[Atlantis]

Following a referendum for limiting immigration, the Swiss need to impose quotas on EU migrants by Feb. 2017. The quotas will violate current treaties Switzerland has with the EU. A so-called guillotine motion would automatically cut cooperation between the EU and Switzerland in six fields if the Swiss were to go ahead with their plans to limit immigration.

Due to the Brexit vote, the EU is hardly able to make any concessions to Switzerland and will likely have to take a tough line on the Swiss, since any concession would be exploited by the UK in its own negotiations.

This puts the Swiss between a rock and a hard place because the loss of EU business could prove to take some percentage points off GDP.

For the finance industries, the loss of the UK government as lobbyist in Brussels could prove even more damaging. The EU is now likely to go ahead with new financial regulations and measures against tax evasion that could impact Swiss financial institutions and the City.

The EU should not pamper the financial institutions of two of the richest countries in Europe that want to profit from the common market without contributing their fair share.

[Glen]

The EU does not distinguish between the free movement of settlers and the free movement of labour, which I suspect is the Swiss complaint.

[Atlantis]

You mean you can work in a country without living there?

That is limited to border regions on the continent where people commute daily across the border.

In all other case, you get an EU residence permit after you have found a job.

[Glen]

You mean you can work in a country without living there?

No, I suggest a more stable model is to have work (or a guaranteed job offer) before buying or renting a home there.

The uncontrolled migrations stem from people crossing borders without having a job to go to, which is not the same as free movement of labour.

[Atlantis]

As I said, you cannot get an EU residence permit unless you have a job.

I know that because I have lived and worked in a number of EU countries.

[Rugoz]

Swexit? That's the name for the Swedish exit.

The quotas will violate current treaties Switzerland has with the EU. A so-called guillotine motion would automatically cut cooperation between the EU and Switzerland in six fields if the Swiss were to go ahead with their plans to limit immigration.

All 28 members would have to agree on canceling the treaties. One of our neighbors might veto it.

It's not certain what the Swiss government will do when the negotiations fail. The initiative called for renegotiation of the treaties, not their cancellation. So either the government sets quotas and hopes the EU will play along, or there will be a new referendum on the cancellation.

[Atlantis]

All 28 members would have to agree on canceling the treaties. One of our neighbors might veto it.

I thought the guillotine would be automatic once Switzerland violated its part of the treaty? For one country (Austria?) to use its veto won't look good. Most countries try to use their veto sparingly.

It's not certain what the Swiss government will do when the negotiations fail. The initiative called for renegotiation of the treaties, not their cancellation. So either the government sets quotas and hopes the EU will play along, or there will be a new referendum on the cancellation.

I don't think there will be substantial negotiations in time for a Feb. 2017 agreement. By then, the EU may still not know what the UK is going to do.

The referendum is not binding for the EU though. If Switzerland doesn't comply with its part of the deal, the EU will have to react. I guess Switzerland will try to change the immigration regulation just a tiny bit, so that the EU will only have to react a tiny bit.

[Baff]

They will give Switzerland a placebo fine and carry on.
All these things are a giant bodge up. Every country an exception to the rules.


Plus the writing is one the wall for free movement of people in Europe.
That one is going to disappear from the treaty very soon now. Or be quietly side-lined and ignored.

[Glen]

As I said, you cannot get an EU residence permit unless you have a job.

The EU residence permit can be claimed after working in an EU/EEA country for 5 years, and having one permits you to settle permanently at any time in the future without needing a job.

It is not similar to requiring migrants to have found work before entering a country.

[Bosnjak]

Switzerland is nearly a EU-Member, just without voting right...

[Glen]

They will give Switzerland a placebo fine and carry on.

That would effectively approve the UK introducing its own unilateral restrictions on the freedom of movement.

[Glen]

Switzerland is nearly a EU-Member, just without voting right...

Nearly being an EU member means not being an EU member.

[Baff]

By Glen -  Tue 26 Jul 2016, 00:34

“
Baff wrote:
They will give Switzerland a placebo fine and carry on.”
That would effectively approve the UK introducing its own unilateral restrictions on the freedom of movement.

Their approval isn't required. The UK will do this and they have no approval to offer any more.

