[Wolfman]

Since I'm fucking tired of having to explain to people that I'm not a fucking Democrat (or any other political party, for that matter) I'm going to go through, point-by-point, the current political positions of the Democrats (as stated on their website), the Republicans (as stated on their website), and the four most significant of the third parties, The Green Party (which has a massive section, so I'll deal with them later), The Modern Whigs, The Libertarians, and the Socialist Party-USA*. I may simply respond with a comment to the effect of "Well, it would be nice if you actually did that", meaning I might be supportive of the idea, but the party isn't doing it in practice, so the issue is irrelevant.

* While minor in numbers, they did recently have a member in the Federal Government, so I'll include them as well.

Democratic Party:

Democrats have a long and proud history of defending Civil Rights and expanding opportunity for all Americans. From the Civil Rights Act of 1964 to the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act in 2009, Democrats have fought to end discrimination in all forms—including discrimination based on race, sex, ethnicity or national origin, language, religion, sexual orientation, gender identity, age, or disability.

For too many though, this ideal is still far from a reality. That’s why in our fight to stand up for civil rights for all Americans, we are committed to protecting voting rights, enacting the Employment Non-Discrimination Act, ensuring civil unions and equal federal rights for LGBT couples and fully repealing the Defense of Marriage Act.

I'm not aware of any current issues of discrimination aside from gay marriage. I would support attempts at the federal level to make gay marriage legal. If only you were doing something about that.

Democrats share with all parents the commitment to prepare our children to lead lives of happiness and success. That’s why we’re dedicated to ensuring the next generation has access to a first-rate education and the tools to drive our economy forward.

I'm going to stop you right there. Good initiative. Now here comes the part where you fuck it up.

In 2010, President Obama signed into law student loan reform that ended government subsidies to big banks and made college more affordable to millions of Americans—a measure in size and scope second only to the G.I. Bill. The Obama administration is working to overhaul the “No Child Left Behind” program and provide teachers with more professional support and resources—while also holding them accountable. President Obama instituted “Race to the Top,” a revolutionary program designed to promote innovation and provide incentives for improvement in education. As a result, already over a dozen states have made changes to increase standards and implement reforms.

If you want to make college more affordable, make public colleges free. Want to improve pre-college education? Scrap the whole fucking thing and start over by modelling the policy used in successful systems. This is an angry rant for another time though.

President Obama knows we can’t just drill our way to lower gas prices or a quick-fix solution to our energy needs. That’s why he and Democrats are focused on developing all of America’s natural resources—domestic oil, gas, wind, solar and biofuels—and encouraging fuel efficiency so that we can reduce our dependence on foreign oil over time.

OK. I'm listening.

Already, this President has led the way to:

* Domestic oil production at an eight-year high, and our dependence on foreign oil at a 16-year low. In 2011, we cut net oil and petroleum imports by 1 million barrels a day.
* Expanded domestic oil production by speeding up the leasing process and improving safety measures to prevent future spills.
* Nearly doubling renewable wind, solar and geothermal energy since 2008.
* Agreeing with automakers to nearly double fuel efficiency standards for cars and trucks. That will help to save families more than $8,000 per vehicle at the pump and decrease our oil consumption by an estimated 2.2 million barrels a day.

Point 1: That will last another couple of decades. Let's try some long term planning here gents.
Point 2: I think this is the same as point 1, they just added some shit about preventing future spills that I think is a lie.
Point 3: Thank you. Let's increase that a little, mmkay?
Point 4: Thank you. Now lets work on fueling them a renewable energy source.

From protecting endangered species to restoring our ecosystems and investing in clean-energy solutions, the Obama administration and Democrats are committed to working to address our biggest environmental challenges.

Under the Obama administration, the Department of Transportation issued new fuel-economy standards, the first mandated increases in fuel economy for cars in decades. The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) has taken the first steps toward regulating carbon dioxide emissions from coal-fired power plants. For the first time, the U.S. will catalogue greenhouse gas emissions from large emission sources-—an important initial step toward measurable and transparent reductions.

These are good starting points, wish you would do something about all of the other environmental issues though.

In March 2010, President Obama fulfilled a promise that Democrats have pursued for nearly a century: making health care available to all Americans. Despite unanimous opposition from Republicans, Democrats were finally able to pass comprehensive health reform into law.

By 2014, health reform will eliminate all discrimination for pre-existing conditions, start the process of expanding health insurance coverage for an additional 32 million Americans, and provide the largest middle-class tax cut for health care in history.

The Affordable Care Act has already begun to end the worst insurance company abuses. Since 2010, children with pre-existing conditions can no longer be denied insurance.

The Affordable Care Act also provides tax cuts to small business to help offset the costs of employee coverage, and tax credits to help families pay for insurance. Health reform will also lower costs for families and for businesses and for the federal government, reducing our deficit by more than $1 trillion in the next two decades alone.

And health reform strengthens Medicare by reducing fraud, improving quality of care, and closing the Medicare “donut hole” gap in seniors’ prescription drug coverage.

Like Medicare before it, the Affordable Care Act lays a new foundation for our country that will bring additional security and stability to the American people for generations to come.

I don't know nearly enough about the Affordable Care Act to really comment. However, what I will say is that the way in which it was created (that is, in two years by legislatures, not by experts over years of research into existing and proposed systems) makes me think that it is a bunch of bullshit, so I don't like it.

America has a long and rich heritage of immigration. Democrats have always embraced our country’s diversity, but we also recognize that our current immigration system is broken.

Democrats support comprehensive reform grounded in the principles of responsibility and accountability:

* Responsibility from the federal government to secure our borders: The Obama administration has dedicated unprecedented resources to securing our borders and reducing the flow of illegal traffic in both directions.
* Responsibility from unscrupulous businesses that break the law: Employers who exploit undocumented workers undermine American workers, and they have to be held accountable.
* Responsibility from people who are living in the United States illegally: Undocumented workers who are in good standing must admit that they broke the law, pay taxes and a penalty, learn English, and get right with the law before they can get in line to earn their citizenship.
* Comprehensive immigration reform is essential to continue the tradition of innovation that immigrants have brought to the American economy and to ensure a level playing field for American workers.[/i]

Point 1: Good initiative, but it's treating the symptom not the disease
Point 2: Good initiative, but it's treating the symptom not the disease
Point 3: Ehh... I don't know
Point 4: That's not really a policy, and I don't know if you need to say that

President Obama inherited an economy in free fall, with huge deficits, skyrocketing health care costs, dwindling employment, and banking and housing markets on the brink of collapse. Working with the President, Democrats stabilized the financial system and helped to prevent a second Great Depression. An economy that was losing 700,000 jobs a month is now gaining jobs. We still have a long way to go, but we are now moving forward on the road to recovery.

