fokker wrote:Brexit at all cost as Boris Johnson wants to carry it out will be a chaotic event with possibly severe economic consequences. Economic turmoil will hit most the weakest social classes which includes pensioners. And with Tories in power, it cannot be expected pensions will be on their priority list. Why on earth pensioners would support a chaotic Brexit when long term stability is in their vital interest as they do not have time to wait out the turbulent years.
To me as an observer the following should happen:
1.) New elections after requesting extension to article 50. Justification for article 50 will be carrying out new elections due to indecisive parliament.
2.) New referendum being held on Brexit, with 2 rounds this time. First round all available options (no Brexit, hard Brexit, Brexit with agreement negotiated by Teresa May), 2nd round to choose the best from winning options.
3.) Parliament should approve the form of Brexit that won in referendum
2nd referendum is not undemocratic at all. People's opinions continue to evolve, their preferences change, which is why there are parliamentary elections being held periodically (can also be called early). Referendum always reflects will of the people, therefore it cannot be undemocratic regardless of how many times it is repeated. British general public fails to understand Brexit is such a complex, problematic and divisive action that single referendum and standard parliamentary procedures cannot deal with it. There is no conspiracy to derail Brexit. Unlike when on the brink of war, there is no pressure or motivation for a quick decision, therefore there is small chance for a national unity in parliament to carry Brexit out.
Well,I think you will find that pensioners are not too happy with the Tories since they have been in power again.
Some 40% of pensioners lie below the bottom two quintile income groups,those people receive less than the Pension Credit level of income than those receiving it.
Pensioners, who have worked 50 years are entitled to the same Basic State Pension as younger pensioners on the new pension system, but, no, they do not receive it, that is discrimination.
If a man was born before 06 April 1951, or a woman, before 06 April 1953, both would be in receipt of the 'old' BSP of £125.95 p.wk.
if they have no other income, they would be entitled to Pension Credit, in order to top up their income to the P.C level.
But, if those same people on the B.S.P had worked 50 years, with an additional small private(occupational )pension that just exceeds the P.C level, then, effectively, the 'difference', that is the additional pension, is being used by the government to subside the difference between the 'old' B.S.P - P.C level, when any claim for P.C is made.
But further, a P.C pensioner gets additional 'entitlements' that other poorer pensioners do not get in similar or worse circumstances, say, from utility companies, dental treatments etc & looked at in the round it's easy to see that Tory polices under CAMERON-OSBORNE have left many pensioners worse-off.
OSBORNE reduced the level at which pensioners can claim P.C, thus making things even more difficult for them & in my book, my empathy lies with those pensioners getting the rough end of the stick after 50 years of working.
Pensioners are not interested in 'stability', they do not have a future horizon in which to make any grand plans, the only pensioners supporting the Tories, are the rich or better-off ones, who have had years, in which successive governemnts have forgone tax revenues,that have effectively been used to line the pockets of the rich,better-off pensioners pension fund companies.
That amounted to the tune of £40 BILLION a year, thus inflating the pension funds & current incomes of those people when they were working.
Now, I think that Additional Pension Contribution Relief should be scrapped, having been in existence since 1903, the money saved,could be used to pay the older pensioners a proper pension, the rest used to close the fiscal gap, with some used to create an investment fund worth £BILLIONS, as Start-Up Capital for young people to create their own businesses.
Once the Tory government have delivered
Leave, those poorer pensioners have no more interest in the Tories than other poorer people,but, thats quite a lot of voters to lose for a political party in 'difficulties' of sorts & the same effects apply to the other parties that have neglected poorer pensioners such as Labour.
A second referendum is undemocratic, because the first one has not been implemented.
Also, why not apply your statement to general elections, people may regret voting this or that way,with 5 years, in which to endure the consequences or otherwise, would you think that, because you change your mind, that entitles you to another election, so that,like a referendum,you can swing your vote, or hope that enough people elsewhere would do so,just to change the result.
What you are suggesting, is that 'people can have their cake & eat it', as long as they get their 'cake', screw everyone else.
There will be none of it, the people voted one way in the 2016 referendum, that has\must be delivered, any party wishing another referendum should put it to the people in their election manifesto's & not try to game the system like Labour by circumventing an election with it's parliamentary shenanigans.
Doing the above, is the only honest approach, frustrating Brexit is absolutely dishonest & destructive of our already diminished 'democratic' credentials.