[skinster]

Yes.

[skinster]

Bae in Liverpool last weekend.

[skinster]

Bae is in Halesowen and Redditch this Saturday.

[skinster]

My boyfriend is so hot when he calls out the neocons and psychopaths in general:

Antisemitism against an anti-racist backfired.

[LehmanB]

It's mostly right-wing tabloid hysteria with ZERO evidence.

This topic touches a very important issue: can left-wingers be anti-semites too.

[skinster]

Not really, since the antisemitism smears were manufactured by zionists in and out of the MSM.

Related:

[skinster]

I saw my boyfriend Corbyn in Redditch yesterday, t'was great, he talked a lot about things that are good and worth fighting for. Bae is so hot when he's angry. A handful of, what looked like unevolved humans, came along trying to disrupt the rally, but mainly got laughed at. One genius who was carrying the Israeli flag denied being a zionist, reminding me just how stupid zionists can be. Another kept going on about the IRA as if that mattered. T'was very amusing.

[Baff]

This topic touches a very important issue: can left-wingers be anti-semites too.

History would rather neatly prove they can be the mother of all anti-semites.


Personally I like to make a distinction between jews and Israelis

To be honest I often make a distinction between Israelis and the state of Israel too.

I don't think Commies were all that famously nice to Jews and Fascists were even worse, obviously.
The left has the claim on all major anti semitism outside of the Middle East.

What the political leanings of the Arab League governments were, I don't know.
I sort of imagine ultra conservative like Saudi, but I have no idea. The could as easily have been Commie progressives too.


In general I find the left to be highly racist.
Big on race discrimination. It's their thing.

Not that they would agree of course.
But basically you can't compensate for racial inferiority without recognising it exists.
I won't and they do.

[LehmanB]

What the political leanings of the Arab League governments were, I don't know.

There were two major regimes: Baath, and religious.

The "religious" regimes are governed by tyrans who are depanded on a strong religious consultant who actualy decides. In Iran the president is bend to the religious counceling. In Saudia the oposite, yet the dictate is actualy bound to them as well.

The Baath movements are tyrnas who rebel in the old system of religiious-colonial colaborators, and are pan-Arabic nationalists, secular, and socialists. In the 50th they were the trend among the young artificial Arab countries (artificial borders). Among: Egypt (Nazer), Syria (Assad), and Iraq (Saadam Hussein), and the PLO (Arafat).

In Egypt we see the tention between the Muslim Brtotherhood (religious) and the current president/all the last presidents (Baathists).
Among the Arabs in Israel we see the Hamas ( = muslim brotherhood/Taliban) VS the PLO which took over the palestinian autonomy in Judea and Samaria.
In Syria again- we have Assad (Baathist) VS the Muslim brotherhood which are supported by the west, and are vicious.

So these are constantly the two streams in the Arab world.

Both parties are socialists and collectivists in mindset, though the secular tend to be more pan-Arab or nationalists, vs the religious who tend to be pan-Muslims. And the harsh wars Israel had were actualy with the secular baathists. Whereas the hard terror, or no slight relationship is with the religious regimes.
The secular regimes used horrible rethorics against Israel and Jews, they also expeled the Jews or put harsh restrictions on the few who remained, and fueled the public on the lowest rethorics long vannished from Europe. So what can I say.. is it a struggle there between left and right?

[skinster]

This guy.

[Baff]

The Labour Party have played the race card so hard for so long, everyone is loving playing it back on them.
And it's a trap of their own making. Poetic Justice.

Trying to dig themselves out of hole isn't helping.
Essentially PC culture is eating itself. This is entirely self destructive behaviour. In order to better attract Muslims, they have had to give up Jews.

[skinster]

What are you talking about? This is a manufactured scandal from the Israel lobby in the UK.

