Do Afro-Americans care for Africa? - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Political issues and parties in the nations of Africa.

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#14675205
Almost all fertility and demographic predictions have failed.
In the middle east there started a big change where an average woman makes around 2 children now, instead of 6, just 30 years ago.
And in Africa the fertility rate already drops. Although its still extremely high.
I have no clue of what the demographics will be like in 90 years.
But I do know something doesn't work in the faculties of geographics.
#14675212
LehmanB wrote:This is one thing I can blame the white colonialist of. The senile straight borders, splitting tribes, creating artifitial identities without geographic basis, and planting tyrants to govern them, is a major factor to many wars and conflicts in Africa and the middle east.

For the most part, whenever older borders existed, we used them. Whenever there was a well-established political organization, we preserved it and built upon it.

But in many places the borders were already arbitrary before us, the informal product of constant conflicts. In some others there were only little territories, too little for a modern nation. In some others there were only sparse and intertwined ethnic groups.

This is best understood as an identity problem. In the west the main identity is the nationality since a few centuries (before that it was the religion, the village, the county, the duchy). In Africa it was the ethnic group. But ethnic groups have no well defined borders, some are very large and diffused over many nations, some are large and more or less cohabit with accepted groups, some are tiny. Some of those groups equated to kingdoms but most of them only had looser judicial structures coexisting within greater foreign legal entities.


None of this was fit for the modern era. We had to create proper nations where there weren't. This could have been better. Sometimes we didn't even have good maps of the region to begin with. But for the most part it is not our fault. And the fact there have been so many territorial conflicts is not new, they existed before us.


Europeans still did commit crimes no matter how much you wash it.

* Like the vast majority of westerners I fully acknowledge our crimes.
* I do not acknowledge responsibility for things we did not cause in the first place even though you blame us for them.
* If Muslims could have a tenth of the western self-criticism, the world would be much better. The history of Islam is a horrible one, a tale of slaughters, conquests, slavery, obscurantism and religious oppression.
#14675213
Harmattan,
Hey you don't have to justify it. But in fact it did created problems. In many cases the border fitted the border between the countries who controled the region (France / England / Germany). In other cases it will be a river. But in many cases it were straight borders, or agreements on resources (like Sikes Picco). The problems you've mantioned in too large state - like lack of feeling you are part of the nation- can occur also to artifitial countries.
Its right though that the palce wasn't organized before and that didn't fit the modern area.

Layman wrote:Not true. Census and fertitlity data is very good and the indicators reliable. Unforseen circumstances like war are always possible of course.

Demographics didn't foresee changes of fertility rate!! The big shift in the middle east- Egypt to Iran, caught everyone in surprise.
Now demographers do think in curved lines instead of endless straight growthrate in a straight line. but still they automaticaly accept the current situation and roll it to 100 years. Who says the whites wouldn't make many children in 50 years? Who says the process of modernization in India and Africa wouldn't cause much faster fertility decline? They just calculate when Russia or Japan will shrink to a quarter and Africa will be doubled.
I think that beyond 10 years they fail.
You have to add large percentage of possible changes of fertility rates changes, and that itself may cause large shifts in predictions. They all just don't understand what causes groups to multiply less or more, and always in surprise.
#14675223
The big shift in the middle east- Egypt to Iran, caught everyone in surprise.


not that big.

Image

Of course ntohing is 100%. Especially when predicting the next 50 years! Still, fertility has been reducing everywhere and we very well understand the factors that influence it. Female education and birth control/health care are big factors. The biggest perhaps. If places regress in that regard then it will make things worse.

The only thing that can prevent africa from following the path people have predicted here is a massive decrease in infant mortality rate and a massive increase in education, birth conrol, women in the workplace. This would have to happen pretty quick in order to stop the build up.
#14675226
You have to understand that as far as it goes to my country, it turned the table. And the same arguments about the failiour of prediction are sound here: well.. we don't calculate wars, immigration... Not only there is a decline in birthrate of Arabs, there is a rise of birthrate of Jews. Today its almost equal. Who ever foreseen this?

- but the demographers thought that only white guys and Japanese don't make kids. in the 80th no one thought it would leak, and so fast, onto the 3rd world. I learned at school that by 2050 we will be 11 billions. Now they say we will be 9. Just a decade passed and what a shift of prediction.

So add to the wars and immigration and apedemics in which demographers ignore, also not foreseeing changes of birthrates scale. The graph suggests a decline of birthrate in Africa is a new adaptaion demographers made , just recent years. Where were their predictions during the 90th? Total falior!

But hey, this time they are right.
#14675249
there are wars and deseases anyway. And they have enough territory and resources. They are far away from being as crowded as Europe or India. Now they are in a good progress thanks to the Chinese involvement, and the leak of internet to Africa that the USA pushes, to make it accessible everywhere.That might bring some change in many spots.
#14698808
Zionist Nationalist wrote:African overpopulation is going to bring more wars and starvation in that continent and eventually dramatic population decrease due to lack of resources for everybody.


