[Wilhelm]

From eltiempo.com

Estados Unidos no acepta triunfo de Chávez y pide investigar acusaciones de fraude

El Departamento de Estado pidió una investigación rápida, completa y transparente de las acusaciones de la oposición, que denunció un fraude.

El pronunciamiento se hizo pese a que el triunfo del mandatario venezolano fue confirmado por la Organización de Estado Americanos (OEA) y el Centro Carter.

"Tomamos nota del anuncio de la OEA y del Centro Carter de que su rápido conteo fue consistente con los resultados preliminares del Consejo Nacional Electoral (CNE)", dijo Tom Casey, un portavoz del Departamento de Estado.

"También tomamos nota de su oferta de trabajar con la oposición para realizar una investigación completa de los resultados y examinar cualquier preocupación que haya surgido", añadió.

"Alentamos al CNE a permitir una auditoría transparente para enfrentar cualquier preocupación y asegurar a los ciudadanos venezolanos que el referendo fue libre y justo", dijo Casey a periodistas.

La OEA y el Centro Carter avalaron este lunes los resultados ofrecidos por el CNE, según el cual Chávez propinó un contundente golpe a la oposición al ganar el referendo por más de 57% de los votos, pese a las protestas de la oposición, que afirman que hubo irregularidades en la votación y un fraude masivo.

Pese a la negativa de Washington de sumarse a la evaluación del Centro Carter y la OEA, un funcionario del Departamento de Estado que pidió el anonimato dijo que Estados Unidos no estaba convencido de que las acusaciones de la oposición eran ciertas.

"Si la oposición siente que tienen evidencia creíble de fraude, necesitan presentarla", dijo el funcionario. "Debe ser revisada y observada. Una vez que eso suceda, entonces en teoría tenemos algo sobre lo cual todos estamos de acuerdo y podemos vivir con eso", añadió.

El funcionario señaló que el pronunciamiento de la OEA y el Centro Carter se basa sólo en resultados preliminares difundidos por las autoridades electorales venezolanas y que debe hacerse una verdadera evaluación una vez se conozcan los resultados finales.

"El Consejo Nacional Electoral aún no tiene sus resultados finales, así que no estamos en posición de dar esto por terminado", indicó el funcionario.

Chávez mantiene una fuerte amistad con el presidente cubano, Fidel Castro, y se opuso a la guerra en Irak liderada por Washington, pero su país es al mismo tiempo el quinto exportador mundial de petróleo y suministra a Estados Unidos entre el 12% y el 15% de sus insumos de crudo.

El mandatario venezolano ha acusado a Estados Unidos de financiar la campaña para derrocarlo e insiste en que Washington estuvo detrás del golpe de abril de 2002 que lo sacó del poder durante menos de 48 horas.

Source: http://eltiempo.terra.com.co/inte/latin/2004-08-16/ARTICULO-WEB-_NOTA_INTERIOR-1768141.html

Google translations sucks, so I'll write a summary in English myself:

The U.S. did not accept Chavez's triumph and asked for an investigation which would confirm or deny the claims from the opposition of an electoral fraud. The statement was made even after the OAS delegation led by OAS secretary general Cesar Gaviria and the Carter Group delegatoin led by Jimmy Carter confirmed Chavez's triumph. State Department spokesman Tom Casey asked for the investigation to "confirm to the Venezuelan people that the referendum was free and fair", and to clear any doubts that the opposition might have. A State Department employee who chose to remain un-named told El Tiempo that the State Department was not yet convinced of the claims of the opposition, but still chose to not accept the suport to the referendum results from the OAS and the Carter Group.

Anyway, this was expected. The US government wants Chavez out of power by any means necessary, even if it is supporting the childish cries of the opposition, who are really pissed off because they didn't win.

[fastspawn]

No no, the Venezuelen elections are not free and fair, Free and Fair elections are when you strike voters who you deem less likely to vote for you from your lists.

Also other methods of holding and winning free and fair elections:
1. Appeal to the Supreme Court ,who coincidentally happen to be your family friends, to stop any recount.
2. Allow votes that come in past the dateline to count.
3. Lose the popular vote by half a million votes.

[Napuljun]

And for those who don't know Spanish? I think there must be a rule to post only in English! Or is there already?

[Wilhelm]

That's why I did a rough translation.

[Seán Himmelb(L)au]

What right exactly does the US have to question this? Are they really allowed, and how would they go about it?

[Clann]

Answer?

[bach]

The state department surely didnt like the results, but theres not that much they can do about it, after all they have never fully recognized Chavez' government.

I can just imagine the republicans going nuts and screaming one to each other, "WHY CARTER, WHY? wasnt there anybody else to send overthere" and the idiot of carter sitting somewhere just drinking and doing nothing. They could have sent nobody and done the same that sending Carter.

