[noir]

For Syria, indeed it is, history books do constantly speak about Badiat al-Sham and when refering to the ruins and castles in it, they're all in northern Jordan.
Now you have a point in some aspects, that is the Syrian nationalists (i.e Baathists) did refer to the whole levant as greater Syria and both Palestine and Jordan were by default southern Syria. However those were in Syria and not in Palestine.

You need to read more pre PLO mythology. The Arabs in Palestine saw themselves as Syrians.

[Oxymandias]

@anasawad

By bringing up Pre-Islamic Persia, @noir is trying to derail the discussion and refrain from properly discussing either of our points. He's trying to make Islam look like the reason for Iran's current situation when, in actuality, Iran became this way because of foreign influence.

@noir

Why don't you give us a source noir?

[anasawad]

@noir
They saw themselves as Arabs. Palestinian Arabs. And their national identity started forming as a separate identity from the rest of the Arabs during the revolutions of the 1800s and the various attempts at full independence from the empire by the Palestinians.
Though their identity as a nation came to form much latter than those of their surroundings due to multiple factors, it still formed eventually.

[Zionist Nationalist]

Btw, Zionist, you know absolutely nothing about Arab culture at all. How can you say that they're all the same if you don't know anything about them?

I know alot about Arab culture

There isnt much difference between a Jordanian Lebanese Syrian or a "Palestinian" Arab

its like Russia/Ukraine/Belarus. the differences are small those are basically same people with same mentality and culture

[anasawad]

@Zionist Nationalist
No they're not.
Specially between Lebanese, Syrians and Jordanians, there are huge differences between their cultures.
I lived among all three and they're nothing alike.
Why do you think they all hate each other so much ? Because they're the same ? No, because they're many entirely different nations with different cultures, backgrounds, histories, and aspirations and even a bloody history between them with tons of hostilities spanning centuries between all these groups and they were treated as one by foreign powers and forced to live together.
Spend a month in Lebanon, then a month in Jordan and mix with both local populations and you'll see tons of difference from behavior to believes to, well, everything.
For fuck's sake, they each even reformed and restructured their religions just so they don't be similar to each other.
Even political ideologies that succeed in one can not succeed in another.


And if you really know even how the Palestinians living right next to you think, you'll realize they'd rather accept an Israeli occupation than be compared to Lebanese.
And vice versa for Lebanese towards Palestinians.

[skinster]

If Palestine didn't exist, why is it mentioned in The Balfour Agreement that zionists treat as some kind of holy scripture, rather than a paper written by European racist colonists 7 decades ago...

Back on topic

Even Supporters of U.S. Embassy Move Think Adelson Paying for It Is a Bad Idea
Sheldon Adelson’s offer to help pay for the new U.S. Embassy in Jerusalem is getting a thumbs-down from a range of observers who support the embassy’s relocation.

The Associated Press had the exclusive on Friday morning, and JTA confirmed it with sources who have been apprised of the State Department’s deliberations. State’s lawyers are poring over the law books to determine how to pull off America’s first privately funded embassy.

Why the Trump administration would want this — well, no one’s saying, but cost-cutting seems likely. The move to temporary digs, due this May, is eventually going to cost taxpayers about $60 million. A new embassy, built from scratch, will be much pricier. The newly opened U.S. Embassy in London cost $1 billion.

Presumably, a Jerusalem embassy will come under $1 billion (although who can guess). Adelson, worth an estimated $40 billion, can afford it.

Adelson’s spokesman declined to comment.

JTA asked various people who have been intimately involved in advocating for the embassy move — in some cases, for decades — what they thought of the plan to privatize the embassy. The five who talked thought it was a terrible idea.

The triumph of Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem, they tended to agree, is that it came about honestly because recognizing an ally’s capital is the right thing to do. Trump himself said Friday in a speech to conservative activists that he came under intense pressure from the international community not to make the move.

The optics of a rich donor paying the U.S. government for the embassy, critics said, makes the move look less like a principled policy than a personal favor.

“Citizens volunteering their resources and energies to ease the government’s burdens is laudable,” said Jason Isaacson, the American Jewish Committee’s director of government and international affairs. “But an American Embassy represents – and must be seen indisputably as representing – the United States of America, rather than any generous individual or segment of American society. The American Embassy in Jerusalem – as with all American embassies around the world – should serve, and belong to, every American equally.”

Morton Klein, the president of the Zionist Organization of America, who is close to Adelson, referred to AP’s reporting that Adelson might seek other funders, including among pro-Israel Christians.

“This is a United States government project and policy, I don’t think it should be ‘the evangelicals, the Jews made this happen.’ It should be crystal clear the U.S. government made this happen,” he said. “I don’t think it’s a good idea for any private citizen to pay for the U.S. Embassy to be moved.”

Daniel Shapiro, the Obama administration’s ambassador to Israel who has since leaving the position advocated for a move, said he did not believe that State Department lawyers would sign off on the arrangement. Once Adelson started funneling hundreds of millions of dollars into the U.S. government’s coffers, there would be immediate conflict of interest questions, including, what is the casino magnate and pro-Israel philanthropist getting in return?

“When individuals or corporations are giving something, there’s an expectation they may be getting something in return,” Shapiro said. “That concern about quid pro quo is naturally pregnant in such a proposal.”

Also against the idea was William Brown, the ambassador to Israel under Presidents George H. W. Bush and Bill Clinton. He wrote memos to both presidents recommending moving the embassy to Jerusalem. “I’ve worked in embassies that could use some money,” said Brown. “But not this way.”

