroad. You support dictatorship at home too. Your only problem with the Republicans is they're not your brand of fascist. You're a hardcore red fascist and they're rightwing protofascists.

[Pants-of-dog]

It's not the Republicans that are spearheading the charge to censor the internet, strip people of their parental rights, their right to self-defense, their rights to bodily integrity and informed consent, and their religious liberties. The Democrats are the ones pushing all that(when they're not colluding with the deep state and the corrupt corporate media to soft coup a democratically elected president). They're also looking to impose extreme energy austerity via carbon prices and "green energy" mandates. The Democrats are an authoritarian nightmare, they are the "liberal fascisti" that Wells called for in his 1932 speech at Oxford.

I knew it was just a matter of time before you jumped in to defend Trump with a whataboutism. Or tu quoque fallacy, if you prefer to think of yourself as an intellectual.

Anyway, the thread is not about Democrats (who are just as bad) nor does the evil of Democrats excuse the actions of Trump.

You support dictatorship abroad. You support dictatorship at home too. Your only problem with the Republicans is they're not your brand of fascist. You're a hardcore red fascist and they're rightwing protofascists.

You invariably start with insults when you run out of arguments.

This is your first post in the thread, right?

[Sivad]

You invariably start with insults when you run out of arguments.

How is it an insult? You do support dictatorships, you have defended dictatorships at length on this board.

[Sivad]

I knew it was just a matter of time before you jumped in to defend Trump with a whataboutism. Or tu quoque fallacy, if you prefer to think of yourself as an intellectual.

you still haven't got one of your fallacy calls right. you're like 0 for 50 now.

when you claim the Republicans are "that sp3cific party that is currently pushing the US towards a dictatorship" it isn't a fallacy to show why that's wrong.

[Pants-of-dog]

@Sivad

You have not shown that it is incorrect to say that the Republicans are pushing the USA towards dictatorship. All you have shown is that the Democrats do it too.

[Patrickov]

@Sivad

You have not shown that it is incorrect to say that the Republicans are pushing the USA towards dictatorship. All you have shown is that the Democrats do it too.

IMHO he is making accusation on a possible hypocrisy, i.e. supporting a form of dictatorship while denouncing another.

[Pants-of-dog]

We all know @Sivad thinks I am a hypocrite, and no one cares. Even if I were a hypocrite, I am still right.

[late]

You're only saying that because you're not going to get your way.

The best legal minds in the country think this is a miscarriage of justice.

A Show Trial with a predetermined outcome is no trial at all.

A trial conducted without primary evidence and witnesses is no trial at all.

Like everything I see from the Right these days, it's fake.

[blackjack21]

The best legal minds in the country think this is a miscarriage of justice.

The entire thing was part of the Democratic party witch hunt. We all knew the outcome even before the House hearings, because there was nothing on the level of treason or bribery. It was just an exercise designed to damage Trump's reputation. It failed miserably. Instead it tarnished the reputation of Nancy Pelosi, who was the ringleader of this ill-advised adventure--something she herself opposed when her judgement was a little better.

A Show Trial with a predetermined outcome is no trial at all.

The charges were wanting, so there was no need of a trial in the first place.

A trial conducted without primary evidence and witnesses is no trial at all.

All of the witnesses from the House were part of the record. Republicans were even able to use the House's witnesses--controlled entirely by the Democrats--against the Democrat's case for impeachment. Pam Bondi's presentation of the Joe and Hunter Biden timeline was precisely the affirmative defense I told you would be coming. It did, and Senators who had not paid attention to the press were influenced by that presentation, as they were with Alan Dershowitz's presentation.

Like everything I see from the Right these days, it's fake.

Mirroring Trump's rhetoric, I see.

[late]

The entire thing was part of the Democratic party witch hunt. We all knew the outcome even before the House hearings, because there was nothing on the level of treason or bribery. It was just an exercise designed to damage Trump's reputation. It failed miserably. Instead it tarnished the reputation of Nancy Pelosi, who was the ringleader of this ill-advised adventure--something she herself opposed when her judgement was a little better.