[Vyth]

Criticism of Israel could be regarded as inherently racist if the following is true:

(a) The Israeli state embodies the core nature of the Jewish people, reflecting the essence of Jewishness; this makes it a perfect representative of the Jewish people. Diaspora Jews, in this view, are more alienated from their own Jewish identity, and until they return to their true homeland, they are somewhat of a deviation from authentic Jewishness. Opposition to the Israeli state, therefore, is an implicit attack on every Jew; it is an expression of blind hostility towards Jewishness as such, the state of Israel being embodiment of the Jewish people.

Criticism of Israeli state policies can thus be seen to a form of anti-Jewish bigotry, since the core policies of the Israeli state are in accordance with the ultimate will of the Jewish people. By analogy, if you hate how a person behaves, when his behaviour reflects exactly the sort of person he is by nature, then you do not like that person; simple as that. You THINK it is just his behaviour that you despise, but since he is acting true to his own nature and character, you hate the person as well, even if you are unconscious of hating him.

The same is true of the critics of the Israeli. In its domestic and foreign policies, Israel is true to its own nature as a Jewish state; if you like what Israel is doing, you then you like the Jewish people, and if you hate Israeli policies then you are a Jew-hater.

True, the Israelis conquered the Palestinians, and they done what was necessary to secure the territory, maintain a Jewish majority and ensure long-term Jewish rule. Moreover, is in the interest of the Jewish people to expand the borders of Israel, and to crush anyone that resists. For there are millions of Jews in Europe and America that will one day wish to settle in Israel. Aside from this, the Israelis want to increase the total world Jewish population, which will be concentrated in Israeli territory - therefore the Israelis need more territory. What is the problem?

(b) Jewish identity is partly ethnic in character. The Israeli state being the embodiment of the Jewish people, opposition to Israel is more than just a political attack, but also has an ethnic or 'racist' dimension to it, since Israel exists is a Jewish ethnostate. In Israel, all politics is ethno-politics. Therefore, when you are opposing Israel on 'political' grounds, you are also attacking Israel on ethnic grounds, whether you know it or not. In Israeli, there is no sharp separation between ethnic/racial interests and national/political interests. If you are opposed to Israel, you are against the Jewish will to survive at any cost, to expand and grow as a people. It is characteristic of all healthy life forms to secure its own territory, to multiply, to grow, to expand. If you do not want the Jews to conquer their own territories, then you are hostile to Jewish life.

[skinster]

^ Nope. Firstly, you're being antisemitic by suggesting all Jews support Israel. Lots of Jews oppose Israel and zionism, the ideology behind Israel (which btw includes goys under its umbrella).

[Deutschmania]

I think I will reword this , in order to make a historical analogy to Germany during the time period of the 30's and 40's.

Criticism of Germany could be regarded as inherently racist if the following is true:

(a) The German state embodies the core nature of the German people, reflecting the essence of Germanness; this makes it a perfect representative of the German people. Diaspora Germans, in this view, are more alienated from their own German identity, and until they return to their true homeland, they are somewhat of a deviation from authentic Germanness. Opposition to the German state, therefore, is an implicit attack on every German; it is an expression of blind hostility towards Germanness as such, the state of Germany being embodiment of the German people.

Criticism of German state policies can thus be seen to a form of anti-German bigotry, since the core policies of the German state are in accordance with the ultimate will of the German people. By analogy, if you hate how a person behaves, when his behaviour reflects exactly the sort of person he is by nature, then you do not like that person; simple as that. You THINK it is just his behaviour that you despise, but since he is acting true to his own nature and character, you hate the person as well, even if you are unconscious of hating him.

The same is true of the critics of the German. In its domestic and foreign policies, Germany is true to its own nature as a German state; if you like what Germany is doing, you then you like the German people, and if you hate German policies then you are a German-hater.

True, the Germans conquered the Poles , and Slavs , among others, and they had done what was necessary to secure the territory, maintain a German majority and ensure long-term German rule. Moreover, is in the interest of the German people to expand the borders of Germany, and to crush anyone that resists. For there are millions of Germans in Europe and America that will one day wish to settle in Germany. Aside from this, the Germans want to increase the total world German population, which will be concentrated in German territory - therefore the Germans need more territory , i.e. "lebensraum". What is the problem?