President Obama and Democrats are fighting to strengthen our economy further and create jobs for American workers by ending tax loopholes for corporations, providing tax cuts to small businesses, investing in a clean-energy economy, and putting Americans to work rebuilding our infrastructure.

There are plenty of issues with what is our unemployment rate, which I don't care to get into, but I have some doubts about what was our unemployment rate (and changes therein) and what is our unemployment rate now. I say this because I question the number of jobs "made" by President Obama, and the degree of actual control he has over the economy (if I wanted to point out someone to credit, it would probably the Federal Reserve, actually). Now, the issue I have with this is the last comment "putting Americans to work rebuilding our infrastructure". I have issue with it, because this is a complete and total lie that makes me want to vote Republican for now on it infuriates me so much.

As the threats facing our country have evolved over the years, so too has our ability to respond to them. Our national security personnel are the most dynamic and well-trained in the world, and we must never forget the solemn duty that they fulfill for our nation. Democrats are committed to ensuring that our troops have the training, equipment, and support that they need when they are deployed and the care that they and their families need and deserve when they return home.

Democrats and President Obama are focused on preventing terrorism across the globe. This means continuing to invest heavily in intelligence and information sharing and promoting those networks among our allies. We will continue to strengthen our ability to keep nuclear and biological weapons out of the hands of terrorists, address efforts to better ensure border security, and augment defense of our national infrastructure.

President Obama has made significant steps to restore America’s image around the world by rebuilding strategic alliances with countries that share our values and face common threats.

I'll be honest: I doubt everything just said. As a Marine, I hate the DNC for the recent decision to cut the numbers of Marines (it's a kneejerk thing, understand), but that is moderately fine. My issue is that equipment and support aspect, are not there. Again, this is an angry rant for another time, but in short: stop fucking lying to me.

For Democrats, changing politics in Washington means ensuring that government is open, transparent, and responsive to the needs of the people. President Obama has implemented the most sweeping ethics and transparency requirements in history, building on steps taken by Democrats to limit the influence of special interests and ensure that government is accountable to the people.

Transparency promotes accountability and provides information for citizens about what their government is doing. We are committed to creating the most open, transparent, and accountable government in history. In the past few years, Democrats have taken steps to:

* Bring unprecedented accountability to federal spending;
* Rein in the influence of lobbyists in Washington;
* Shut down the "revolving door" that allowed lobbyists to move freely from government to special interests and back;
* Open more lines of communication with the American public; and
* Increase cooperation across all levels of government, as well as with nonprofit organizations, businesses, and individuals in the private sector.

I find the idea of either party promoting and 'Open Government' laughable, but I'll role with it.

Big words, I don't think you've done a single thing to accomplish them though. Seriously, stop fucking lying to me. I already hate you, you don't need to work so hard to encourage my hatred.

America has a rich history of technological innovation and scientific ingenuity. But after years of declining tests scores in math and science and a Republican administration that often turned its back on science, the United States risks losing its scientific dominance. Democrats are committed to reversing this trend by investing in the technologies and jobs of the future while increasing support for more advanced research, labs, and classrooms.

Democrats believe that scientific research should play an important role in advancing science and technology in the classroom and in the lab. In order to compete globally, our next generation must be equipped with the tools and skills that lead to the technological innovations and scientific breakthroughs of the future. Democrats have taken significant steps to expand educational opportunities and make college more affordable for all Americans while improving the quality of our schools and our teachers.

Democrats have made historic investments in research for clean-energy technologies that are helping to create the industries of the future. The Obama administration lifted federal restrictions on stem cell research, providing scientists and doctors with new resources to help save lives.

OK, so, you can talk big? What exactly have you done, again? Nothing? Yeah, that's what I thought.

In 1935, Democrats and President Franklin Roosevelt created Social Security. In 1965, Democrats and President Lyndon Johnson created Medicare. Ever since, Democrats have continually fought to defend these cornerstones of the American Dream in the face of attempts to dismantle or undermine both.

PROTECTING SOCIAL SECURITY
In recent years, Democrats have beaten back Republican plans to privatize Social Security—plans that would have exposed the retirement funds of millions of American seniors to great risk on the eve of the financial crisis.

STRENGTHENING MEDICARE
Recently enacted health reform strengthened the Medicare trust fund, expanding its life by more than a decade. The Affordable Care Act also will improve care across the board, reduce fraud, and finally close the hole in Medicare drug coverage known as the “donut hole.” As of 2011, seniors are eligible for free coverage for certain preventive services.

HELPING AMERICANS SAVE FOR RETIREMENT
Democrats want to make it easier for all Americans to participate in retirement accounts at work and support a system where employees have pension portability, so workers don’t lose their pension if they change jobs.

Our Social Security system needs serious reform, I doubt privatizing it would help (don't really know, will read about that later). The rest of this seems to be saying "we will make sure that a system that is large and complicated, and prone to fraud will not change, because we're talking a big game, but have and will do nothing to change it"

Democrats have a long and proud history of fighting for voting rights that continues to this day. One of the most important rights of American citizens is the right to vote—the right to have a say in who our leaders are and how our government should work. But the path to full voting rights for all American citizens was long and often challenging, and for far too many people, obstacles to voting remain even today.

The expansion of voting rights did not happen overnight; it was the product of a continued struggle by many people over many years. To this day, many voters still face difficulties at the polls, from registering to casting a ballot to having their votes counted. Those particularly vulnerable are minority, young, elderly, poor, and disabled voters, as well as military members and veterans. And in many parts of the country, voters are underserved by a lack of polling places, outdated voting machines, and unnecessarily complicated laws.

We are making progress, but we won't stop working to promote a system of elections that is accessible, open, and fair—a system that ensures that every eligible person can cast a vote and that every lawfully cast vote is counted.

Again, you fuckers need to stop lying (first paragraph). OK, you've identified a problem. What are you going to do to fix it, and why didn't you at some point in the two years when you basically controlled the government?

Republican Party
I cannot seem to quote their Current Political Issues section, and their most recently listed Political Platform is from 2008. Not going to bother.

