USA: There are also cheap private schools (2003 figures) - Page 2 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Provision of the two UN HDI indicators other than GNP.
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#14984485
Rancid wrote:I'm very sure this is basically the reason these kids end up doing so much better academically. I'm a firm believer that it's all about what happens at home that determines if a child is successful.

I'm proof of that. I went to inner city ghetto schools. As far as I can tell, the big difference between me, and the kids that dropped out or haven't done much since high school is because my parents were actually on me about getting my shit in order and done. Unfortunately, they weren't educated, so they really couldn't help me with my homework for example. Nonetheless, they did what they could, and were on my ass about my studies. Something that is missing from most homes in the ghetto (saw it with my own eyes).


I consider their inability to help you with your homework a plus. I always discouraged parents from doing this by telling them any help should be limited to 30 seconds or they aren’t actually helping, but preventing the child from learning. You have very smart parents.
#14984488
Rancid wrote:I'm very sure this is basically the reason these kids end up doing so much better academically. I'm a firm believer that it's all about what happens at home that determines if a child is successful.


Agreed, typically people who go through the trouble of homeschooling and forking out the money out-of-pocket are determined to make a difference in their kids. Public education does not guarantee this; not only because its free, but because parents don't necessarily send their kids to school because they care about education, they send their kids to public school first and foremost because its mandatory. You can't just NOT educate your kids in the U.S., so if you don't give a fuck about educating your kids, they still have to atleast go to the public school.


Unforutately, ghetto and ultra-rural areas tend to share the larger tendency of not valuing education, and so in those places the grip of public education is firm and you will not see many private schools or many homeschoolers in those places. Plus, the schools that do exist there tend to perform their worst; not only because the parents often don't value education, but also because the schools have no incentive to change as the worst performing schools in this country get the most money in tax funds (thus acutally deincentivizing improvement).

I mean, think about it, if you being a lazy slack-ass worker guaranteed that you would get a raise, but you improving your performance would mean an end to those raises, would you seek to improve? Of course not.

But that is the exact problem we have with schools, we give more money to schools the worse they do in the hope of improving them, but the reality is that such an effort is just a subsidization of poor performance and then we act shocked when schools continue to suck after we spend more money on them for sucking. :lol:

This is obviously an argument for privatization, but also for (at the very least) reform. Schools should be given tax funds by merit first and foremost as that would incentivize improvement in schools that perform worse than their neighbors.
#14984489
One Degree wrote:I consider their inability to help you with your homework a plus. I always discouraged parents from doing this by telling them any help should be limited to 30 seconds or they aren’t actually helping, but preventing the child from learning. You have very smart parents.


Fair point.

That said, I also understand this, so when I help my son with his homework, I make sure that I'm not actually doing their homework. Moreover, we actually do additional lessons beyond the homework and what's being taught in class.
#14984490
Rancid wrote:Fair point.

That said, I also understand this, so when I help my son with his homework, I make sure that I'm not actually doing their homework. Moreover, we actually do additional lessons beyond the homework and what's being taught in class.


That was the most challenging part for me as a teacher. Providing supplemental learning for the brightest was very time consuming. The more you give them, the faster they devour it. :)
#14984949
One Degree wrote:
That was the most challenging part for me as a teacher. Providing supplemental learning for the brightest was very time consuming. The more you give them, the faster they devour it. :)


Yes, it's difficult finding ways to challenge them. All they're do in 1st grade is addition/subtraction with numbers up to 120 (like the sum total will never exceed 120). However my son wants more, so we're teaching him multiplication already. Further, i've even started with a bit of algebra. Really simple algebra, like 3 + ? = 6, what is ?.

Anyway aside from math, we do Spanish lessons, Cantonese lessons, and guitar lessons. We try to do it in very casual, low pressure ways so as not to bore him, or make him stressed. I think our approach is working. Also very important, we do "general responsibility" lessons. Like "pick up your toys, wash the dishes, cut veggies with a knife, sowing, and look at people in the eye when you talk to them, etc. etc. etc." I also make sure he works on my car with me, mainly because I just don't want him to be afraid of using tools, and DIY in general.

Last note on my bragging. We had our mid year review with the teacher. She showed us my son's mid year math evaluation scores. However, on the spreadsheet, the scores of all the students were listed. I noticed that my son got the high math scores in the class. 8)

My wife is like "That's good, it would be embarrassing if the child of two engineers was bad at math." :lol:
#14984957
Rancid wrote:Yes, it's difficult finding ways to challenge them. All they're do in 1st grade is addition/subtraction with numbers up to 120 (like the sum total will never exceed 120). However my son wants more, so we're teaching him multiplication already. Further, i've even started with a bit of algebra. Really simple algebra, like 3 + ? = 6, what is ?.

Anyway aside from math, we do Spanish lessons, Cantonese lessons, and guitar lessons. We try to do it in very casual, low pressure ways so as not to bore him, or make him stressed. I think our approach is working. Also very important, we do "general responsibility" lessons. Like "pick up your toys, wash the dishes, cut veggies with a knife, sowing, and look at people in the eye when you talk to them, etc. etc. etc." I also make sure he works on my car with me, mainly because I just don't want him to be afraid of using tools, and DIY in general.

Last note on my bragging. We had our mid year review with the teacher. She showed us my son's mid year math evaluation scores. However, on the spreadsheet, the scores of all the students were listed. I noticed that my son got the high math scores in the class. 8)

My wife is like "That's good, it would be embarrassing if the child of two engineers was bad at math." :lol:


It sounds like you are doing a lot of great things. Variety is absolutely right, imo, rather than just excellence in the basics.
I was blessed with all 5 of my children having superior intelligence. It presents a lot of challenges for them and you.
I probably gave this example before. One of my sons reacted badly to an idiot who did his preschool screening. They wanted to put him in special education. I fought that with a lawyer. They refused to put him in advanced classes until he was in high school. He has an IQ of 165. Public schools usually have no idea of how to deal with such kids.
#14984961
One Degree wrote:
It sounds like you are doing a lot of great things. Variety is absolutely right, imo, rather than just excellence in the basics.
I was blessed with all 5 of my children having superior intelligence. It presents a lot of challenges for them and you.
I probably gave this example before. One of my sons reacted badly to an idiot who did his preschool screening. They wanted to put him in special education. I fought that with a lawyer. They refused to put him in advanced classes until he was in high school. He has an IQ of 165. Public schools usually have no idea of how to deal with such kids.


I've not seen you mention it.

That's one down side about public schools. You are right, they generally do not know how to deal with Atypical kids on either end of the spectrum. Either super smart, or special needs (I don't think my son is super smart LOL, just above average). That said, my son's class had this very disruptive child. They call the police in to help restrain him. This kid clearly needs help, but I think the bigger problem isn't the school system. I know the kid's parent, and I think she is in crazy denial about her child special needs. I don't go into detail about how we know she's in crazy denial, but anyway...

I'd image if she reached out to the school system to figure something out, they would help her. Again, I think a lot of it does go back to the parents though, and not the school system.

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