[JohnRawls]

Reading comprehension son.... the American revolution wanted to install Washington king. read dude

True leftist movement wanted to install the king ? My reading comprehension is here but do you seriously think that any leftist wants a king

[Bulaba Khan Jones]

True leftist movement wanted to install the king ? My reading comprehension is here but do you seriously think that any leftist wants a king

Oxy is but one of many people who believe the urban legend that Washington was offered to be made king.

[Oxymoron]

True leftist movement wanted to install the king ? My reading comprehension is here but do you seriously think that any leftist wants a king

Dude you really have issues.... Americans were not leftist is my fucking point.

[Oxymoron]

Oxy is but one of many people who believe the urban legend that Washington was offered to be made king.

You have any real tangible proof of this, outside some ridiculous 1994 style site?

[Bulaba Khan Jones]

The link is 2007. It's an urban legend and isn't true. Washington never had the option of becoming king.

[Oxymoron]

The link is 2007. It's an urban legend and isn't true. Washington never had the option of becoming king.

Yes he did, and my point was that the site looks like it is from 1994.. cannot take it seriously.

[Bulaba Khan Jones]

If your feelings can't take academic sources seriously which debunk urban myths and then provide information on some reading material you can do on your own by historians who researched the matter thoroughly, I guess that's too bad. I'm sure you can Google something written for children with lots of pictures, simple vocabulary, and huge font if that helps.

[Potemkin]

Dude you really have issues.... Americans were not leftist is my fucking point.

Actually, the Founding Fathers were leftist, by the standards of their time. Thomas Jefferson, for example, was a vocal supporter of the French Jacobins during the Revolutionary Terror, and pronounced his opinion that if Robespierre had erred, it was in not being sufficiently ruthless against the enemies of the Revolution. And given the fact that the French Jacobins were the original 'leftists', as defined by their seating position in the French National Assembly, I think we can safely say that Thomas Jefferson, at least, was a leftist.

[skinster]

[Oxymoron]

Actually, the Founding Fathers were leftist, by the standards of their time. Thomas Jefferson, for example, was a vocal supporter of the French Jacobins during the Revolutionary Terror, and pronounced his opinion that if Robespierre had erred, it was in not being sufficiently ruthless against the enemies of the Revolution. And given the fact that the French Jacobins were the original 'leftists', as defined by their seating position in the French National Assembly, I think we can safely say that Thomas Jefferson, at least, was a leftist.

Compared to the levelers they were far to the right, and by English standards were hardly to the left.
Yes Jefferson might have been a leftist, but he was one of many founding fathers and hardly represents the majority. Most Americans were appalled by the French revolution.

[Potemkin]

Compared to the levelers they were far to the right, and by English standards were hardly to the left.

Yes they were. In fact, up until the start of the 20th century, American politics was far to the left of British politics (if we ignore the issue of slavery and the Jim Crow laws). It was only with the start of the Cold War that America swerved to the right, and it's been careering in that direction ever since.

Yes Jefferson might have been a leftist, but he was one of many founding fathers and hardly represents the majority. Most Americans were appalled by the French revolution.

I grant you that. Jefferson was hardly a representative figure among the American elite. Nevertheless, he was highly influential, and he helped to draft the Constitution. He was hardly a marginal figure.

[mikema63]

It was only with the start of the Cold War that America swerved to the right, and it's been careering in that direction ever since.

Perhaps one of the greatest ironies of the USSR is that they destroyed the left in the US, and may in the end succeed in destroying it entirely from beyond the grave.

[Bulaba Khan Jones]

Perhaps one of the greatest ironies of the USSR is that they destroyed the left in the US, and may in the end succeed in destroying it entirely from beyond the grave.

You think it's the USSR's fault that US businessmen, local and federal law enforcement, and the government worked together to harass, imprison, sometimes kill, and propagandize against the left (and sometimes not even leftists, just reformers or organized workers without a political angle) in the US? Before the USSR existed, the government, law enforcement, etc. did these things.

[mikema63]

Dude sometimes you don't really get when someone is making a joke. You really don't need to suddenly take some massive issue with some random thing as if the entire context of what I believe and have said suddenly disappeared.

No I don't think the ussr is the sole reason that US politics swung right, as pote pointed out it was a very useful and successful excuse and things would be different if it hadn't happened. Who knows if it would actually be better.

Since I apparently must always be 100% serious I think the evolution of American politics is a complex phenomenon with no single factor existing as a predominate cause. Sometimes it can be interesting to point to counter intuitive things that played into that extrodinarily complex history but pointing those things out does not mean that I think those things are the sole or major reason things are as they are today.

I apologize for not obsessively qualifying everything I say just in case you will suddenly have amnesia and act as if I am an entirely new poster you have never seen a post from before.

[Decky]

Good work Bulaba, you shot him down in flames.

[Bulaba Khan Jones]

Dude sometimes you don't really get when someone is making a joke. You really don't need to suddenly take some massive issue with some random thing as if the entire context of what I believe and have said suddenly disappeared.

No I don't think the ussr is the sole reason that US politics swung right, as pote pointed out it was a very useful and successful excuse and things would be different if it hadn't happened. Who knows if it would actually be better.

Since I apparently must always be 100% serious I think the evolution of American politics is a complex phenomenon with no single factor existing as a predominate cause. Sometimes it can be interesting to point to counter intuitive things that played into that extrodinarily complex history but pointing those things out does not mean that I think those things are the sole or major reason things are as they are today.

I apologize for not obsessively qualifying everything I say just in case you will suddenly have amnesia and act as if I am an entirely new poster you have never seen a post from before.

I'm not mad and I'm not calling you an idiot. You said something that looks nonsensical, and I responded to it.

[skinster]

I will join the off-topic conversation by saying that I'm reminded of chapter 14 of Howard Zinn's A People's History: War is the health of the state

The US is terrified of the actual left, anywhere. :D

[skinster]

[pikachu]

Little bit of self-promotion: Check out my new map of the Qalamoun Battle, up to August 15th.



Though the real reason I'm posting here is this neat summary of the Syrian Civil War I just stumbled upon on Youtube. It's over a month old but I don't know if it's been posted here yet.
[youtube]VaMGCgGgLRU[/youtube]

Enjoy.

[Rich]

Little bit of self-promotion: Check out my new map of the Qalamoun Battle, up to August 15th.

Do you have your own website or do you just do stuff for Wiki?