Since other countries are doing it anyway, they can effectively approve this for their own countries, or lose the union.
Free movement is over. The migration crisis has seen to that.

[Glen]

Which countries are unilaterally controlling inter-European migrations?

The irony is that the Brexit vote was a reaction to EU free movement policies, which EEA countries adopt. If the new status quo is to ignore those free movement policies then the agreements have materially changed and the UK government has no mandate to persist with Brexit.

[Thompson_NCL]

Which countries are unilaterally controlling inter-European migrations?

The irony is that the Brexit vote was a reaction to EU free movement policies, which EEA countries adopt. If the new status quo is to ignore those free movement policies then the agreements have materially changed and the UK government has no mandate to persist with Brexit.

So you think, but that was not the basis of the referendum so it's immaterial.

[Glen]

So you think, but that was not the basis of the referendum so it's immaterial.

So you think, but I suggest that applying moral principles (i.e. reasonable doubt) is always materially relevant.

The topic of immigration was acknowledged as being the significant issue by leaders on both sides of the debate. To press for some other agenda would be disingenuous.

[Baff]

By Glen -  Tue 26 Jul 2016, 10:15

Which countries are unilaterally controlling inter-European migrations?



The irony is that the Brexit vote was a reaction to EU free movement policies, which EEA countries adopt. If the new status quo is to ignore those free movement policies then the agreements have materially changed and the UK government has no mandate to persist with Brexit.

Unilateral border controls in Europe
Switzerland is and the UK is about to.

Previously all those EU countries on the migration route to Germany.
Greece's and Germany's neighbours for example.

I think the Danes and the Dutch might also have set some limits. Maybe the Swedes.
Lots of low level stuff. But it's been going on for a while now. Little infraction here, a little infraction there. Borders re manned. Fences erected.



UK government mandate.
The UK government has no mandate to join the EU.
It does have a mandate however to leave.

It has no mandate to entreat with the EU in any way and never did.

If the UK government does not Brexit, then it has no mandate to govern. We will kill them.
And then you will try to help them and we will kill you. And then your friends will kill us and the whole world will kill each other.

As we transist from Democracy to Fascism, there will be a civil war. It's inevitable. So lets not do that.

No means no, mate.
It really does.

We are Brexiting. The decision has been made. Respect that and continue to enjoy the freedom we allow you.

[Glen]

Thank you for mentioning countries you suspect of having immigration controls. Can you cite sources please? In light of this information, what do you think the implications for Switzerland will be? How will this impact UK-EU negotiations?

No means no, mate.
It really does.

We are Brexiting. The decision has been made. Respect that and continue to enjoy the freedom we allow you.

You are trying to use historic opportunity to reinforce blanket power, without disclosing the new agenda.
You attack threats to one worldview without discussing the merits of another worldview.
Your authoritarian tone suggests you assume your opponents are weaker.

This is supposed to be a discussion forum.

[KlassWar]

By Glen -  Tue 26 Jul 2016, 00:34

“
Baff wrote:
They will give Switzerland a placebo fine and carry on.”
That would effectively approve the UK introducing its own unilateral restrictions on the freedom of movement.

Their approval isn't required. The UK will do this and they have no approval to offer any more.

Since other countries are doing it anyway, they can effectively approve this for their own countries, or lose the union.
Free movement is over. The migration crisis has seen to that.

Then the union is over. Free movement of capital with captive labor markets will mean the EU immediately loses Southern and Eastern Europe in full.

[Glen]

Then the union is over. Free movement of capital with captive labor markets will mean the EU immediately loses Southern and Eastern Europe in full.

The free movement of labour has vague meaning, and it is defined only by the policies that implement it.

Requiring a person to have a job offer before rehoming their family in the new country is fundamentally different to allowing a person to relocate before they have received a job offer. Neither is in itself can represent free or captive labour. Whether these scenarios promote the free movement of labour or undermine the free movement of labour will depend on the economic environment to which those policies are applied.

Any free movement policy will pressure incumbent labour forces in unforeseen ways, and its difficult to model the details, but we know that any pan-European policy on free movement will pressure the incumbent labour forces of London and Belarus in very different ways.

The EU faces additional challenges because the states have followed different economic paths for generations. The issue is reconciling internal differences with blanket policies and that requires good will all round.