(b) German identity is partly ethnic in character. The German state being the embodiment of the German people, opposition to Germany is more than just a political attack, but also has an ethnic or 'racist' dimension to it, since Germany exists is a German "volksstadt ". In Germany, all politics is ethno-politics. Therefore, when you are opposing Germany on 'political' grounds, you are also attacking Germany on ethnic grounds, whether you know it or not. In Germany, there is no sharp separation between ethnic/racial interests and national/political interests. If you are opposed to Germany , you are against the German will to survive at any cost, to expand and grow as a people. It is characteristic of all healthy life forms to secure its own territory, to multiply, to grow, to expand. If you do not want the Germans to conquer their own territories, then you are hostile to German life.

So congratulations on turning into the mirror image of the Nazi adversary . You have come a long way indeed .

[Baff]

What are you talking about? This is a manufactured scandal from the Israel lobby in the UK.

Justifiably manufactured.
Corbyn, Labour and by the looks of it all his fans are anti Israel.

They aren't making that up. It's true.

It's fairly common sentiment to be anti-zionist.
I have some such feelings myself.

But Labour are loony tunes about it. Hard corps.


I'm sure the Israel lobby do want to raise awareness of this in any potential future UK government.
Who can blame them?

[Baff]

^ Nope. Firstly, you're being antisemitic by suggesting all Jews support Israel. Lots of Jews oppose Israel and zionism, the ideology behind Israel (which btw includes goys under its umbrella).

Yes and no.
Lots do.

Lots and lots and lots and lots more don't.

A small minority do.
By and large if a jew has an opinion you should expect that opinion to be pro Israel.


Being anti-zionist is not being anti jewish, but ignoring the political orientation of most jewish people, and demonising it as bad... is being anti-jewish.

You see, you can take these things too far.
And a great many people do. Corbyn and the Labour party are currently taking it way too far.
They have doubled down when they needed to ease off.

[skinster]

Justifiably manufactured.
Corbyn, Labour and by the looks of it all his fans are anti Israel.

There's nothing justifiable about it at all since it's an Israeli lobby plot to take down politicians who agree with international law and care about human rights of an illegally occupied and brutally blockaded people.

It's fairly common sentiment to be anti-zionist.
I have some such feelings myself.

It's the present and the future.

I'm sure the Israel lobby do want to raise awareness of this in any potential future UK government.
Who can blame them?

Everyone, since they're maintaining an illegal occupation and denying human/civil rights to the natives of Palestine, while imprisoning a couple of million of them.

Yes and no.
Lots do.

Lots and lots and lots and lots more don't.

A small minority do.
By and large if a jew has an opinion you should expect that opinion to be pro Israel.

Not in my experience. Even in the UK, I understand more Jews are anti-zionist and would rather not say than pro-zionist.

Being anti-zionist is not being anti jewish, but ignoring the political orientation of most jewish people, and demonising it as bad... is being anti-jewish.

Anti-zionism is anti-racism, not pro-racism. That's just zionist projection at play.

You see, you can take these things too far.
And a great many people do. Corbyn and the Labour party are currently taking it way too far.
They have doubled down when they needed to ease off.

It's not they who have taken it too far, but the zionist lobbies who oppose international law and justice for the natives of Palestine that they continue to steal the homes of and kill very regularly.

[Baff]

Right so you hate Israel and agree they are bunch of evil bastards.
Therefore it is justifiable for Israel to recognise your enmity towards them.

Because it exists and it is real.

[skinster]

It's not about hating Israel but supporting human rights, which Israel denies the Palestinians and has done for 7 decades. If that makes them "evil bastards", which are your words and not mine, okay. I mean shooting dead imprisoned children every Friday from a distance in Gaza is pretty evil. So is torturing children in the West Bank, but still, I probably wouldn't use the word 'evil' to describe this violent racism.

Israel is not justified in reacting to the opposition of its war crimes by committing further crimes by sending its lobby into other countries to try to take down politicians who speak out against their crimes.

How about not supporting genocidal racists instead of apologizing for them?