National Defense:
OK, so you're going to let Ronald Reagan take all of the credit for the collapse of the Soviet Union. You're also going to completely gloss over the horrible shit that the CIA did under President Reagan (like the violent over through of popular, well respected, democratically elected governments in favor of repressive regimes that committed in some cases mass murder). There's also a nice little issue I have here. Earlier I chastised the Democrats for not providing the equipment or support to the military that they claim. You claim this too. You're lying too. Only, you're lying worse. You were in charge, almost completely, for 6 years and did nothing. You motherfuckers had better have a damn good reason for it.

Health Care:
Hah! You're going to talk about quality of care. That's funny.

Energy:
Yeah, I'm pretty sure you're lying to me about alternative energy support, considering how many major figures in the Republican Party are tied into big oil.

Education:
So, you're fine with failing schools as long as students can (theoretically) leave? OK crazy

Economy:
That probably explains why you were so willing to crash the economy. Maybe a little government intervention is OK if it keeps the economy going? Did you think of that? Of course not.

Courts:
(I haven't read this and I'm already loving it)
Of course it's the Judicial System's job to interpret the law according to the Constitution, it's the Congress's job under the Republicans to make the PATRIOT Act that shits on it.

Modern Whigs

In keeping with our meritocratic philosophy, Modern Whigs oppose all forms of favoritism or discrimination based on arbitrary factors such as gender, race, ethnicity, class, sexual orientation, etc. We reject identity politics and race-based affirmative action programs. Affirmative action should be based on income level, not race, ethnicity or gender.

Here here!

To compete in today’s global economy we must have the best schools and universities in the world. America cannot afford to let other countries take the lead in math, engineering and space exploration while we argue about the merits of teaching creationism in science class.

Whigs believe such debates are out of place in the 21st century and only distract from the task of fixing our public schools. We favor the ideas of school choice, merit-based pay for teachers and charter schools, as well as a stronger emphasis on science and math in academic curricula. We also favor reforming the onerous practice of funding public schools through property taxes, which effectively condemns the poorest areas to having the worst schools.

The last sentence I agree with 100%. The rest is kind of degrees of "eh", with my major support being to the party that says "we're going to copy the most effective systems currently in place"

We need to change the method Americans use to elect their leaders, which is outdated and broken. This is the heart of Modern Whig methodology. We believe all citizens have equal rights and duties to participate and be represented in the democratic process and oppose all attempts to limit participation or distort representation. Our political system as it is today contains certain unrepresentative and, frankly undemocratic, features that restrict political competition and undermine citizens’ ability to properly exercise their political rights and duties. These problems include, but are not limited to:

- A plurality-based electoral system where a candidate can win with a minority of the vote and ballots cast for other candidates end up being wasted; Whig Solution:encourage the use alternative voting methods such as Instant Run Off Voting(IRV)and Approval Voting (AV) in which voters can vote for one or multiple candidates based on preference. These would open up the political process to new voices and eliminate the “wasted vote syndrome” or “spoiler role” of alternative party candidates. For more information on these systems you can visit www.nationalrenewal.org and www.instantrunoff.com.

Agree with the idea, not sure if I support IRV or AV.

- The overwhelming influence of money in political campaigns; Whig Solution: campaign finance reform in the direction of public financing, along with free and equal access to the airwaves. Public financing of elections may seem expensive at first, in the long run it can ensure that citizen representation is not undermined by large pools of money. Public financing will also reduce the amount of time that incumbents must campaign allowing them to focus on representing their fellow citizens.

Here here!

- Lobbying, as in back door deals off of the public record. Rules against this must be enforced.

Whig Solution: no “special access” to legislators for lobbyists, and a ban on politicians working as lobbyists for five years after leaving office.

Agreed. Though I think much more severe rules and punishments need to be in place. Maybe make off-the-books socialization the same as treason.

- The Electoral College, which only serves to thwart the will of the people in presidential elections.

Whig Solution: either make the allocation of electors proportional to the popular vote in each state, or abolish it altogether.

Abolish it.

- Gerrymandering, the cynical practice in which partisan insiders redraw boundaries after every census in order to create “safe” electoral districts for the benefit of their own party.

Whig Solution: place redistricting in the hands of non-partisan citizens committees.

Good initiative, but how are you going to guarantee it? I'd make it by county, personally.

-Term limits for U.S. Congress, two consecutive terms for U.S. Senate (12 years consecutive total). Five consecutive terms for U.S. House (10 consecutive year’s total.)

Yeah, I could support that.

- Tuesday only elections make it hard for voters to get the polls;

Whig solution: hold elections on weekends or all week, and expand early voting.

Or we could make election day a federal holiday. But, this is good too, I guess.

Why are energy and national security tied together? Because our nation cannot be secure as long as we cannot meet our energy needs with our own resources. Our country’s addiction to oil is well documented. Our political class has allowed our dependence on Middle Eastern oil to continually increase; thereby showing it learned nothing from the Oil Shocks of the 1970s.

Following the 9/11 attacks, it became clear that energy independence is a matter of national security. Regardless of any arguments about global warming or climate change, Whigs believe our country MUST develop alternative sources of energy (wind, solar, nuclear, etc). Otherwise our security will remain hostage to events in the volatile Middle East and we will be forced to continue supporting corrupt and autocratic regimes whose oil we need to power our economy. This situation is utterly unsustainable.

OK? Any policy suggestions?

Neither government nor corporations or households can be exempt from the basic rules of accounting. Revenues should match or exceed expenditures, excessive debt should be avoided, and some funds should be kept in reserve for future “rainy days”.

Deficit spending is acceptable only in times of economic crisis or war. Practices such as unfunded mandates, pork-barrel spending, or cutting taxes while fighting wars are unacceptable. The recent economic crisis was the result of excessive borrowing by gigantic financial institutions for the purpose of engaging in unregulated betting on the value of derivatives backed by dubious mortgages. Post-crisis financial reforms must include: limits on leverage, the regulation of derivatives trading and most important of all, the break-up of financial institutions that are “too big to fail” (TBTF), so that no one entity can bring down our entire economy unless bailed out by taxpayer money.

A properly-functioning market economy should not require taxpayer bailouts of private companies in the first place! We view the recent financial reform legislation as a missed opportunity to address the TBTF issue and avoid future bubbles. Over the last twenty years improper regulation and deregulation may have contributed greatly to the current economic crisis. We must learn from mistakes of the past.

