Fat People, And What Should be Done About Them - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Provision of the two UN HDI indicators other than GNP.
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#14480619
Outside of the unlucky few with actual genetic or other medical issues that can cause obesity, I think obese people should be forced to undergo medical supervision and a compulsory dietary and exercise program.

There is absolutely no reason why any civilized person should be literally eating themselves to death.

Don't even get me started on the fat acceptance movement.

http://www.cdc.gov/cdctv/ObesityEpidemic/

http://win.niddk.nih.gov/statistics/
#14480623
You would, no doubt, impose compulsory smoking prohibition, compulsory treatment for pot smokers.

The answer to obesity is education not harassment. We need to require DAILY physical training for ALL school students through their sophomore year of college. (This was true in my day BTW.) We should require classes in nutrition from grade one. We should require insurance companies to cover bariatric surgery and other obesity treatment. We should banish all unhealthy food from schools through high school.

I'm all for draconian measures. Why don't we start by teaching people why they are fat in the first place and set them to work on healthy habits from early childhood. Also. Advertising food to children should be banned. All food.
#14480626
I have been advocating these necessary and healthy measures for many years now. An obese population is an unhealthy one. Many steps will need to be taken to ensure these overweight comrades are given the help they need. Round-the-clock monitoring may be required. They'll never know if they're being watched because they can't see through the telescreen of course, but we can use two-way surveillance to ensure that every overweight person is required in the morning to perform exercises. These people will need new clothing to make themselves feel better. I propose blue overalls, like factory workers' clothes. Now, there won't be enough clothes for the fat people, and there will need to be rationing and coupons, and thus a lot of people will have shortages of something or other. This will sadly need to extend to every facet of life, every daily need: from razor blades, to shoelaces, to food of course. We can make things easier if we set up cafeterias and have the poorest members of society make the food. There will be a kind of pinkish stew every even day, and on the odd days a kind of grayish stew with lumps of pinkish meat product floating around. There will be some bread, sugar substitute, coffee, and some kind of clear alcohol, maybe gin or something like that.

On second thought, we should impose this strict dietary and lifestyle regime on everyone.
#14480627
Drlee wrote:You would, no doubt, impose compulsory smoking prohibition, compulsory treatment for pot smokers.

The answer to obesity is education not harassment. We need to require DAILY physical training for ALL school students through their sophomore year of college. (This was true in my day BTW.) We should require classes in nutrition from grade one. We should require insurance companies to cover bariatric surgery and other obesity treatment. We should banish all unhealthy food from schools through high school.


I wouldn't call medically necessary intervention "harassment". Education is a step toward the solution, but since people often can and do things that they know are very bad for them, such as eating too much and exercising too little, I just don't think it will be enough, especially when students get out of school.

I'm all for draconian measures. Why don't we start by teaching people why they are fat in the first place and set them to work on healthy habits from early childhood. Also. Advertising food to children should be banned. All food.


Well we already have had nutritional education for decades, and while it has slowed the increasing obesity rates, it still doesn't seem like enough to actually reverse them.

And yeah, I think we should limit the number of food commercials which can be aired per day.
#14480656
Well we already have had nutritional education for decades, and while it has slowed the increasing obesity rates, it still doesn't seem like enough to actually reverse them.


Are you an American? We Americans have never had early childhood nutrition training. We don't have it at all short of college and that is too late. Most school meals are unhealthy. We advertise white flour and sugar to children to young to read.
#14480665
Drlee wrote:Are you an American? We Americans have never had early childhood nutrition training. We don't have it at all short of college and that is too late. Most school meals are unhealthy. We advertise white flour and sugar to children to young to read.


Yes. When I was in school, they taught us some basic nutrition, but I'm pretty sure most students just ignore this stuff and adopt their parents' eating habits. That's why I don't think education in childhood will ever be enough. The way to fix the children is to first fix their parents.

(And yeah, school meals are very unhealthy, but are often the only option for students in poor areas).

Godstud wrote:Let people live how they want to, and stop making smoking, breathing, eating, drinking, etc. illegal.


This is a really bad idea. People pretty much always get themselves into situations they don't want to be in by doing exactly what they want at every step along the way. You have to think ahead.
#14480673
Saeko wrote:This is a really bad idea. People pretty much always get themselves into situations they don't want to be in by doing exactly what they want at every step along the way. You have to think ahead.


And babysitting adults indefinitely and putting every overweight person into a medical detention center makes sense to you? How rigorously do you exercise like you'd expect from other people? What's your diet look like? Maybe someone thinks you're overweight or underweight or not taking enough of certain vitamins and minerals and you should spend some time in a hospital jail thingy.

This whole idea is just too stupid to be trolling.

On a side note, there should be major changes at the school level and on television in regards to nutritional reform. Commercials for candy, heavily sugared cereals and other junk food should be limited; schools should not be selling whole fat milk, soda, candy, chips, and other junk food to students. Some attempts have been made to do these things, but more really needs to be done.
#14480677
Bulaba Jones wrote:And babysitting adults indefinitely and putting every overweight person into a medical detention center makes sense to you?


Since it looks like that's what it will take, then yes.

