[foxdemon]

Pretty decent article on why Russia might have done this. They want to send a message. They wanted to get caught. Ironic then that so many on this forum want to deny it. Note most are either haters of the uk/west or leftists or alt rightists. Russia has many bed fellows these days and most are massive hypocrites.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... are_btn_wa

That article is spot on.

Putin has been probing the UK for some years. There is the submarine incidents, due to UK failure to field ASW aircraft, boasts of sinking the new carriers, etc. The RN had become a shadow of its former self. The UK is isolated by Brexit and Trump. Putin senses weakness.

[jessupjonesjnr87]

Maybe Russia should have blown up the guys neighbourhood with a drone strike like NATO do when they want to assassinate a target.

[Atlantis]

Maybe Russia should have blown up the guys neighbourhood with a drone strike like NATO do when they want to assassinate a target.

That's different. The Yanks have the right to kill wherever they want. International law only applies to the others.

If the British have evidence, why don't they let the experts decide? Why don't they submit the case to the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons at the Hague?

Oh right, you can never trust the experts, is that it? Is the only proof in the gut feelings of the cold warriors?

Statement by Permanent Representative of the Russian Federation to the OPCW, Ambassador Alexander Shulgin, at the 87th session of the OPCW Exwecutive Council on the chemical incident in Salisbury, The Hague, March 13, 2018

Mr Chairperson,

In connection with the vicious attacks launched by British officials in London, as well as the statement by the head of the British delegation to the OPCW with regard to Russia concerning the suspicious story of two persons poisoned with a toxic agent in Salisbury, we would like to state the following.

The British authorities’ unfounded accusations of Russia’s alleged involvement in using poisonous agents on their territory are absolutely unacceptable. Our British colleagues should recall that Russia and the United Kingdom are members of the OPCW which is one of the most successful and effective disarmament and non-proliferation mechanisms. We call upon them to abandon the language of ultimatums and threats and return to the legal framework of the chemical convention, which makes it possible to resolve this kind of situation.

If London does have serious reasons to suspect Russia of violating the CWC – and the statement read by distinguished Ambassador Peter Wilson indicates directly that this is so – we suggest that Britain immediately avail itself of the procedures provided for by paragraph 2 of Article 9 of the CWC. They make it possible, on a bilateral basis, to officially contact us for clarifications regarding any issues that raise doubts or concerns.

We would also like to emphasise that such clarifications under the Convention are provided to the requesting member state as soon as possible, but in any case no later than 10 days following receipt of the request. As such, the ultimatum’s demand that information be provided immediately, by the end of today, is absolutely unacceptable.

Our British colleagues should save their propaganda fervour and slogans for their unenlightened domestic audience, where perhaps they will have some effect. Here, within the walls of a specialised international organisation, such as the OPCW, one must use facts and nothing but the facts. Stop fomenting hysteria, go ahead and officially formalise your request to begin consultations with us in order to clarify the situation.

A fair warning, we will require material evidence of the alleged Russian trace in this high-profile case. Britain’s allegations that they have everything, and their world-famous scientists have irrefutable data, but they will not give us anything, will not be taken into account. For us, this will mean that London has nothing substantial to show, and all its loud accusations are nothing but fiction and another instance of the dirty information war being waged on Russia.

Sooner or later, they will have to be held accountable for their lies.

In addition, in this particular case, it would be legitimate for the British side to seek assistance from the OPCW Technical Secretariat in conducting an independent laboratory analysis of the available samples that allegedly show traces of nerve agents in Salisbury.

Thank you, Mr Chairperson.

We ask you to circulate this statement as an official document of the 87th session of the OPCW’s Executive Council and post it on the Organisation’s external server.

[layman]

@Atlantis

The media in Russia is already running with this aggressively. The theory that it is Russia is far more credible that it being mi6 or Mossad.

You are just burying your head in the sand to an almost unbelievable degree if you don’t think put in is trying to divide the West. You could not possibly have missed all the anti eu propaganda from brexit to Italy to Greece. It certainly isn’t subtle.

