Trumpcare - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Provision of the two UN HDI indicators other than GNP.
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User avatar
By jimjam
#14785558
Trumpcare is here Donald and, guess what, you own it ............. :lol: .

The reality is massive tax cuts for the rich paid for with massive increases in suffering and earlier death for the poor.

Let me tell you folks the Republicans are going to have a helluva time trying to put lipstick on this pig.

Here are Donald's promises:

"Obamacare. We're going to repeal it, we're going to replace it, get something great. Repeal it, replace it, get something great!"

"If you can't take care of your sick in the country, forget it, it's all over. I mean, it's no good. So I'm very liberal when it comes to healthcare. I believe in universal healthcare. I believe in whatever it takes to make people well and better."

"Everybody's got to be covered. "

"They can have their doctors, they can have plans, they can have everything."

Trumpcare is obviously not yet the law of the land. There will be more chapters to the Trumpcare soap opera before this plays out. But, the Republicans have shown their hand and, as usual, it rewards the rich and fucks the poor. Billions in tax breaks for rich folks subsidized by millions of poor folks dumped off of medical insurance. Little wonder that Donald does not care for the handle: Trumpcare.

Image
TRUMPCARE^
User avatar
By Hong Wu
#14785563
Lol no, the Democrats want to prevent an Obamacare repeal and then they're like "wait, it's still called Obamacare..." so now there will be an attempt to rename Obamacare Trumpcare if the changes don't go through. It will fail if nothing gets passed. The narrative is not under the left's exclusive control anymore.
User avatar
By The Immortal Goon
#14785569
Hong Wu wrote:The narrative is not under the left's exclusive control anymore.


:lol:

Your masters spend two centuries locking us up, shooting us, hanging our leaders, breaking up our organizations, smashing our presses, making thought-police tests, and any other kind of barrier to keep the left smashed.

It's smashed on the floor and has been for decades.

But the right winger can't stand not being a victim. Why can't you do anything other than sob for yourselves? It's fucking pathetic. Fucking christ, since Trump has won ye have gone into a victim narrative unlike anything I could possibly imagine. Pathetic, pathetic, pathetic. Go crawl over to your masters and cry into their soft paws.

The actual left has rebuilding to do if we're going to finally put you out of the misery you professional victims keep droning on, and on, and on, and on, about. Deliberately turning yourselves into quivering masses of victimhood just makes us work all the faster to end your whining.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#14785577
Trump also said, "But Obamacare kicks in in 2016. Really big league. It is going to be amazingly destructive. Doctors are quitting. I have a friend who's a doctor, and he said to me the other day, 'Donald, I never saw anything like it. I have more accountants than I have nurses.' It's a disaster. My patients are beside themselves. They had a plan that was good. They have no plan now."

And "I am going to take care of everybody. I don't care if it costs me votes or not. Everybody's going to be taken care of much better than they're taken care of now."

And again "Because the drug companies have an unbelievable lobby. And these guys that run for office, that are on my left and right and plenty of others, they're all taken care of by the drug companies. And they're never going to put out competitive bidding. So I said to myself wow, let me do some numbers. If we competitively bid, drugs in the United States, we can save as much as $300 billion a year."
User avatar
By Zagadka
#14785588
Hindsite wrote:Doctors are quitting. I have a friend who's a doctor, and he said to me the other day, 'Donald, I never saw anything like it. I have more accountants than I have nurses.'

lol

Trump's anecdotes are always legit. Doctors are rising up as a group! They're quitting because reasons!
User avatar
By Stormsmith
#14785592
Did you guys know I've seen ads up here promoting Trumpcare?
User avatar
By Zagadka
#14785601
All of this lot does understand that healthcare costs still exist even if you don't spend on insurance, don't they?

Insurance serves to distribute the blow of those costs. Without insurance, there are two parties responsible for bills: the patient, and the care provider (generally hospital). When you break your leg (which is a low-cost injury) and don't have a few thousand sitting around to pay the bill, those two sources eat the cost; the patient can go bankrupt, lose their house or car or whatever (not to mention lost wages from the injury). The hospital just loses out on whatever is left, which raises the cost of other procedures/services and drains their resources.

This isn't even accounting for medication costs, especially for anyone with a chronic condition, or for preventative medicine. If you're disabled, I guess you're screwed. The poorer you are, the more screwed you are. You can sink your entire family into generations of debt.

It is the ultimate poor tax. The people most at risk get the least help, and some are removed from the economy permanently (except as a drain). And obviously, like car insurance, people hate paying it until they need it, then realize how desperately they do need it.

Maybe the worst part about private health insurance is that it is basically corporate gambling. No, actually, the worst part is that the insurance companies work with the medical industry to pad costs where applicable. The second worst part is that they spend a lot of time deciding if you're worth the risk as an asset.