How rigorously do you exercise like you'd expect from other people? What's your diet look like? Maybe someone thinks you're overweight or underweight or not taking enough of certain vitamins and minerals and you should spend some time in a hospital jail thingy.


You can't really make this kind of comparison since it depends on whether you want to lose, gain, or maintain your weight, but regardless, all of these things are very easy. For someone who wants to lose weight, 2 pounds per week is the maximum recommended rate. That means that they would have to create a daily deficit of at most 800 calories. You can divide up the deficit between reducing caloric intake and exercise however you want. Both eating 400 calories less than maintenance and burning off 400 calories through exercise are piss easy to do.
#14480695
Saeko wrote:Outside of the unlucky few with actual genetic or other medical issues that can cause obesity, I think obese people should be forced to undergo medical supervision and a compulsory dietary and exercise program.

There is absolutely no reason why any civilized person should be literally eating themselves to death.

Don't even get me started on the fat acceptance movement.

http://www.cdc.gov/cdctv/ObesityEpidemic/

http://win.niddk.nih.gov/statistics/


What does it matter if somebody other than yourself is obese?

I can completely understand, for instance, not wanting to look at a woman's cottage cheese rolled arse waddling in front of you in the street. But otherwise, who cares?

You're also not taking into account that obesity has its own little club of sex appeal. You'd be surprised how many men love a fat chick bouncing up and down on them, or how women love bigger men and their "moobs". What would the fat lovers do to get their rocks off? You're not considering their needs.

Also, there is the case of social order. A skinny, attractive woman can delight in the fact that most men will be checking her out instead of Miss Big Mac sitting over there. If Miss Big Mac was to transform into Miss Universe, the structure would collapse. Both fat and skinny is necessary to recognise one from the other.

Stick to psychological scorn and disgust. It works a treat and does wonders for the medical industry.
#14480712
Godstud wrote:Let people live how they want to, and stop making smoking, breathing, eating, drinking, etc. illegal.


Okay, but insist they take out private health insurance too. Why should the rest of us be disadvantaged in any way because of their fecklessness, greed and selfishness (and an apparent death-wish)?
#14480724
Healthcare is a right, not a privilege(at least in Canada). I like it that way.

Why should the rest of us be disadvantaged in any way because of their fecklessness, greed and selfishness (and an apparent death-wish)?
You just described every person under the age of 30...

Oh, you have a skateboard? Sorry... hiking your health insurance.
You own a bike? HIKE!
You want to ski? HIKE!
You want to go swimming? HIKE!

See where this goes?
#14480727
Godstud wrote:Healthcare is a right, not a privilege(at least in Canada). I like it that way.
You just described every person under the age of 30...
Oh, you have a skateboard? Sorry... hiking your health insurance.
You own a bike? HIKE!
You want to ski? HIKE!
You want to go swimming? HIKE!

See where this goes?


Yes, but it doesn't need to go that far. It isn't beyond the wit of man to censure suicidal personal health practices to the exclusion of sporting risks. And don't forget - rights should be commensurate with the exercise of individuals' responsibility, and those who refuse to recognise that rationale by exercising their obligation to the rest of us will have only themselves to blame when stricken with a preventable condition or illness.
#14480732
Godstud wrote:What is the difference between a person making themselves fat, and a person doing dangerous hobbies?


Essentially because gluttony and obesity will undoubtedly result in illnesses needing long-term medical attention and care on a large scale, whereas broken bones can be repaired?
#14480733
I had a friend get brain damage from BMX racing(He WAS wearing a helmet). He never truly recovered. He required care for the next 20 years of his life.

Not everyone who gets fat suffers long-term medical attention.
#14480735
Godstud wrote:I had a friend get brain damage from BMX racing(He WAS wearing a helmet). He never truly recovered. He required care for the next 20 years of his life.

Not everyone who gets fat suffers long-term medical attention.


We can always find an exception to the rule mate?
#14480741
Right, so it's not very good to generalize. 35% of Americans are technically obese. That means that maybe 50%+ are FAT.

Is it a problem? Yes. It's a CULTURAL problem. Until that changes, obesity will continue to be a problem, and punishing people for it, is ridiculous.

Drunk driving used to be a huge problem in USA/Canada. Drunk driving rates have dropped drastically, not because of increased enforcement, but because it's become culturally unacceptable to drink and drive.

That's what has to happen with obesity. Education is the only way to do that.
#14480744
Godstud wrote:Right, so it's not very good to generalize. 35% of Americans are technically obese. That means that maybe 50%+ are FAT.

Is it a problem? Yes. It's a CULTURAL problem. Until that changes, obesity will continue to be a problem, and punishing people for it, is ridiculous.

Drunk driving used to be a huge problem in USA/Canada. Drunk driving rates have dropped drastically, not because of increased enforcement, but because it's become culturally unacceptable to drink and drive.

That's what has to happen with obesity. Education is the only way to do that.


I entirely see where you're coming from, but there are those amongst us who are beyond any kind of help or advice; they'll nod in agreement with you, they'll thank you for it, they'll promise to change their ways, then literally five minutes later they'll have forgotten it all.
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