You always jump to Russia’s defence and attack the uk at any opportunity so this is all very predictable from you. Just for a moment to put it to one side.

Just turn in rt for gods sake. This stuff is in plain sight.

[foxdemon]

Not the strongest response from the EU. Some countries such as Latvia show greater commitment. The American response is as disappointing as their response to turkey.

https://euobserver.com/foreign/141299


EU 'stands with' UK on alleged Russian attack

No plans yet to discuss Skripal at next week's EU summit (Photo: Council of the European Union)
By ANDREW RETTMAN

BRUSSELS, 13. MAR, 09:26
The EU and Nato have conveyed sympathy to the UK, as Britain threatens sanctions on Russia over its alleged nerve gas attack.
"I want to express my strong feelings of solidarity with the British people and the British government. We stand with you," Frans Timmermans, the vice-president of the European Commission, said on Monday (12 March).


Russia's Zakharova denigrated UK 'circus show' and 'fairy tales' (Photo: mid.ru)
An EU spokesperson told EUobserver: "We are aware of events surrounding Sergei Skripal and wish him and his daughter [the victims of the attack], also critically ill in hospital, a swift and full recovery".

Jens Stoltenberg, the head of the Western military alliance, said: "The UK is a highly valued ally and this incident is of great concern to Nato."

He added that the alliance was cooperating with British authorities in their ongoing investigation.

The statements came after British prime minister Theresa May said in parliament the same day it was "highly likely" that the Russian state had ordered Skripal's assassination and had used Novochek, a military-grade nerve agent, to poison him, his daughter, and three British policemen in Salisbury on 4 March.

She said it was possible Russia had "lost control" of its Novochek stock to a non-state group.

But she threatened to impose "much more extensive measures" than previous Russia sanctions if the Russian foreign ministry did not give a "credible" account of its innocence by Tuesday evening.

"It was an indiscriminate and reckless act against the United Kingdom, putting the lives of innocent civilians at risk," she said.

The Russian foreign ministry called May's words "a circus show in Britain's parliament".

Its spokeswoman, Maria Zakharova, also described as "fairy tales" previous allegations that Russia had murdered Alexander Litvinenko, Boris Berezovsky, and Alexander Perepilichny, three other Russian exiles in the UK, in the past few years.

The Russian embassy to the UK said it was "outraged" by the "anti-Russian media campaign" in Britain and that May's government was playing "a very dangerous game … with British public opinion".

Extensive measures

The UK expelled Russian diplomats and imposed visa bans and asset freezes on suspects over the killing of Litvinenko in London using a radioactive poison in 2006.

May's "more extensive measures" could include wider Russian asset freezes, seeking further EU-level sanctions, increasing the Nato presence on Russia's border, designating Russia as a state sponsor of terrorism, or a more creative response, such as leaking intelligence that would embarrass Russian leader Vladimir Putin ahead of Russia's upcoming election.

The EU, also on Monday, extended the life of its existing Russia visa bans and asset freezes by six months over Russia's continuing aggression in east Ukraine.

It is preparing to roll over economic sanctions on Russia before July.

But EU foreign ministers are not planning to discuss the Skripal affair when they meet in Brussels on Monday, with Ukraine, Syria, Iran, and North Korea on the agenda instead.

EU leaders also have no plans to discuss Skripal when they meet in Brussels next Thursday for talks on Brexit, eurozone reform, and EU relations with Turkey.

"At this moment, it [the Skripal attack] is not on the agenda, but it is still early days," Preben Amman, a spokesman for the EU Council, which prepares the summit agendas, told EUobserver on Monday.

The US would normally align itself with any UK or EU-level reaction to an international incident of this scale, but the White House repeatedly dodged questions on whether the US backed the British conclusion that Russia was "highly likely" to blame.