If Adelson really wants to feel useful, there are some limited options, said Shapiro. “Embassy 4th of July parties can receive both cash (usually a few thousand dollars) and in-kind contributions from U.S. companies operating overseas. They are then listed as sponsors, which is a form of promoting U.S. businesses.”

Abraham Foxman, the emeritus national director of the Anti-Defamation League – who also thought private funding for embassies was a terrible idea -had a different proposal.

“It would be nice if the Adelsons could pay for the art in the embassy,” he said. “There’s never a budget for art.”

The State Department runs an “Art in Embassies” program that solicits private money to help create “vital cross-cultural dialogue and mutual understanding through the visual arts and dynamic artist exchanges.”
https://www.haaretz.com/us-news/even-su ... -1.5848792

Jordan calls on Israel to ‘immediately’ reverse its decisions on churches in Jerusalem

[Zionist Nationalist]

Why do you think they all hate each other so much

Palestinian national identity is fake

Just like Syria Jordan Lebanon,Iraq they are all artificial countries created by the European powers

[anasawad]

@Zionist Nationalist
Jordan, Syria and Palestine are indeed that. But just like Israel in that regard.
Jordan was two. Syria was 3 and a part of a forth.
And Palestine was 2, or 3 if we're counting the Golan with it.
Lebanon however has been on its current borders since around 4000-5000 years. And it was pinned Lebanon 4000 years ago.
To be specific, from the eastern mountains to the sea. And from the mountain ranges in the north to those in the south. It always had very clear boundaries and have had a national identity since several thousands of years.
So, no, its not a fake country. You can look up its history if you'd like.

[Zionist Nationalist]

Lebanon never existed as a nation and during the Ottoman Era it was divided by 2 administrative regions both which had territories in todays Syria and Israel

I believe if Israel wouldnt exist the Palestine as a country wouldnt exist either as they would be divided by the surrounding Arab countries or annexed completely by Syria or Jordan

[anasawad]

Yes it did. A nation is different from a state.
Lebanon always existed as a nation, however its statehood was suppressed by some empires and allowed autonomy by others during the past 2000 years; nevertheless its history as a nation goes back thousands of years prior to that.


EDIT:
For Syria and Jordan and Palestine, they were several nations and still are.
North of Jordan and South of Jordan were always 2 different nations.
In Syria the coast, Aleppo, and Damascus were 3 separate nations with different national identities.
Palestine has 2, one is the Palestinian Arabs who began forming their national identity in the recent centuries, and Gaza being a separate nation altogether. If we were to count the Golan in Palestine, then the Druze were always a seperate nation.
The only difference between Palestine and Jordan and Syria, is that nations in Syria and Jordan formed thousands of years ago but were conquered by various empires. While the Palestinians had their identity and culture essentially erased by empires then a new one taking place in the recent centuries.

[skinster]

Palestinian national identity is fake

Just like Syria Jordan Lebanon,Iraq they are all artificial countries created by the European powers

Especially coming from a goy from Russia who lives in an Arab country called Palestine.

[Zionist Nationalist]

I dont live in an Arab country

and Palestine is not a country its an autonomous region (West bank,Gaza)

[skinster]

Palestine is an Arab country and has been for centuries, it's full of Arabs, amongst the natives and even zionists. The European, American and Russian settler-colonialists are in the minority. Palestine doesn't stop being an Arab country just because foreigners barged in, claimed ownership and pretended to invent hummus.

[Zionist Nationalist]

Palestine is not a country (and never was) whatever you like it or not

you can continue to pretend that it is but it wont change anything

[skinster]

You're living in Palestine. "Israel" is just something made-up 6/7 decades ago. But anyway we can agree to disagree.

[Zionist Nationalist]

and you live on stolen native American land

Palestine is made up

there never was a country or a sovereign entity called Palestine ever since this term was invented by the Romans

[skinster]

Yes I know I live on land belonging to native Americans. Difference between you and I is I can admit it. Anyway, I thought we were going to agree to disagree so I could stop interacting with you...

[Hindsite]

Palestine is made up

there never was a country or a sovereign entity called Palestine ever since this term was invented by the Romans

Israel is often called Palestine which is a derogatory term used by her enemies in the past. There was never a Palestine and there is no such thing as Palestinian people until the conflict of our modern time.

After the second Jewish revolt under Bar Cochba (A.D. 132-135) it is said the Roman emperor Hadrian renamed the land of Israel and Judea as Palastina ('Palestine') after the ancient enemies of the Jews - the Philistines. Because of his hatred of the Jews, it was meant to be an insult to dishonor them and remove their history. Hadrian built Aelia Capitolina, in the area of the destroyed Temple and dedicated it to Jupiter-Zeus demonstrating the supremacy of the Roman deities in Judea. He then forbid the Jews from entering.

The land kept this name until 1948 when the British Government gave up its mandate to partition Palestine between the Jews and the Arabs. The majority of the land was given to the Arabs. However, the Arabs refused this offer as they wanted ALL of the land and attacked Israel. Today Palestine is used like it was from its inception-as an anti Jewish term.

The name Palestine was adopted by the Moslem residents of the Holy Land and used for their advantage. “Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel... “ (Zuheir Muhsin, late Military Department head of the PLO and member of its Executive Council, Dutch daily Trouw, March 1977).

http://www.letusreason.org/Biblexp63.htm

Did the White Man Steal North America From the Indians?

97% of America was not legally the "property" of anyone. When America was claimed by the English, French, and Spanish, they claimed the entire breadth and width of the land, from sea to sea, from one boundary to the next. However, the lands that the Indians occupied within these European claims were still Indian land.

http://www.british-israel.ca/America.htm#.WpTmN_krKmU

[skinster]