[Atlantis]

This is to be expected. A president who fires experienced and critical officials will end up with corrupt Yes-men. Flynn has been so close to Trump all through the campaign that it is unlikely that Trump didn’t know what Flynn was doing. The fact that Yates warned about Flynn days ago shows that they are all in this together. It’s just a matter of time now for Trump to go down. You are fired, looser!

Putin shot himself in the foot. All his scheming, trolling and hacking is going to backfire big time. Theresa May, Shinzo Abe and all who were lining up to suck Trump dick will get nothing but a foul taste in the mouth.

Twitter has been full of helpful suggestions that Flynn could now spend more time with his conspiracy theories – but Hillary Clinton has now joined their ranks.

Flynn notoriously tweeted a link to an entirely fake story that a DC pizzeria called Comet Ping Pong was linked to a child abuse ring involving the Clintons.

Follow
Hillary Clinton ✔ @HillaryClinton
Philippe's got his own way of saying things, but he has a point about the real consequences of fake news... https://twitter.com/philippereines/status/831356816609116160 …
5:41 AM - 14 Feb 2017
9,663 9,663 Retweets 26,504 26,504 likes
Follow
Philippe Reines @PhilippeReines
Dear Mike Flynn & Mike Flynn Jr.,

What goes around COMETS around.

And given your pizza obsession...https://jobs.dominos.com/dominos-careers/ …

xo

Philippe
4:18 AM - 14 Feb 2017
1,357 1,357 Retweets 3,788 3,788 likes

[ness31]

So, this Flynn person has been forced to resign about a conversation he had with Russian officials in 2015 before Trump was president even though he'd made it very clear he was going to run?

Oh and surprise surprise people in the political arena may have 'connections' to other people in the same field of expertise

What a load of BS. Maybe this man didn't want his position? Maybe he would do better in the private sector.

[Frollein]

Lol at all the posters salivating now that Trump would have to resign over this. If he hadn't fired Flynn, well that would have been a scandal worth reporting. But this? Don't see how this would endanger Trump.

But keep hoping, guys, if that's what takes you through the day.

[anarchist23]

This is to be expected. A president who fires experienced and critical officials will end up with corrupt Yes-men. Flynn has been so close to Trump all through the campaign that it is unlikely that Trump didn’t know what Flynn was doing. The fact that Yates warned about Flynn days ago shows that they are all in this together. It’s just a matter of time now for Trump to go down. You are fired, looser!

Putin shot himself in the foot. All his scheming, trolling and hacking is going to backfire big time. Theresa May, Shinzo Abe and all who were lining up to suck Trump dick will get nothing but a foul taste in the mouth.

Everyone knew that Trump was pro Putin, it was so fucking obvious. lol
Trump has made a real hash of his first month in office. The lowest popularity rating ever for a new president. The question is "How long will Trump last?"

Michael Flynn lasted just over three weeks as President Trump's National Security Adviser, the shortest tenure in the history of the post.

In a sign of the turmoil - and, frankly, chaos - of the current White House, Flynn acknowledged he had misled the Vice President.

He was already held in near contempt by many of the intelligence agencies that were working alongside him.

Mainstream Republicans (and Democrats) are aghast at how the Russians are being given a free pass in Ukraine and Syria.

Who will Trump hire to replace Flynn in top aide role?
The actual sin was that Flynn had phoned the Russian Ambassador to Washington and discussed the issue of sanctions even before Trump was sworn in.

That was a potential (if obscure) crime. But as so often in Washington, it was lying afterwards that was the fatal blow.

He told Mike Pence that sanctions weren't mentioned in the call to the Ambassador.

His late December phone conversation to the Russian Embassy was intercepted by US agents and transcribed.

The deception was plain to see. Ironically, Flynn was trapped by the very intelligence agencies he knows so well and who provide him with top secret information.

So Trump has lost a National Security Adviser with suspiciously close links to Russia, and the story ends there. Right?

Not at all. The problems - and the questions - may be just beginning.

Did Trump know about the phone call?

Did the President even instruct Flynn to raise the question of sanctions with the Ambassador?

Was Flynn actually compromised by the Russians?

Do the Kremlin and its security services have something on Trump himself (a startling question I put to the President-elect a month ago - he denied it)?

No one knows where this leads. But the relationship between the White House and the Russians has taken an extraordinary twist.

The President has abandoned a loyal ally and one of his earliest supporters in an effort at damage limitation. It may work. But, equally, his opponents now sense weakness and smell blood.

In any case, the attacks on Flynn were always a route to the real target: the President himself.
Last updated Tue 14 Feb 2017

http://www.itv.com/news/2017-02-14/what ... for-trump/

[One Degree]

Unfortunately, this does appear to indicate the Liberal backed Oligarchy is winning. Fox news has started turning against Trump. Trump seems to have failed in getting the backing of enough powerful people. It was a long shot chance at regaining a government by the people, but it was unlikely to succeed. Idealism encouraged by a corrupt media was an odds on winner. People are simply too stupid to see what is really happening.

