[Zagadka]

The poor guy was probably stoned of his gills

Good argument. He is at fault because he had drugs in his room that she could know nothing about and was obviously totally stoned because reasons.

[foxdemon]

Good argument. He is at fault because he had drugs in his room that she could know nothing about and was obviously totally stoned because reasons.

Why is he at fault for being stoned? It only explains why he was not able to react.

Think about it. There you are stoned as a crow, a cop bursts into your room, points a gun at you and starts screaming orders. Of course you will stand there gawking like a stunned mullet.

The fault here is that the police office had the mental state of a zombie after a 15 hour shift and 4 years of service induced PSTD. Maybe you should employ more cops so they don’t have to do 15 hour shifts?

[Godstud]

As to the victim, they found dope in his room. The poor guy was probably stoned of his gills when the police officer entered his apartment and his just stood there thinking he was seeing things and wondering if he had smoked too much, so didn’t respond to the officer’s instructions.

Irrelevant. It was his own home. The penalty for being stoned, or even in possession of marijuana, is not death.

@Suntzu I was not making anything up, and your childish insult, is just that. Nothing you said makes me wrong, and it's mostly irrelevant. Real life doesn't segregate people into "weight classes", and not all people are equally trained. A well trained police officer, regardless of weight, can probably best an untrained civilian. That's just fact. Most people are not trained in any martial arts, or in fighting, and the ones who do, generally don't cause trouble with their training.

The fault here is that the police office had the mental state of a zombie after a 15 hour shift and 4 years of service induced PSTD.

Irrelevant. The police officer was not the victim, but you seem to want to make the police officer out to be one... The police officer was at fault, or at the very least the police force was at fault, for allowing a police officer to work that many hours, and with PTSD. Period.

[Torus34]

Reading the posts on this thread, I'm made aware once again that race plays a part in the responses of Americans to all manner of situations. It's dangerous in that it distorts our perception and understanding. How much of a role it played in this killing may never be known with certainty.

[Suntzu]

In a physical confrontation, a big guy bests a small guy nearly every time. A 110 pound female cop is no match for a 200 pound civilian. Her only option is to shoot.

[Oxymandias]

(1) If you go to other countries, you will see people literally living hand to mouth in a state of perpetual poverty but without much in the way of violent crime. One of the biggest differences between a Korean "ghetto" (though it is had to say such a thing exists) and an American one is that the worst thing that'll happen to you in the Korean version is that they'll try to sell you sex or get y ou to gamble everywhere, and all the men work as very cheap labor and maybe occasionally drive around a Bongo truck and steal bicycles.

Dude, you clearly haven't been to a Korean ghetto and yes, they exist. Furthermore, intense poverty always leads to violent crime. You just don't hear about violent crimes in Korea due to poverty since you listen to Korean news. Also gambling is something the Yakuza do and they certainly are very violent.

Poverty doesn't make people kill each other and rob each other blind. It might make people do worst things in general, sure, but that's not the case.

http://open.lib.umn.edu/sociology/chapt ... l-poverty/
https://www.economist.com/international ... f-violence

Yes, it does make them more violent overall. You just hear about black crimes more than Korean or Indian crimes. You just don't care about Korean or Indian crimes because you are biased and think such crimes don't exist.

(2) Why wouldn't the shooter be unhinged if she shot an unarmed black man in his home while he was making no threatening moves? How could you do that and not have a mental issue or some weird tick?

"Why wouldn't a black shooter be unhinged if she shot a bunch of unarmed bank attendants while they were making no threatening moves? How could you do that and not have a mental issue or some weird tick?"

You know, the Somali Muslim cop in America who shot and killed an Australian woman for no apparent reason was kept on the police force. He was mentally unhinged even though he never did something so dramatic to show it, and nobody doubts the fact that he was off his rocker when he shot the woman.

Well you certainly do given that you think that poverty doesn't lead to violent crime and that, by extension, lead's to the argument that such people commit violent crimes (explicitly blacks) because of genes or some stupid edgelord crap like that.

Robert Spencer wrote a very good piece about this recently o'er at PJ Media.