"The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against UK citizens on UK soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate, and irresponsible," Huckabee Sanders, the spokeswoman of the Russia-friendly US president Donald Trump, told press on Thursday.

Kremlin emboldened

Recalling the Litvinenko assassination, Molly Scott Cato, a British Green party MEP, said the British government had emboldened Russia by taking too little action at the time.

"We need to wake up to the fact that … Russian political retribution [is] spilling out onto the streets of the UK," she said.

Russia experts agreed that the Kremlin probably ordered the Skripal attack.

"Putin ... used on purpose military grade nerve agent to try to assassinate Skripal to make sure we all knew who did it. He is taunting us, daring us to do nothing," Michael McFaul, a former US ambassador to Moscow, said.

Mark Galeotti, a British expert at the Institute of International Relations in Prague, said: "The odds that Russia's government lost control of Novichok stocks and this was used by some murderous mavericks to go after Skripal are minimal".

"It will be highly interesting to see if the rest of the EU as well as the US line up to support London in the confrontation with the Kremlin over state murders," Carl Bildt, the former foreign minister of Sweden, said.

[foxdemon]

You always jump to Russia’s defence and attack the uk at any opportunity so this is all very predictable from you. Just for a moment to put it to one side.

His level of commitment to Russia is so great, it is almost like he gets paid for it.

[anarchist23]

The UK will expel 23 Russian diplomats after Moscow refused to explain how a Russian-made nerve agent was used on former spy in Salisbury, the PM says.
Theresa May said the diplomats, who have a week to leave, were identified as "undeclared intelligence officers".
Russia denies being involved in the attempted murder of former spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia.
It refused to meet Mrs May's midnight deadline to co-operate in the case.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43402506

[Ter]

The UK will expel 23 Russian diplomats after Moscow refused to explain how a Russian-made nerve agent was used on former spy in Salisbury, the PM says.

And the next step will be Russia expelling 23 British diplomats.
Zero sum blah blah
It is all for nothing.
And they peed a big puddle and everything stayed the way it was.

[ArtAllm]

That's different. The Yanks have the right to kill wherever they want. International law only applies to the others.

The POTUS can only do what the Globalist banksters tell him to do.
Globalist wars on the other side of the world that are in the interests of Israel - that is OK!
Protect the own boarder from third world intruders - that is "racism".

If the British have evidence, why don't they let the experts decide? Why don't they submit the case to the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons at the Hague?

Oh right, you can never trust the experts, is that it? Is the only proof in the gut feelings of the cold warriors?

It is enough to say "Russia did it", and this should work!
It worked in the past, Brits and Americans were stampeded in numerous wars that were not in their interests.

But now it is getting old, you cannot fool all of the Goyim all of the time!

[B0ycey]

Hang on @layman. What published evidence have you seen that proves this is Russia? The UK demanded a response from Russia and when they asked to see some evidence on the substance first before giving a response, the UK decline. So did Russia. I suspect it is difficult to give an answer for missing nerve agents if you do not know what stock it was from. This isn't a defense for Russia, just common cortiousy if you are expecting an answer. The UK should not have made any assumptions or caused any diplomatic tensions until they can prove it was Russia. It isn't worth the diplomatic shitfest you get from it especially if they find out they were wrong.

Anyway, the UK have came out with the 'either it's you or you have lost you stock line and will expel 23 people. Big woop. Like everyone knew there was nothing the could do anyway. This is the UK thinking that they are a big fish. Really, compared to Russia they are just a fish. They also said that the Royal Family won't be attending the World Cup. So there is some spare tickets for some real fans then. Not tax dodging privileged jokers. I bet William is gutted he can't go. Too bad mate, you'll have to watch it on the telly like the rest of us.

[ingliz]

common courtesy

The UK should have provided a sample.

A State Party which receives a request from another State Party for clarification of any matter which the requesting State Party believes causes such a doubt or concern shall provide the requesting State Party as soon as possible, but in any case not later than 10 days after the request, with information sufficient to answer the doubt or concern raised along with an explanation of how the information provided resolves the matter.