This needs some details, but is fundamentally good in my opinion. I'd like to know how they plan on accomplishing some of these goals.

Should be available, portable and affordable for all citizens, with means-tested government subsidies for those who cannot pay in full. De-link health benefits from employment. The practice of saddling employers with costly pension and health insurance benefit obligations is hurting the ability of American companies to compete in the global economy. This is most obvious in the auto industry.

While we support the basic goal of expanding coverage to all Americans, we do not believe recent health insurance reform legislation will reduce health care costs. More research and work needs to be done on this subject, and legislative changes will have to be made in order to bring costs under control. The dramatic and unabated costs in health care costs threaten to cripple our families and nation.

Well, I appreciate the honesty that you want something, but wont quite say what, and that you don't know enough about it to really say anything.

The USA is and has always been a country of immigrants. The Modern Whig Party understands the dual responsibility of securing our borders while also dealing realistically with those illegal immigrants already in the country. We propose the following: offer illegal immigrants the opportunity for citizenship if they join the military and serve out their initial contractual term honorably.

Illegal immigrants will not be entitled to jobs that require security clearances, but will be eligible for the GI Bill, Tricare and all other benefits afforded to US service members who serve honorably. This program also will include a background check and English-language classes if necessary. In this manner, any illegal immigrant ranging in age from 18 to 42 will receive job skills and educational benefits while they earn their citizenship for themselves and their immediate family members in defense of our country.

Going forward, we must also revamp our legal immigration process so as to attract those whose skills, education and entrepreneurial spirit will enable them to become productive contributors to the knowledge-based economy of tomorrow.

Lastly, Modern Whigs feel that assimilation is key to our melting pot, and while all citizens should appreciate the various cultures that make up America, we should share a common language. Being proficient in the English language is critical for us to fulfill our role as citizens.

Oh, you used to have such a good idea. It involved fucking over China and helping build Mexico. Well, you changed it from something I loved to this, so I hate it. I'm allowed to be petty.

America’s infrastructure is in great need. It is evidenced by our failing power grid, bridge collapses and failure of levees around the nation. Our infrastructure is one of the main keys to our American way and quality of life and to our nation’s economy. A failing infrastructure will only help cause a failing economy. In some cases outdated infrastructure poses a national security threat.

It is time to reinvest in America’s future and infrastructure will be a key. The Modern Whig Party will look at repairing our 20th century era infrastructure as well as prepare and initiate a new 21st century American infrastructure.

We can do this by removing redundant programs and wasteful government spending without raising taxes. More details on this will be outlined in our Renewed American System.

THANK YOU! Jesus Christ.

Prior to the recent crisis our economic growth was based on consumers buying and selling houses and cars using borrowed money. We cannot return to this unsustainable model. Instead, the jobs of tomorrow will be created by:

-Rebuilding our infrastructure (roads, bridges, ports, airports, light rail, etc.)

-Renegotiating “free trade” treaties that only result in the outsourcing of jobs to countries with low labor and environmental standards.

-Offering tax incentives for corporations to grow manufacturing jobs in this country.

-Closing tax loopholes that some corporations use to hide profits abroad.

-Investing in alternative energy sources, the foundation of our next economic boom.

-Improving our schools, especially the quality of our science programs, so that our young people gain the skills necessary to create, design and build the technologies of the future.

All of these ideas will be detailed and form the core economic policies of our Renewed America System.

I look forward to the Renewed American System, because this is all some good stuff.

As a patriotic party founded by American veterans, Modern Whigs are committed to a strong national defense. America will act to defend its national interests multilaterally whenever possible and unilaterally if necessary. Whigs reject isolationism and favor strong alliances with reliable partners who are willing to share the burden in the fight against common enemies.

The nature and faces of America's threats have changed. This requires ever vigilant and constantly evolving defense and diplomatic policies.

Whigs believe America must honor its veterans and should provide them with access to the highest possible quality of care and services through a well-funded Veterans Administration.

To help our veteran members and families and non member veterans and their families we have our Veterans Affairs Advocacy group within the Modern Whig Party. This group works to help out veterans and their families with veterans issues.

This sounds like maintaining the status quo, but I guess that's fine. I have plenty of issues with gear and care, but I suppose this is better then nothing.

Our members are split on this subject just like the rest of the country. And if you are starting to understand what the modern Whig philosophy means by encouraging independent thought and respecting others opinions and perspectives, you might correctly guess that modern Whigs represent a diversity of both pro-choice and pro-life voters. Why? How can we? The bottom line is that this one particular issue should not be the sole basis for which political party people affiliate with. On one level, it points to a deeper Constitutionally-based issue. On another level, it is one of the most deeply divisive issues facing America. Yet, it is not an issue that can find much common ground. This would seem to tell us that abortion ought not be debated at the national level, as the issue is too divisive for the Republic to stand. It should be handled at more local levels of government where common ground might be more easily found. It is time to end the trend of having this one issue become a deal breaker. Each state can determine its course of action like any other public health issue that revolves around medical procedures. The federal government should not get involved or regulate such items as the less involvement by the government in our private lives, the better.

In addition, we encourage states to consider additional funding for greater access to adoption for people wishing not to keep a child and for qualified couples or individuals wishing to become parents of adopted children. Responsible safe-haven laws also give people an additional option beyond abortion. We support all policies giving couples additional options beyond abortion, making this practice even more rare.

Not talk about it, got it. Although to accomplish that last goal ('making this practice even more rare') you would kind of need to do some stuff that prevents unwanted pregnancies in the first place. That would education involving contraceptives in school, and possibly subsidizing contraceptives.

Each state can determine the extended rights of same sex couples based on their own local values. We do, however, support classifying as a federal hate crime attacks on people based on their perceived sexual orientation. In essence, the sexual orientation of the guy down the street has no bearing on anybody else's life.

Same sex marriage has federal implications (like tax rate) so, no, this is not a state issue. Grow a damn spine, Whigs.

The main reason our current economic recovery is so painfully slow is that our Middle Class is broke – lots of debt, no jobs, low incomes and depressed home values. Meanwhile non-sustainable growth by credit expansion, loss of high wage manufacturing employment and our convoluted tax code have all conspired to bring us to the point where the top 1% of households control 43% of the country’s financial wealth (meaning total net worth less the value of home equity), and the bottom 80% of households control just 7% of the financial wealth. Another symptom of this problem is Warren Buffet’s famous statement that his effective individual income tax rate is lower than that of his secretary. The tax code needs to be drastically simplified and made more equitable: the vast majority of loopholes, subsidies, exclusions, exemptions and deferrals should be eliminated; capital gains and other forms of passive income should be taxed at the same rate as earned income above a certain income threshold.