No. People in third world countries use about 1/5th of the resources that a person in a first world country uses. So a country like the United States with an average of 2.2 children/woman is equivalent in terms of resource usage to a woman in Africa having 11 children. African birth rates are projected to fall with increasing women's education and reach the global average of about 2 children per woman by mid-century.
#14698809
LehmanB wrote:There are many Africans in other countries. In Brazil, USA, and in Europe.
They are much wealthier than those who stayed in Africa.

In Africa however there were horrible periods of famine, genocides, civil wars, and just extreme poverty, deseases and illiterates..

Basically till the Chinese have came, the only aid given was by .. whites. (white governments - not Brazil!), or white volounteers. Yeah, who goes to volunteer in Africa? White spoiled good hearted people.

My question is- don't blacks in rich countries feel they have to do more to their own ancestors? Or do they not feel anything special to Africa? I mean.. for how long can you blame the colonialism, when you don't really do something to your own group?

Just wondering.


I can't speak for Black people everywhere, but in America they tend to have much lower disposable incomes in part because of institutionalized racism. That plus a lot of the factors that others have mentioned may account for some of the differences.

http://www.theatlantic.com/internationa ... ry/380953/
#14698926
From what I read at the time, African-Americans look down on African immigrants, and probably consider Africans living in the African continent to be similarly inferior and less deserving than themselves. It's fairly ironic, but then nothing really makes sense when one deals with American identity politics and the 'African-American' subculture.
#14702081
The Sabbaticus wrote:From what I read at the time, African-Americans look down on African immigrants, and probably consider Africans living in the African continent to be similarly inferior and less deserving than themselves.

It makes perfect sense. Jews in Germany looked at Orthodox Jews from Poland as embarassing/ primitives. Cause they dressed and looked like the negative stereotipe , whereas the German Jews fully astimulated.
Islamic nations are very much ashamed of being accidently labled as Arabs; although Islam is Arabic culture. So they defend Islam but not its source.
#14722469
Scamp wrote:I remember watching a documentary in the 1980s. A village in Sub Saharan Africa had a terrible death and disease rate. So several American doctors went to see if they could help.

A small river ran through this village. The doctors noticed that the people of the village were using the river as a toilet. And they were also using the same river for drinking water and cooking.

The doctors told them not to do that.


human shit is the best fertilizer.

and dirty water can easy be cleaned, either by Coal filters, or UVC led lamps.



In middle age Europe people also Shitted in Water, so they had to drink the hole day weak Beer.



Just the Muslim world had a proper handling of water, but today the rivers of most muslim countries are full of garbage.... :(



Especially for farming societies are many childred desastrous, when the fathers has to split it to 3-4 Sons, so each field gets too small to be productive.

Egypt also produces more children then the economy Jobs, and their farming soil is small.
#14722515
The Sabbaticus wrote:From what I read at the time, African-Americans look down on African immigrants, and probably consider Africans living in the African continent to be similarly inferior and less deserving than themselves. It's fairly ironic, but then nothing really makes sense when one deals with American identity politics and the 'African-American' subculture.


I have witness this first hand. I live in a little college town. We get foreign students from Africa. The local African-Americans make fun of them because of their Blackness and their Whiteness. Most of them are well educated and well spoken.

I think Africa is a painful reminder of their past.
#14740506
I remember watching a documentary in the 1980s. A village in Sub Saharan Africa had a terrible death and disease rate. So several American doctors went to see if they could help.

A small river ran through this village. The doctors noticed that the people of the village were using the river as a toilet. And they were also using the same river for drinking water and cooking.

The doctors told them not to do that.

People were doing stuff like that even in Europe in the early 20th century. When the French novelist Louis-Ferdinand Celine was working as a doctor in southern France in the early 1920s, he investigated why one of the villages had a high mortality rate from disease. He discovered that the local drinking water was first percolating through the local graveyard before collecting in the wells and being drunk. He famously held up a glass of the water in front of the local dignitaries and informed them: "This isn't water, it's strained meat juice!" :lol:
#14841829
Scamp wrote:Americans already know this. So this question only goes out to foreigners...it's not your fault for being ignorant of this because your media is not truthful.

Take a guess. What racist whitey country provides by far much more in actual food aid to feed the poor starving Africans than any other country on Earth?


Brazil and China? Brazil build 2 out of the 3 largest hydroelectric in Africa, they didn't send HIV cocktails to Africa they build laboratories to Africans so they can produce their own and don't have to buy or wait for others to give it to them. Brazil was the country that broke a lot of patents, from cancer treatment cocktails to HIV cocktail, gave them for everyone for free. They also gave 3 billions to Africa. They don't want to give money to Africa anymore though, now seems only China is really investing over there.
#14841841
Do they care for Africa, as in, do they have a kind of affinity towards it? Hm, dunno.

Do they identify as African? Do yourselves a favour and check out the picture of Michelle Obama dressing as Beyoncé recently for her birthday. My jaw literally dropped..

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