OPCW Article 9:2

[Balancer]

On the eve of the assassination attempt on the traitor, a brooding FSB officer stood in front of a table of boards on a secret appearance in Salisbury. On the table were laid out:

- potassium cyanide
- strychnine
- British spy poison from the number of seized earlier
- hatchet from the nearest wood-burning barn
- a black market gun in the East End, missing from the radar ten years ago
- homemade bomb
- bayonet knife
- Banana

- and, finally, a unique nerve agent, developed in the USSR in the 1980s.

"Well, of course!" — slapped an officer on his forehead. "Only with the help of a unique Soviet toxic agent can I cover up the tracks leading to Russia!" Then he grabbed a tube of poison, straightened his hat with a star on his head and went out into the morning Salisbury, mixing with the crowd.

[Seeker8]

Exactly so if Russia done it they must have wanted everyone to know it was them. But why the fuck would they want that? it makes no sense.

[layman]

@B0ycey for the record, no, obviously nothing is proven and imo the uk government is being very premature.

I do however think it is most likely the Russian state.

@Seeker8 of course it makes sense. Creating a conflict with others is the oldest trick in the book to get unity. plus, testing the water againt weak uk is perfectly timed. Just like how they send boats and planes into others air space.

There is enough plausibile deniability to create confusion like this thread. The very fact virtually no one here thinks he did it contradicts what you said. It’s actually classic Putin. Impressive.

[Balancer]

Creating a conflict with others is the oldest trick in the book to get unity.

And why is the West so actively helping the Kremlin in this matter? If Theresa May did not rash allegations in the absence of any evidence, but conducted an investigation and published convincing evidence of Russia's guilt, the Kremlin's position would become less solid. But, no, she does everything possible to ensure that her actions are not similar to the weighed policy moves, but to the hysterics of the insane bi*ch. And, of course, this strengthens the people's unity in Russia.

[Seeker8]

@Seeker8 of course it makes sense. Creating a conflict with others is the oldest trick in the book to get unity. plus, testing the water againt weak uk is perfectly timed. Just like how they send boats and planes into others air space.

Ok but does Putin have a problem with unity and support in Russia? Does he really need this to risk getting more sanctions put on them by the west?

Does this argument not make more sense against the U.K government?
We know the U.K government have terrible problems with unity just now. and they are in an impossible to win situation on Brexit, so it's about to get much worse. If anyone needs a distraction like this it's the U.K Government.

[layman]

@Balancer yes may is approaching this in the same clumsy manner that she does everything.

@Seeker8 firstly, I just don’t think the uk government would believe it could get away with this without a leak. There certainly is a motive to create unity right now but Russia makes a poor boogeyman in the 21st century. Just look st this thread or numerous comment sections. People don’t buy it. If they wanted to do this then a jihadist false flag would be infinitely more effective.

Just look to your own instincts. You and nearly every other person on this forum doesn’t buy a Russian connection.

It’s possible this was a supremely clumsy and brash, reckless move by the brits but I would sooner think it was Mossad.

Yes, Putin is guaranteed to win but he still wants legitimacy as well as victory. This is an easy win against the uk which reenforces his image as a strong winner who can influence and manipulate others. I don’t think the risk of sanctions is high and my understanding is that there isn’t much more room for additional ones. Proving such things to court of law standards is always virtuslly impossible. Lots of people still don’t hold him responsible for that passenger plain in Ukraine.

[anarchist23]

Overkill or what?

[Beren]

Despite Brexit the UK just can't be prevented from being dragged into conflict with Russia by the EU.

[Balancer]

Overkill or what?

In Russia, now begins the same problem "Wag the Dog". Now the Kremlin simply has to answer tough, otherwise the Russians will be angry. Now in Russia everyone is sitting and waiting for what will be the response of official authorities. Now in Russia there comes evening, so, most likely, the answer will be tomorrow.