Some of the proposed causes are wrong (current unemployment is largely due to a mismatch of training and location), but the rest is basically good.

There are many well researched proposals which seek to change our income tax scheme, like the flat tax or fair tax. While these may have merit, our Nation is at a precarious financial position. Therefore, Modern Whigs do not propose any radical change to our income tax scheme at this time, other than a simplification of the current code and closing of tax loopholes. We must look to grow revenues in order to pay down the national debt a sound and fair funding base for our government. Any changes to the overall tax scheme must be implemented while in a strong financial condition.

Fuck the Flat and Fair Tax proposals, but I'm listening to the rest.

Whigs will sponsor a National Association on Taxes which will explore the competing income tax proposals such as flat tax or fair tax with input from financial and macroeconomic experts to help us evaluate their effect on tax rates, national income and income inequality.

I'd rather just let the economic experts come out with something, but this is better then any alternative I have seen.

Further, the Modern Whig philosophy is to empower the states with the resources to handle their unique affairs. The logic is that people in Alabama should not always have to flip the bill for earmarks that occur in New York and vice versa. For example, a senator from Oklahoma has used his committee powers to stifle an important transportation project in Virginia. The reality is that the more local one gets the more in tune with the unique and specific needs of that area.

I don't know how much of this I agree with, but OK.

This is why we propose that federal tax dollars be provided to each state in a lump sum every fiscal year based on population. This eliminates the need for most earmarks and pork-barrel spending as the onus will then be on state legislators and governors to allocate funding for issues that they see fit. Of course the federal government will still vote on other special projects and traditionally federal items, but these projects will be more manageable to monitor. In addition, the allocations to the states also provides a better opportunity to balance the federal budget while also forcing local voters to pay more attention to state elected officials.

Huh. This is new. OK, I think this is an interesting idea.

Libertarian Party:

1.0 Personal Liberty

Individuals should be free to make choices for themselves and to accept responsibility for the consequences of the choices they make. No individual, group, or government may initiate force against any other individual, group, or government. Our support of an individual's right to make choices in life does not mean that we necessarily approve or disapprove of those choices.

This justifies Anarchy. Fuck off.

1.1 Expression and Communication

We support full freedom of expression and oppose government censorship, regulation or control of communications media and technology. We favor the freedom to engage in or abstain from any religious activities that do not violate the rights of others. We oppose government actions which either aid or attack any religion.

Thank you for decriminalizing threats, false threats, fraud, and slander. Stupid fuckers.

1.2 Personal Privacy

Libertarians support the rights recognized by the Fourth Amendment to be secure in our persons, homes, and property. Protection from unreasonable search and seizure should include records held by third parties, such as email, medical, and library records. Only actions that infringe on the rights of others can properly be termed crimes. We favor the repeal of all laws creating “crimes” without victims, such as the use of drugs for medicinal or recreational purposes.

I don't even know where to start.

1.3 Personal Relationships

Sexual orientation, preference, gender, or gender identity should have no impact on the government's treatment of individuals, such as in current marriage, child custody, adoption, immigration or military service laws. Government does not have the authority to define, license or restrict personal relationships. Consenting adults should be free to choose their own sexual practices and personal relationships.

Good.

1.4 Abortion

Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration.

Eh.

1.5 Crime and Justice

Government exists to protect the rights of every individual including life, liberty and property. Criminal laws should be limited to violation of the rights of others through force or fraud, or deliberate actions that place others involuntarily at significant risk of harm. Individuals retain the right to voluntarily assume risk of harm to themselves. We support restitution to the victim to the fullest degree possible at the expense of the criminal or the negligent wrongdoer. We oppose reduction of constitutional safeguards of the rights of the criminally accused. The rights of due process, a speedy trial, legal counsel, trial by jury, and the legal presumption of innocence until proven guilty, must not be denied. We assert the common-law right of juries to judge not only the facts but also the justice of the law.

(emphasis mine)
Yeah, fuck off.

1.6 Self-Defense

The only legitimate use of force is in defense of individual rights — life, liberty, and justly acquired property — against aggression. This right inheres in the individual, who may agree to be aided by any other individual or group. We affirm the individual right recognized by the Second Amendment to keep and bear arms, and oppose the prosecution of individuals for exercising their rights of self-defense. We oppose all laws at any level of government requiring registration of, or restricting, the ownership, manufacture, or transfer or sale of firearms or ammunition.

Excellent. Now, where can I buy an atomic weapon?

2.0 Economic Liberty

Libertarians want all members of society to have abundant opportunities to achieve economic success. A free and competitive market allocates resources in the most efficient manner. Each person has the right to offer goods and services to others on the free market. The only proper role of government in the economic realm is to protect property rights, adjudicate disputes, and provide a legal framework in which voluntary trade is protected. All efforts by government to redistribute wealth, or to control or manage trade, are improper in a free society.

Thank you Heterodox dumbass.

2.1 Property and Contract

Property rights are entitled to the same protection as all other human rights. The owners of property have the full right to control, use, dispose of, or in any manner enjoy, their property without interference, until and unless the exercise of their control infringes the valid rights of others. We oppose all controls on wages, prices, rents, profits, production, and interest rates. We advocate the repeal of all laws banning or restricting the advertising of prices, products, or services. We oppose all violations of the right to private property, liberty of contract, and freedom of trade. The right to trade includes the right not to trade — for any reasons whatsoever. Where property, including land, has been taken from its rightful owners by the government or private action in violation of individual rights, we favor restitution to the rightful owners.

So, you're stupid? I thought we established that.

2.2 Environment

We support a clean and healthy environment and sensible use of our natural resources. Private landowners and conservation groups have a vested interest in maintaining natural resources. Pollution and misuse of resources cause damage to our ecosystem. Governments, unlike private businesses, are unaccountable for such damage done to our environment and have a terrible track record when it comes to environmental protection. Protecting the environment requires a clear definition and enforcement of individual rights in resources like land, water, air, and wildlife. Free markets and property rights stimulate the technological innovations and behavioral changes required to protect our environment and ecosystems. We realize that our planet's climate is constantly changing, but environmental advocates and social pressure are the most effective means of changing public behavior.