The minute you've mentioned an Islamophobe with zero historical knowledge is when you've lost all credibility.

Yeah, black people can be insane and disturbed, and they can be violent. And white people can be the same.

This contradicts your earlier statements about poverty not leading to violence which implies that the people who do act violent due to poverty are doing so because of innate behavior within their genes.

IDK, are we actually discussing this or are you just throwing the kitchen sink of leftist accusations at me?

I'm an Iranian. I don't operate on that political spectrum.

[skinster]

Yes, I am white; I have an opinion; I disagree with someone, and I state the reasons why, and I am "whitesplaining."

No, that was in reference to you supporting/justifying/apologizing for murder because the victim was an innocent Black man. It is a common thing we see from racists, on these board too.

Also George Zimmerman is a racist piece of shit. Brown people are capable of racism too.

PUNK ROCK!

Why is he at fault for being stoned? It only explains why he was not able to react.

It might be hard to react to a bullet coming your way, whether stoned or sober. I'm guessing he didn't have a bullet vest on and a gun in his hand to defend himself like a normal person at home, what a jerk!

[Red_Army]

Fucking nazi logic is hilarious. Why dont I stop and consider the murderer cop's feelings? Again you people should just drop hard R's so everyone knows where you stand.

[foxdemon]

Irrelevant. It was his own home. The penalty for being stoned, or even in possession of marijuana, is not death.

Irrelevant. The police officer was not the victim, but you seem to want to make the police officer out to be one... The police officer was at fault, or at the very least the police force was at fault, for allowing a police officer to work that many hours, and with PTSD. Period.

Godstud, do you realise you have agreed with me? It is exactly the case that the police force, or rather the city, is at fault for the reason you say.


@Red_Army @skinster

It will always be about racism for you two because it suits your political agenda.

[Red_Army]

@foxdemon you arguing that an obvious case of racism is not racism suits your political agenda. Are you so stupid that you don't realize that every opinion on something like this "suits a political agenda"?

[skinster]

[Godstud]

In a physical confrontation, a big guy bests a small guy nearly every time.

Yes, and the only exception to this rule is generally when one has received training. Fact: A trained person will defeat an untrained one most of the time.

Here's another fact... most women who become police officers are hardly 110 lb. They're cops, not swimwear models. The average weight for an American woman is 168 lb.

[Verv]

Skinster, do you think he was really trying to throw up a "white power hand gesture?"

I am curious because this is like the new media panic -- people have literally taken Brett Kavanaugh's former legal aide, a Hispanic woman with Jewish grandparents that survived the HOlocaust, and say that she was throwing up a white power hand symbol (LOL) because one of her hands appeared to be making the "OK" sign while resting.

We are literally at a point where obscure prison gang hand signals are apparently being used by everyone from Hispanic legal aides to anonymous randoms in photographs to "signal" their loyalties, as if there is this complex network ranging from southern California white power prison gangs to Hispanic legal aides to ... guys in photographs with paranoid Texas cops whose identity is unknown but are probably normies without extremist ideas...

I don't get it. This is conspiratoiral and silly.

[Suntzu]

[skinster]

[Rancid]

True story, my uncle (before I was born in the 70s) was killed by police in NYC. Circumstances around that are unclear and hazy. It was easier for police to gloss over this kind of shit back then.

I should ask my parents for details about that the next time I visit Florida.

[skinster]

Everything You've Been Told About Botham Jean is Wrong
Come. Let me show you something.

Let me show you what it is to be black. To be forever erased from the realm of the living with a bang and a puff of smoke. To disappear silently into an empty void or, even worse, to have your death dissected in a desperate futile search for the meaninglessness of your existence.

Such is the case of Botham Shem Jean.

As soon as Amber Guyger’s police-issued firearm reportedly fell Botham Jean inside his own home, everyone began making excuses and asking why:

Maybe she was in the wrong apartment? Where did she park? How did she get in the apartment? Have you checked her key? How many hours did Guyger work that night? Oh, the door was open? Someone said they heard yelling. Was Jean armed? What if she genuinely feared for her life?

