[Oxymandias]

@One Degree

The iPhones are just an example. Furthermore, you have completely skewed my arguments. My argument is that tech and manufacturing companies will be unable to even function because a majority of the actual manufacturing for their products is done in China and their business model completely revolves around that. If China were to cut off trade with the US, these companies would lose billions in cash, have to completely restructure themselves, and would be unable to produce anything which may allow them to make a product. What are they going to do, rely on the American manufacturing industry? The term "American manufacturing industry" is a joke by itself. The America's industrial and manufacturing industry is dead. It require more than just a couple of tariffs on steel to revive it. Trump is unprepared for a trade war and hasn't implemented good enough policies to prepare America for a trade war.

[One Degree]

@One Degree

The iPhones are just an example. Furthermore, you have completely skewed my arguments. My argument is that tech and manufacturing companies will be unable to even function because a majority of the actual manufacturing for their products is done in China and their business model completely revolves around that. If China were to cut off trade with the US, these companies would lose billions in cash, have to completely restructure themselves, and would be unable to produce anything which may allow them to make a product. What are they going to do, rely on the American manufacturing industry? The term "American manufacturing industry" is a joke by itself. The America's industrial and manufacturing industry is dead. It require more than just a couple of tariffs on steel to revive it. Trump is unprepared for a trade war and hasn't implemented good enough policies to prepare America for a trade war.

I did understand your position. I don’t see that any of that should be the main priority. If we have a really rough time for awhile and some multinationals fold, then it is a cheap price if it results in a more secure and self sufficient society. I simply do not believe we should be so concerned about our immediate comfort. Building a better society has permanence and can create a much greater good for the most. We have lost this. We aren’t willing to sacrifice for a better future. I am just trying to rekindle a belief that I believe is the bedrock of what it means to be a caring human. The future is what matters most.

[One Degree]

I did understand your position. I don’t see that any of that should be the main priority. If we have a really rough time for awhile and some multinationals fold, then it is a cheap price if it results in a more secure and self sufficient society. I simply do not believe we should be so concerned about our immediate comfort. Building a better society has permanence and can create a much greater good for the most. We have lost this. We aren’t willing to sacrifice for a better future. I am just trying to rekindle a belief that I believe is the bedrock of what it means to be a caring human. The future is what matters most.

Edit: our dependence upon trade must ultimately be disastrous under the pressure of population growth.

[Oxymandias]

@One Degree

That's something I agree with but it can only be successful if the population is compliant to the US government as is willing to suffer low-living conditions for potentially higher ones without the instability that results from dependency on another state. Americans are not such a population. This is why the most successful developing countries are Asian ones or countries with traditions of being compliant to authority.

[One Degree]

@One Degree

That's something I agree with but it can only be successful if the population is compliant to the US government as is willing to suffer low-living conditions for potentially higher ones without the instability that results from dependency on another state. Americans are not such a population. This is why the most successful developing countries are Asian ones or countries with traditions of being compliant to authority.

My idealism wants me to argue against that, but my pragmatism won’t let me. Americans might rise to the occasion, but that requires me to argue a probability to your current reality. I concede your point.

[4cal]

No.

China has no worries about the US market. Five minutes of market research would reveal that their US consumers have stagnant wages and can ill afford to pay more for the same groceries, goods, and services. And don't forget, they own a bunch of our debt already.

If I were China, I'd go nuclear immediately and simply stop buying stuff for a few months as a warning of things to come.