This is slander.

2.3 Energy and Resources

While energy is needed to fuel a modern society, government should not be subsidizing any particular form of energy. We oppose all government control of energy pricing, allocation, and production.

And in 40 years of Libertarian control, we will have no energy what so ever. Thanks alot.

2.4 Government Finance and Spending

All persons are entitled to keep the fruits of their labor. We call for the repeal of the income tax, the abolishment of the Internal Revenue Service and all federal programs and services not required under the U.S. Constitution. We oppose any legal requirements forcing employers to serve as tax collectors. Government should not incur debt, which burdens future generations without their consent. We support the passage of a "Balanced Budget Amendment" to the U.S. Constitution, provided that the budget is balanced exclusively by cutting expenditures, and not by raising taxes.

This will crash the economy beyond repair.

2.5 Money and Financial Markets

We favor free-market banking, with unrestricted competition among banks and depository institutions of all types. Individuals engaged in voluntary exchange should be free to use as money any mutually agreeable commodity or item. We support a halt to inflationary monetary policies and unconstitutional legal tender laws.

Will crash the economy beyond repair.

2.6 Monopolies and Corporations

We defend the right of individuals to form corporations, cooperatives and other types of companies based on voluntary association. We seek to divest government of all functions that can be provided by non-governmental organizations or private individuals. We oppose government subsidies to business, labor, or any other special interest. Industries should be governed by free markets.

Oh, you think businesses are run by the market? How cute.

2.7 Labor Markets

We support repeal of all laws which impede the ability of any person to find employment. We oppose government-fostered forced retirement. We support the right of free persons to associate or not associate in labor unions, and an employer should have the right to recognize or refuse to recognize a union. We oppose government interference in bargaining, such as compulsory arbitration or imposing an obligation to bargain.

A hundred years ago, this would have crashed the economy beyond repair. Today, eh, maybe.

2.8 Education

Education is best provided by the free market, achieving greater quality, accountability and efficiency with more diversity of choice. Recognizing that the education of children is a parental responsibility, we would restore authority to parents to determine the education of their children, without interference from government. Parents should have control of and responsibility for all funds expended for their children's education.

2.9 Health Care

We favor restoring and reviving a free market health care system. We recognize the freedom of individuals to determine the level of health insurance they want (if any), the level of health care they want, the care providers they want, the medicines and treatments they will use and all other aspects of their medical care, including end-of-life decisions. People should be free to purchase health insurance across state lines.

2.10 Retirement and Income Security

Retirement planning is the responsibility of the individual, not the government. Libertarians would phase out the current government-sponsored Social Security system and transition to a private voluntary system. The proper and most effective source of help for the poor is the voluntary efforts of private groups and individuals. We believe members of society will become more charitable and civil society will be strengthened as government reduces its activity in this realm.

Same stupid bullshit based on a complete lack of understanding how the economy and the relevant systems work.

3.0 Securing Liberty

The protection of individual rights is the only proper purpose of government. Government is constitutionally limited so as to prevent the infringement of individual rights by the government itself. The principle of non-initiation of force should guide the relationships between governments.

Good for you, you understand half of the point of the Constitution.

3.1 National Defense

We support the maintenance of a sufficient military to defend the United States against aggression. The United States should both avoid entangling alliances and abandon its attempts to act as policeman for the world. We oppose any form of compulsory national service.

And the genocided masses of the world will thank you.

3.2 Internal Security and Individual Rights

The defense of the country requires that we have adequate intelligence to detect and to counter threats to domestic security. This requirement must not take priority over maintaining the civil liberties of our citizens. The Constitution and Bill of Rights shall not be suspended even during time of war. Intelligence agencies that legitimately seek to preserve the security of the nation must be subject to oversight and transparency. We oppose the government's use of secret classifications to keep from the public information that it should have, especially that which shows that the government has violated the law.

So, you don't understand how completely fucked our ability to defend ourselves would be without an intelligence and military network that can keep secrets? Jesus Christ.

3.3 International Affairs

American foreign policy should seek an America at peace with the world. Our foreign policy should emphasize defense against attack from abroad and enhance the likelihood of peace by avoiding foreign entanglements. We would end the current U.S. government policy of foreign intervention, including military and economic aid. We recognize the right of all people to resist tyranny and defend themselves and their rights. We condemn the use of force, and especially the use of terrorism, against the innocent, regardless of whether such acts are committed by governments or by political or revolutionary groups.

So, you support the right of people to resist tyranny, just want to do nothing at all to help? Jackasses.

3.4 Free Trade and Migration

We support the removal of governmental impediments to free trade. Political freedom and escape from tyranny demand that individuals not be unreasonably constrained by government in the crossing of political boundaries. Economic freedom demands the unrestricted movement of human as well as financial capital across national borders. However, we support control over the entry into our country of foreign nationals who pose a credible threat to security, health or property.

Wait, so, you want unlimited migration as long as they're not foreign fighters? Oh Jesus.

3.5 Rights and Discrimination

Libertarians embrace the concept that all people are born with certain inherent rights. We reject the idea that a natural right can ever impose an obligation upon others to fulfill that "right." We condemn bigotry as irrational and repugnant. Government should neither deny nor abridge any individual's human right based upon sex, wealth, ethnicity, creed, age, national origin, personal habits, political preference or sexual orientation. Parents, or other guardians, have the right to raise their children according to their own standards and beliefs. This statement shall not be construed to condone child abuse or neglect.

So, you're not racists? OK.

3.6 Representative Government

We support election systems that are more representative of the electorate at the federal, state and local levels. As private voluntary groups, political parties should be allowed to establish their own rules for nomination procedures, primaries and conventions. We call for an end to any tax-financed subsidies to candidates or parties and the repeal of all laws which restrict voluntary financing of election campaigns. We oppose laws that effectively exclude alternative candidates and parties, deny ballot access, gerrymander districts, or deny the voters their right to consider all legitimate alternatives. We advocate initiative, referendum, recall and repeal when used as popular checks on government.

So, you're aware that you're a third party? Well, that's good.

3.7 Self-Determination

Whenever any form of government becomes destructive of individual liberty, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to agree to such new governance as to them shall seem most likely to protect their liberty.

Are... are you suggesting abolishing the government? Oh for fucks sake.