Anyway, the best thing the opposition could do is wait until 2006 for Chavez to finish, and stop making fools of themselves around the world, now the day will come in which Chavez is going to really cheat and nobody is going to beleive them.

Anyhow, theres always the option of murdering Chavez, but I really dont see these people capable of anything, they should have shot him from the very begining, but now everybody is looking and it is just not an option anymore.

[QatzelOk]

I think it's great that Jimmy Carter got to go to Latin America this time... Instead of Oliver North, terrorist superstar.

[Gnote]

I think this is just another failure of American foreign policy.

Quit worrying about what's going on in Venezuela and try to stop people from killing each other on your own streets.

Sweep off your own porch first before you start to worry about others'.

[Comrade Ogilvy]

I think this is just another failure of American foreign policy.

Quit worrying about what's going on in Venezuela and try to stop people from killing each other on your own streets.

Sweep off your own porch first before you start to worry about others'.

LOLOL... you must be an american, either that or you dont recognize the irony of your statement.

[Wilhelm]

The State Department was forced to recognize Chavez's triumph.

and the idiot of carter sitting somewhere just drinking and doing nothing. They could have sent nobody and done the same that sending Carter.

Carter's organization did oversee the voting and counting. Their reports showed no fraud. A separate commission led by OAS secretary general Cesar Gaviria (Colombian ex-president) confirmed that there was no electoral fraud and that Chavez won by a wide margin.

[bach]

:lol: Thats terrific, but Carter and Gaviria are pretty much the same, of course I have no problem with them saying that there was no fraud, because I support chavez.

However, Carter and Gaviria are both, lets say the dumb presidetns of each of their countries, they have a nice record but, underneath all, they are just a fraud.

For instance Mr Gaviria, sure he was prsident when Pablo Escobar was killed, but so was he the one who authorized pablo to build his own jail, so that he was not be extradited. Equally, he was the one who let Escobar scape when the US authorities ordered the extradition, so on.

So none of those two have a bit of authority, sure they make for a good show, but they are just that, show!! good for chavez.

[Wilhelm]

I think Carter was a good president.

Gaviria, not so good. But not for the Escobar reasons. The idiots in the National Police were responsible for everything, and utlimately responsible for killing him. The president has nothing to do with that. Gaviria started neo-liberalism in Colombia. The deal today with the hated FTA was started by him. It is the very thing that Chavez fights in Venezuela. It's a very good thing that likely political enemies of Chavez would confirm his triumph.

[bach]

Chavez

"Cuatro descocados que andan por allí gritando fraude y diciendo que la OEA, las Naciones Unidas, y todos los países del mundo, bueno, se confabularon un sátelite ruso y de los marcianos, que tambien daban vueltas por allí, para hacer un fraude que nadie ve," dijo Chávez en tono de burla.

El ex presidente venezolano Carlos Andrés Pérez

"Esa no es la vía y y yo estoy trabajando para sacar a Chávez. La vía violenta permitirá sacarlo. Es la única que tenemos. Yo soy una parte de ese batallón. Así como lo oye debe entenderlo: yo soy parte de ese batallón", subrayó el ex presidente, comentarios que fueron rechazados públicamente por la opositora Coordinadora Democrática.

True Gaviria was not only bad for the Escobar issues, he was bad for a lot of reasons, anyway, he was getting hit with bombs all day, so he chose to cut a deal with Escobar. As far as the police killing Escobar it is true, but most of the job was done by los PEPES, and their atacks against Escobar's organization.

Sure Carter was a good president, no doubt, but he is more like a good grandfather who frogets things and sometimes makes very naive mistakes. he just slow.

As far as the neo-"privatization" I think Gaviria really pushed it forward more than it was already being pushed from the outside, however Uribe is doing a lot more than Gaviria, he relly is selling state companies. I really dont know how Gaviria is going to do with his new job as professor at columbia university, horrible to listen ot him for hours.




http://www.terra.com.co/actualidad/inte ... 87503.html

http://www.terra.com.co/actualidad/ulti ... 87492.html

[Wilhelm]

Yes, I herad about the perez news. The guy advocates violent overthrow of Chavez's government.

As far as the neo-"privatization" I think Gaviria really pushed it forward more than it was already being pushed from the outside, however Uribe is doing a lot more than Gaviria, he relly is selling state companies. I really dont know how Gaviria is going to do with his new job as professor at columbia university, horrible to listen ot him for hours.

Sure, Uirbe is doing the dirty work, but the ground work for selling the country to foreign multinationals was laid by Gaviria, Samper, and Pastrana.