There is an army of people, former prosecutors, judges, constitutional scholars, law historians, etc, that know you are full of it. I just started a book by 2 of the authors of Lawfare, the conservative legal website. To say they don't agree with you is understatement. But you do know how to repeat the same lies every day.

" They (the book's authors) describe Trump’s presidency as “devoid of process and fundamentally about the vanity of the individual.” The book cites Trump’s view of law enforcement as a shield for allies and a weapon against enemies. He refuses any scrutiny of his conduct by Congress, courts or the free press. He conducts foreign policy on “whim and tantrum.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/how-trump-may-change-the-presidency-forever/2020/01/30/8dd7d8b6-36cf-11ea-9541-9107303481a4_story.html







https://www.amazon.com/Unmaking-Presidency-Donald-Trumps-Powerful/dp/0374175365/ref=sr_1_1?crid=18L3IRDHDNEN9&keywords=unmaking+of+a+presidency&qid=1580746670&sprefix=unmaking+o%2Caps%2C154&sr=8-1

[blackjack21]

There is an army of people, former prosecutors, judges, constitutional scholars, law historians, etc, that know you are full of it.

There are an army of them who don't even know I exist.

I just started a book by 2 of the authors of Lawfare, the conservative legal website.

"Lawfare" is a portmanteau of "law" and "warfare" and generally involves using law as a weapon in a manner unintended by the law. So I rather doubt this is "conservative" in any realistic sense.

To say they don't agree with you is understatement. But you do know how to repeat the same lies every day.

To say I've been on the winning side of these political arguments for the most part for the last 5 years, and the political left and the establishment has been on the losing side for the most part is also an understatement. Are you tired of losing yet?

There are so many former Democrats/independents that have grown tired of where the Democratic party has gone. They see right through the whole charade. Take a millennial like Tim Pool. He can't stand Trump, but is constantly put in the position of defending him because of the outrageous behavior of the Democrats.

You may think you're helping your cause, but you are losing the center and by that you are going to lose the election too. Hell, even Dershowitz got up there and said he voted for Hillary Clinton.

[jimjam]

History Lesson

When the left walked out on Mussolini, he declared the Italian parliament closed for business and himself the uncontested ruler of Italy.

When the South walked out of Congress, the Yankees passed their package of legislation that the Southern rebels had been blocking.

Best to show up and fight for control of the government than to hand it over to your opposition by default.

[Tainari88]

History Lesson

When the left walked out on Mussolini, he declared the Italian parliament closed for business and himself the uncontested ruler of Italy.

When the South walked out of Congress, the Yankees passed their package of legislation that the Southern rebels had been blocking.

Best to show up and fight for control of the government than to hand it over to your opposition by default.

I say it was like I thought. A waste of time and effort.

Jimjam, there needs to be a serious cleaning of both parties. If it is not done?

You will get the same problems getting increasingly worse til there is a serious vacuum of power and problems and an eventual result that will be hard to peddle back.

Either way? I feel good. One has to make a decision in life and move on. You can't wait for people to wake up from their stupor and take action if they refuse to do the work required to win an election well.

You got to win the election. If you can't do it because the Democrats are fake Leftists? You got to accept being defeated and four more years of Donald J. and his conman ways. That is the way the political cookie crumbles. You accepted those fake Leftists who kiss ass and sellout...the result is the conman. That is reality.

[Big Steve-1]

You accepted those fake Leftists who kiss ass and sellout...the result is the conman. That is reality.

It's like I always say: Trump's not the problem in this country, he's the result of the problems in this country.

I mean, seriously, how did this guy beat out, what, 24 other candidates for the job? How the Hell did that happen?

That happened because the American people were sick and tired of Washington bullshit.

[Big Steve-1]

I'm currently streaming the closing arguments.

You can tell the Democrats know they've failed. They're whining like nobody's business.

I'm glad this bullshit's coming to an end.