[Wolfman]

Socialist Party USA

The United States is the sole remaining global superpower. The U.S. government uses its overwhelming military power to consolidate its strategic hold over the entire world and to defend and advance the interests of U.S. owned corporations as they exploit the working people and natural resources of the entire planet. We stand in total opposition to U.S. imperialism and the current “war on terror” which is just another subterfuge for U.S. imperialism.

Yes yes, imperialism.

We call for the closing of all U.S. military facilities at home and abroad that train foreign military and paramilitary personnel.

That will piss off most countries, since those bases are a major place the US makes friends.

We call for the United States to immediately and unconditionally withdraw its forces from Iraq and Afghanistan.

Afghanistan will descend into chaos in days. Iraq probably as well.

We call for an end to the U.S. occupation of the province of Guantanamo, Cuba.

Eh.

We call for an end to the Israeli occupation of the West Bank-East Jerusalem and Gaza, and an end to all U.S. aid to Israel, as a precondition for peace.

Now you're asking for being accused of being Antisemitic.

We support an immediate cutoff of all U.S. military aid to Colombia, and all other recipients.

'All other recipients' means what? Because depending on the reading of this, and it could easily become something that massively destabilizes countless countries.

We call for the abolition of the Central Intelligence Agency, the National Security Agency, and all other institutions of covert warfare.

Also the major ways our country prevents terrorist attacks.

We stand for unconditional disarmament by the United States.

Wow, thank you captain insanity.

We call for an international treaty outlawing all weapons of mass destruction, including the use of depleted uranium in conventional weapons.

Um, OK.

We call for an immediate 50% cut in the military budget, followed by additional cuts, with the aim of rapidly reducing the military budget to less than 10% of its current level, with the "peace dividend" directed to essential social services and to the cost of cleaning up contaminated military sites.

Crush countless local economies.

We call for the disbanding of NATO and all other aggressive military alliances, and the closing of all overseas bases.

By by Taiwan.

We call for an end to U.S. arms sales throughout the world.

Whatever.

We call for the U.S. to pay off its debts to the United Nations, an end to veto power in the UN, and an end to permanent membership on the UN Security Council.

I could support this.

We call for a constitutional amendment requiring a binding vote of the people on all issues of war or military intervention.

Because protecting South Korea from the North was such a terrible thing.

We support the right of soldiers to form unions to represent their views and interests

That would include opposing more or less everything you just said. This is an incredibly stupid position to take.

Actually, at this point I'm going to say what I should have said about the Libertarian Policy: You are incredibly stupid if you think these are good policies, and I'm not even going to bother.

[Daktoria]

You're a Democrat.

You're seriously telling me they don't push for homosexual equality, making college education cheaper, making alternative energy cheaper, and accommodating immigrant naturalization? Everything else you said was just an excuse for not wanting to read or engage the topic, and expecting everything to be done already (upon which there'd be nothing left to do, and you'd complain they weren't spotting any problems).

What planet are you living on?

I mean I really loved the part where you say they're addressing the symptom, not the disease, of illegal immigration, and then you criticize them over job training, and then you say you don't want to get into the "plenty of issues" on the unemployment rate.

Spot on tiger.

[Decky]

Eh.

Look up all the legal problems with Guantanamo bay (I mean aside from the torture). Cuba never gave you permission to be there (Spain did) and want you off their country, it is an illegal occupation. How would you like it if the Cuban army took a base in Florida and refused to leave?

[Wolfman]

You're a Democrat.

You're seriously telling me they don't push for homosexual equality, making college education cheaper, making alternative energy cheaper, and accommodating immigrant naturalization? Everything else you said was just an excuse for not wanting to read or engage the topic, and expecting everything to be done already (upon which there'd be nothing left to do, and you'd complain they weren't spotting any problems).

What planet are you living on?

I'm an Eisenhower or Roosevelt Republican, actually. All the shit you just said, mostly bullshit. There is no 'homosexual agenda', I don't really care about making college cheaper, I only care about making alternative energy cheaper because fossil fuels are going to go by-by probably within my lifetime, and I'm explicitly not about accommodating immigrant naturalization.

Look up all the legal problems with Guantanamo bay (I mean aside from the torture). Cuba never gave you permission to be there (Spain did) and want you off their country, it is an illegal occupation. How would you like it if the Cuban army took a base in Florida and refused to leave?

Honestly, fuck the Cuban government. If I had the authority, there is a decent chance the US would invade Cuba. And North Korea for that matter.

[Daktoria]

I'm an Eisenhower or Roosevelt Republican, actually. All the shit you just said, mostly bullshit. There is no 'homosexual agenda', I don't really care about making college cheaper, I only care about making alternative energy cheaper because fossil fuels are going to go by-by probably within my lifetime, and I'm explicitly not about accommodating immigrant naturalization.

Oh really?

Can you tell me what Eisenhower said about the military industrial complex getting out of control?

I'm not sure if it would go along with your agreement with the Whigs over infrastructure.

I dunno if Operation Wetback would work out with your desire to "build up" Mexico either.

BTW, are you serious about that?

[Decky]

Honestly, fuck the Cuban government.

And that justifies the base how... If it was anyone but Yankeeland doing it. It would be on the news as an invasion

[Rei Murasame]

There is no 'homosexual agenda'

Are you sure about that?

I'm not aware of any current issues of discrimination aside from gay marriage.

Let me just list some stuff off hand. Ethno-racial groups such as the Native Americans have experienced a perpetuation of 'land theft' because the laws and treaties concerning them are essentially the same white supremacist framework that was built into them at the start, just with the 'offensive' phrasing removed.

In Tuscon they are banned from teaching ethnic studies even though their demography is basically non-white. The teaching of that subject was stopped by Superintendent Horne, a Jew who was born in Quebec, moved to the USA, 'became white' through a white-ification process that the USA curiously affords only to Jews, collected benefits and used social programmes, and now has called on all sides of the American spectrum to crush the ethnic identity of those who cannot or will not white-ifiy themselves and their history.

Naturally America complied as it always does, because recognising that some people might want to not be utterly whitewashed is 'racist' (so saith Superintendent Horne and his league of 'moderates') and 'racist' is 'bad'. Ironically.

Do I need to add more of these? I don't know how you all can be 'unaware' of this stuff.

[Wolfman]

And that justifies the base how... If it was anyone but Yankeeland doing it. It would be on the news as an invasion

The US has occupied Gitmo longer then Cuba has been a country. Think of it as our Falkland Islands.

Can you tell me what Eisenhower said about the military industrial complex getting out of control?