Edit: Stupid is misleading. Most have not lived long enough to understand the difference between current reality and what reality was before. Their stupidity is understandable, but no less damaging. Idealistic nonsense works best with young minds that have no previous reality to compare. I have no such excuse for older liberals.

[Stormsmith]

Rex Tillerson is going to be your real problem, re Russia and corruption.

[quetzalcoatl]

Unfortunately, this does appear to indicate the Liberal backed Oligarchy is winning. Fox news has started turning against Trump. Trump seems to have failed in getting the backing of enough powerful people. It was a long shot chance at regaining a government by the people, but it was unlikely to succeed. Idealism encouraged by a corrupt media was an odds on winner. People are simply too stupid to see what is really happening.

Edit: Stupid is misleading. Most have not lived long enough to understand the difference between current reality and what reality was before. Their stupidity is understandable, but no less damaging. Idealistic nonsense works best with young minds that have no previous reality to compare. I have no such excuse for older liberals.

The oligarchy is indeed powerful. From the outside, it appears impregnable. But the oligarchy (and its instrumentatlity, the Deep State) are IMO in the final stages of necrosis. Like the Soviet Union, the Deep State has cut itself off from information transfer from its periphery. Only the core is still left alive, leaving the rest of the body to succumb to creeping gangrene.

It is fascinating that the Trump Insurgency, which is distinct from the Trump administration and distinct even from Trump himself, has a distributed command-and-control system running rings around the Zombie State. Parts of the Trump administration may represent insurgent goals, but much of it does not. Even Trump himself appears more an energy-focusing symbol than an actual leader.

Even if the liberal oligarchy were to succeed in crushing the current incarnation of the insurgency, it would be no better off than before. Its ossified structures would remain unable to effectively respond to crisis. This is underlying reason why we are now in a fluid transition state.

(It's useful to distinguish Liberalism in general, which encompasses all forms of neoliberal free-marketism, from the quite separate cultural wars. Pence, Romney, Clinton, and Obama are all members in excellent standing of the liberal oligarchy. The social conservatism of Pence does not exclude him.)

My modest suggestion is that, if you are interested in a more distributed form of government, you should focus more on the insurgency itself (and its goals), rather than whatever current figure appears to be its "head."

[One Degree]

My modest suggestion is that, if you are interested in a more distributed form of government, you should focus more on the insurgency itself (and its goals), rather than whatever current figure appears to be its "head."

You are correct, but when a possible leader emerges it is difficult not to rally behind their banner. The impossibility of his win and the hope it created will make any possible failure severely depressing.

[quetzalcoatl]

I'm starting to notice a correlation between those who want small government and those who don't know how the government works.

They fail to distinguish between absolute size of government and excessive central control. How do you measure size: number of workers, amount of cash flow-through, etc? When functionality is damaged, then simple "cutting" becomes a self-limiting process - which is why it never seems to work.

You can distribute many functions of government to limit centralization, while still having a 'large' government. The Reagan maxim "government is not the solution, it is the problem" is the chief conceptual stumbling block among Republicans. In operational reality, "the government is neither the problem, nor the solution, it is just a set of tools."

...but when a possible leader emerges it is difficult not to rally behind their banner. The impossibility of his win and the hope it created will make any possible failure severely depressing.

Trump is more of a Yeltsin than a Lenin. It's probably unfair to expect a focused advance towards a defined goal, given Trump's limitations. A focus on long-term goals (and means to achieve them) helps soften the inevitable disappointments of failed leadership.

[Prosthetic Conscience]

Supposedly Spicer or Priebus is also on the chopping block.

Well, that's up to the Mar-a-Lago members, apparently:

A source close to the president, who was not there but had knowledge of the situation, told me that Trump was going around tables during dinner asking guests what he should do about Priebus and Spicer—a crowdsourcing game he reportedly played when he was deciding which candidate to choose for vice president, and again, when picking who he would nominate as secretary of state. (A White House spokesperson did not immediately respond to request for comment.)

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/02/ ... e-believer

It's unclear if Trump was doing that, before, during or after the reaction to the launch of the North Korean missile.

[anarchist23]

It's not wise to trust politicians. At least until they prove themselves. It's true that many have good intentions but the proof of the pudding is in the eating. lol

[Rugoz]

The oligarchy is indeed powerful.

Let me get this straight.

If the guy in Trump's government with the best relations with Russia, objectively the most oligarchic major country on this planet, gets fired, that means the oligarchy is winning?

What?

[One Degree]

Let me get this straight.

If the guy in Trump's government with the best relations with Russia, objectively the most oligarchic major country on this planet, gets fired, that means the oligarchy is winning?

What?

Obviously there are conflicting Oligarchic interests since their entire goal is to gradually reduce their own numbers.

[The Immortal Goon]

It seems obvious to me that Flynn fell on his sword. I have absolutely no doubt that Trump, and probably Pence, knew damned well that this backdoor dealing with Russia was taking place.

By the letter of the law, this is alarming and whatnot...

...But is this that different than backdealing with, say, Britain? I doubt anybody would raise an eyebrow about anything similar with the British.