And all of that is economic. We aren't even talking about the basic human rights for access to health care. Something literally almost every other developed country has figured out, and figured out how to run at better cost efficiency and better healthcare satisfaction ratings.
User avatar
By jimjam
#14785716
The devil is in the details and the details of the Republican plan are starting to come into focus. Republicans are understandably attempting to shift attention away from the millions of poor folks who will be dumped and onto the "good news". One of the bits of good news is that premiums will increase at a rate 10% lower after ten years than they would under Obamacare (after increasing 15 or 20 % more than they would under Obamacare for two years). They did this by fucking Americans in the 50-64 age group. Premiums for old folks would be 20-25% higher after 10 years than they would have been under Obamacare. This would force old folks off of the insurance rolls. Since old folks are the most expensive to insure, dumping them would lower the overall cost to insurance companies thereby permitting lower premiums for young folks and, hence, the 10% figure Ryan is crowing about.

What he fails to mention is that, to accomplish this, old folks need to be dumped. An old person making $26,500 @year would be paying @1,700 @year for insurance under Obamacare and $14,600 for the same thing under Trumpcare.

Quite a difference from the thought process of the Democrats when Medicare was adapted and it was thought that, perhaps, old folks needed some compassion and assistance.
User avatar
By MistyTiger
#14785721
I think Trump makes up anecdotes just to support his points.


I have more accountants than I have nurses.'


Some accountants can be nicer than nurses. Accountants do not have to do night shifts or deal with whiny patients. :D
User avatar
By Hindsite
#14785733
As I have said before, I do not like Ryan's plan as it now stands. I described as a fraud and I hoped Trump would not fall for it. I don't think he will.
Trump has said that they will be working on it and he believes a beautiful healthcare plan will result that fulfills his promises and preserves Medicare under Social Security.

There was a cost of living increase, but no will see an increase in their monthly Social Security income because the increase all went to pay the Medicare premium increase. I wonder if that is another result of Obamacare.
User avatar
By Vasili Blokhin
#14785848
Hindsite wrote:I described as a fraud and I hoped Trump would not fall for it. I don't think he will.


You're going to be as disappointed as liberals soon enough.
User avatar
By MistyTiger
#14786219
Trump will fall for any plan as long as you say, "It is totally different than Obama's".

If Ryan and Trump have a big fight, do you think Trump will try to fire him? Now that would be interesting. Of course, the firing would not stick though. :lol:
User avatar
By jimjam
#14786595
A big deal with trumpcare seems to be that folks will have access to what health care they want like this is a truely wonderul thing.This is,of course crap. Obviously you canhave access to good health if you can pay for it. The whole point of this debate is to find a way to give folks who cannot afford good health care access a way to access good health care.We are simply attempting to introduce an element of compassion into the health care system of the world's richest nation. What the fuck is wrong with compassion? I find the pay or die/you are not entitled branch of the republican party pathetic, greed crazed and disgusting.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#14786619
MistyTiger wrote:Trump will fall for any plan as long as you say, "It is totally different than Obama's".

If Ryan and Trump have a big fight, do you think Trump will try to fire him? Now that would be interesting. Of course, the firing would not stick though. :lol:


We really haven't seen TrumpCare. This Ryan Healthcare plan is not that. As you know, Trump can not actually fire an elected representative of the people, but he could make it more difficult for Ryan to be re-elected.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#14786621
jimjam wrote:A big deal with trumpcare seems to be that folks will have access to what health care they want like this is a truely wonderul thing.This is,of course crap. Obviously you canhave access to good health if you can pay for it. The whole point of this debate is to find a way to give folks who cannot afford good health care access a way to access good health care.We are simply attempting to introduce an element of compassion into the health care system of the world's richest nation. What the fuck is wrong with compassion? I find the pay or die/you are not entitled branch of the republican party pathetic, greed crazed and disgusting.


The poor have Medicaid for their insurance. But under Obamacare, having insurance does not translate into having affordable medical care. In some cases, the deductibles are so high the people can't afford to use it on routine care. It might help some, if they have to be hospitalized, but otherwise it is of little help to those people.
User avatar
By Hindsite
#14786628
Zagadka wrote:Try living on that with a chronic condition. There is a reason millions are uninsured, even under those programs.


No thank you. I am fine where I am.
I can't keep my doctor, but otherwise I like my plan.

Praise the Lord.
HalleluYah
User avatar
By Stormsmith
#14786635
Either make it universal, introduce money making venture (ie a national pharmacy and testing labs, etc., profits go to health care), and cut costs by negotiating with pharmaceutical companies.

Or give people a better income so a 40 hrs a week job is sufficient to pay for insurance

There are several models of single payer, eg, in the UK you can pay more and have your Dr do house calls. Here, there's room for insurance for chiropractic care, dentistry, drugs etc.

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