I'm not sure if it would go along with your agreement with the Whigs over infrastructure.

Considering Eisenhower is the father of our modern infrastructure, I imagine he would be supportive. I also have no idea what the Military-Industrial Complex has to do with infrastructure.

I dunno if Operation Wetback would work out with your desire to "build up" Mexico either.

Mine would work better.

BTW, are you serious about that?

Yes.

Are you sure about that?

OK, you guys want to get married. I don't call that an agenda.

Let me just list some stuff off hand. Ethno-racial groups such as the Native Americans have experienced a perpetuation of 'land theft' because the laws and treaties concerning them are essentially the same white supremacist framework that was built into them at the start, just with the 'offensive' phrasing removed.

I said current Rei.

In Tuscon they are banned from teaching ethnic studies even though their demography is basically non-white. The teaching of that subject was stopped by Superintendent Horne, a Jew who was born in Quebec, moved to the USA, 'became white' through a white-ification process that the USA curiously affords only to Jews, collected benefits and used social programmes, and now has called on all sides of the American spectrum to crush the ethnic identity of those who cannot or will not white-ifiy themselves and their history.

And I'm supposed to care because...

[Daktoria]

Considering Eisenhower is the father of our modern infrastructure, I imagine he would be supportive.

Read this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=137784

I also have no idea what the Military-Industrial Complex has to do with infrastructure.

/faceplam

Three words:

INTERSTATE

HIGHWAY

SYSTEM

[Rei Murasame]

OK, you guys want to get married. I don't call that an agenda.

Oh goodness, please see my thread on the 'Candy Jar'.

I said current Rei.

That is pretty current, those laws are still used to interpret the USA's relationship with the reservations right now. Just some of the 'offensive language' is redacted from the law. Its still the same framework.

And I'm supposed to care because...

That's exactly my point, that you are 'unaware' of it because in order to have noticed it you'd have to be occupying at least two of the following categories:

• New Left.
• Nouvelle Droite.
• Some kind of racialist.
• Some kind of minority activist.
• Anyone that isn't completely 'white'.

Since the people in those categories are basically nil in the USA, it creates the truly ironic situation where I tell your side that there's a liberal white supremacist framework oppressing people on your soil and that it doesn't respect their ethno-racial existence, and you tell me that you don't care.

The liberal-esque tendency to try to absorb these people as part of a whitewashed "American" identity, is in my view an even more corrosive tendency against them than actual verbal abuse.

[Decky]

The US has occupied Gitmo longer then Cuba has been a country. Think of it as our Falkland Islands.

There were already people on Cuba, that is imperialism. The Falkland islands has some penguins and no people before they were settled, that's fine.

I said current

It is current. There are still a few of the Natives that you didn't manage to genocide and the laws are affecting them right now.

[Wolfman]

/faceplam

Three words:

INTERSTATE

HIGHWAY

SYSTEM

I'm going to assume you're being insane again and ignore you.

Oh goodness, please see my thread on the 'Candy Jar'.

Sparknotes version please.

That is pretty current, those laws are still used to interpret the USA's relationship with the reservations right now. Just some of the 'offensive language' is redacted from the law. Its still the same framework.

My friends in the Native American Rights movement (yeah, I have those) would say that they have bigger complaints, and they aren't even race based.

That's exactly my point, that you are 'unaware' of it because in order to have noticed it you'd have to be occupying at least two of the following categories:

New Left.
Nouvelle Droite.
Some kind of racialist.
Some kind of minority activist.
Anyone that isn't completely 'white'.

Or maybe I just don't give a shit about what a city is doing with its (I'm assuming) high school curriculum because I have real concerns.

Since the people in those categories are basically nil in the USA, it creates the truly ironic situation where I tell your side that there's a liberal white supremacist framework oppressing people on your soil and that it doesn't respect their ethno-racial existence, and you tell me that you don't care.

No, I just don't give a shit about that case. There are actual issues of racial discrimination in the US, but they are minor and fading, and there are plenty of other things the US needs to deal with.

There were already people on Cuba, that is imperialism. The Falkland islands has some penguins and no people before they were settled, that's fine.

We acquired Gitmo from Spain, which was (in effect) the legitimate authority in Cuba.

[Decky]

We acquired Gitmo from Spain, which was (in effect) the legitimate authority in Cuba.

Firstly; legitimate?

Secondly even if we took that as true, Spain doesn't own it anymore. The Cubans want you too fuck off. Just admit you want America there because you are an imperialist. There are worse things to be.

[Wolfman]

Firstly; legitimate?

You're British, right?

Secondly even if we took that as true, Spain doesn't own it anymore. The Cubans want you too fuck off. Just admit you want America there because you are an imperialist. There are worse things to be.

We acquired it from Spain before Cuba was an independent country. Cuba has realistically no standing in this.

[Decky]

You're British, right?

Yep.

We acquired it from Spain before Cuba was an independent country. Cuba has realistically no standing in this.

So what? Britain acquired the East Coast of Yankeeland before it was an independent country. What relevance does that have now?

[Wolfman]

Yep.

So, when is Whales, Cornwall, Scotland and Northern Ireland going to be independent again? For that matter, when is the Falklands going to be a part of Argentina again?

So what? Britain acquired the East Coast of Yankeeland before it was an independent country. What relevance does that have now?

You acquired and lost. We acquired and have held. Notice a difference?

[Decky]

So, when is Whales,

Whales? You mean when are we freeing them from zoos? Bloody colonials.

Cornwall, Scotland and Northern Ireland going to be independent again?

As soon as fucking possible hopefully. Viva Alba, Éire, and Kernow.

And Cymru too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wales

Unlike you I am no imperialist.

For that matter, when is the Falklands going to be a part of Argentina again?

The Falklands were never part of Argentina.

Do you know the white army were fighting the Bolsheviks there in the late 60 btw?

[Wolfman]

The Falklands were never part of Argentina.

Kind of like how Gitmo was never a part of Cuba? Who would have guessed.

[Decky]

Kind of like how Gitmo was never a part of Cuba? Who would have guessed.

Firstly; legitimate?

Secondly even if we took that as true, Spain doesn't own it anymore. The Cubans want you too fuck off. Just admit you want America there because you are an imperialist. There are worse things to be.

Honestly you have no justification for being there aside from might.

You acquired and lost. We acquired and have held. Notice a difference?

That is imperialism, I am confused as to why you won't admit it.