The difference, I suppose, is that Trump's base loves the British and hates the Russians. They've mostly found a way to reconcile this, but it's going to be used as a lever to pull apart Trump from the rest of the GOP; and this may accelerate when the Obamacare repeal takes place as there's no good solution to change it as of yet that both sides will be able to reconcile.

[anarchist23]

I believe that USA has always been an oligarchy/plutocracy, not a democracy. It hasn't been obvious as the President acted as a front man. Now with Trump a businessman in power, with many of the top jobs given to businessmen as well, it's plain to see that we have an oligarchy. There is no hiding the fact.

[Rugoz]

It seems obvious to me that Flynn fell on his sword. I have absolutely no doubt that Trump, and probably Pence, knew damned well that this backdoor dealing with Russia was taking place.

What "backroom dealing"? Maybe the official story is true and Flynn just violated the trust that was put in him.

I always found these accusations of Trump being in bed with Putin etc. to be rather silly. Lots of accusations and little evidence.

[The Immortal Goon]

I mean the backroom dealing he's been accused of (regarding sanctions), they've all been accused of, in talking to the Russians and trying to put a strategy and policy together around the Russians.

Again, I don't particularly see this as horrible. If this had been happening with the British, again, I don't think anybody would have batted an eye. But this is politics, and this is how it's played.

[Atlantis]

What "backroom dealing"? Maybe the official story is true and Flynn just violated the trust that was put in him.

I always found these accusations of Trump being in bed with Putin etc. to be rather silly. Lots of accusations and little evidence.

Actually the CIA came out as saying that part of the Steel dossier on Trump was true. They just didn't say what part.

My guess is that the golden shower bit is probably not true or that it's not important. However, that Page might have made business arrangements with Rosneft directly or indirectly on behalf of Trump could be true. There is the sale of 19.5% of Rosneft after the Trump election to an unknown buyer hidden behind dozens of shell companies in the Cayman, Singapore, Dubai, UK, Switzerland etc.

I have no doubt that Putin fed information to the Trump team during the election campaign and nobody would contest that the Russians spread hacked information to influence the elections.

I think it's also possible that Trump may be bankrupt and that he needs the presidency as means for getting business deals channeled to his companies to save his business empire. But that is conjecture.

I mean the backroom dealing he's been accused of (regarding sanctions), they've all been accused of, in talking to the Russians and trying to put a strategy and policy together around the Russians.

Again, I don't particularly see this as horrible. If this had been happening with the British, again, I don't think anybody would have batted an eye. But this is politics, and this is how it's played.

I'm sure that Murdoch had his hand in both the Brexit referendum and the Trump election, but you people seem to be awfully tolerant when it comes to the oligarchs rigging an election. Just don't be surprised when you end up with a plutocracy.

[Prosthetic Conscience]

I doubt anybody would raise an eyebrow about anything similar with the British.

Since the Obama position on sanctions on the UK was "there are none", if Flynn had phone the British ambassador and said "yeah, forget that, we'll impose sanctions on you once we're in", I think it would be seen as a Big Fucking Deal.

[Zagadka]

GOP senator calls for exhaustive investigation into Trump-Russia connections
http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3194 ... onnections

Sen. Roy Blunt (R-Mo.) on Tuesday said there should be an exhaustive investigation into the ties between Russia and the Trump administration.

"I think everybody needs that investigation to happen," Blunt told KTRS radio, CNN reported.

"And the Senate Intelligence Committee, again that I serve on, has been given the principal responsibility to look into this, and I think we should look into it exhaustively so that at the end of this process, nobody wonders whether there was a stone left unturned, and shouldn't reach conclusions before you have the information that you need to have to make those conclusions."

Blunt said the Senate Intelligence Committee should also talk to the president's former national security adviser, Michael Flynn, "very soon," adding that discussion should "answer a lot of questions."

"What did he know? What did he do? And is there any reason to believe that anybody else knew that and didn't take the kind of action they should have taken?" he said.

"For all of us, finding out if there's a problem or not and sooner rather than later is the right thing to do," he added.

He said he thinks the president has put together a strong national security team.

"And a lot of those people on that team have real concerns about Russia," Blunt said.

"And just because the president is trying to figure out how to talk to this dangerous power that's been an adversary of ours for a long time, certainly nothing wrong with that."

Blunt said every president has a chance to re-examine "how we deal with people that can do us either great harm or great good, depending on which relationship you're trying to build on."

Blunt also said during the interview that Flynn had served the country well in the past, but the senator emphasized the importance of being truthful.

"The national security adviser of all the people that work with and for the president has to be absolutely trustworthy and truthful and apparently he wasn't and he paid the price for that," Blunt said.

"In this case, absolute trustworthiness is the most important thing, even better than, even more important than knowledge, you've got to trust what the national security adviser says and apparently that wasn't gonna be the case here."
Flynn resigned late Monday after reports he misled senior Trump White House officials about his conversations with Russia's ambassador to the U.S.

His future in the White House had come under speculation since reports surfaced last week that he talked about sanctions against Russia before Trump was sworn in.

Flynn blamed his resignation late Monday on the "fast pace of events" that led him to "inadvertently" give Vice President Mike Pence and others "incomplete information" about his phone conversations with the Russian ambassador.