Many have wondered why police have charged Guyger with manslaughter and not murder. In Texas, murder is when a person “intentionally or knowingly causes the death of an individual,” as opposed to manslaughter, when someone “recklessly causes the death of another individual,” according to the Texas penal code.

John Creuzot, a former prosecutor, defense attorney and judge described the manslaughter charge for Guyger as a “deviation from the norm,” telling the Dallas Morning News he was “not aware of a case in which a person shoots another person in the torso, with death as the result, and is charged with manslaughter.”

In spite of the fact that Guyger pointed a gun at Botham Jean and pulled the trigger, apparently prosecutors and authorities have automatically assumed that she couldn’t have intended to kill Jean. Even the most imaginative Americans quickly dispel the notion that God-fearing, privilege-toting protectors and servers like Amber Guyger could be capable of such a thing. There must be a reason.

But no one has told Jean’s story. Ask his family if they care about Guyger’s intent. Jean probably had no time to contemplate whether the bullet spinning toward his chest was fired recklessly or intentionally. There is only one reason Bothem Jean is dead. Amber Guyger reportedly killed him.

The press, the police, other white people, even some black people are obsessed with trying to find the intent and the reasons for the bad actions of white people and cops. In the hidden truth of white America’s collective subconscious, even the idea of white incompetence, iniquity or guilt is inconceivable.

And that’s why everyone is telling this story wrong. In telling the story of Botham Jean, we are willing to rationalize the actions of incompetent police officers and white people in general. In the retelling of this real-life murder mystery, we have managed to humanize Amber Guyger. But no one is even willing to give Botham Jean a speaking part because a black victim is never seen as human...

Just a dead black thing.

We don’t care why black victims like Eric Garner gave up the ghost. We dismiss their humanity and fear by saying they “shouldn’t have resisted.” Stephon Clark is dead because he ran. We still don’t care to know what happened to Sandra Bland because, according to her critics, she could have saved her own life by simply complying. They never have voices. Just hashtags.

But the white stories are always told. Darren Wilson’s reasoning was heard in court when he said Michael Brown Jr. was a “hulk.” Dylann Roof’s tale of being radicalized by online white supremacists explained why he went on a killing spree at Emanuel A.M.E.’s bible study, so police gave him a post-arrest Whopper. Betty Shelby is back to working as a police officer and using the reasons why she killed unarmed Terence Crutcher to train other officers, because she obviously feared for her life.

White lawbreakers are motivated by video games, political influences, mental illness, divorce, heartbreak, bad finances or even creme-filled desserts. Before castigating a Caucasian killer or convicting a cop you must first step inside their shoes and consider if their fear was reasonable.

But no one cares about the intent of black victims and suspects, even when they are dead. What did Laquan McDonald intend to do with the 4-inch knife he was wielding when Jason Van Dyke pumped 16 bullets into the 17-year old? Why has no one ever explained why Trayvon Martin would jump on an armed man who outweighed him? Why was Stephon Clark not allowed the same fear as Betty Shelby? Even better, Google the last armed burglary in your city. Did the police even give a reason? Why doesn’t anyone care about the burglars’ intent?

Because that, dear reader, is what privilege is made of.

Although most people think of privilege as some sort of existential extra benefit, privilege is actually the white people magic that allows the media, lawmen and the public to manufacture the default presumption of innocence out of thin air when an offender is white. Yet, when a suspect is black, the constitutional right of innocence until proven guilty magically disappears into thin air.

It is the same spectacular abracadabra that recently snatched an entire parking lot from beneath Markeis McGlockton’s feet in Clearwater, Fla., handed it to Michael Drejka and convinced the Pinellas County Sherriff’s Department that when Drejka killed McGlockton over a parking space, Drejka’s only intent was to “stand his ground.”

If Botham Jean were telling his story, he would not say he was shot and killed by a white woman. To Botham Jean, she was a silhouette. She was a burglar, not a cop. When Amber Guyger shot Jean, she was not acting in the capacity of a law enforcement officer. She wasn’t on the clock or responding to a crime. She was an armed intruder who transformed an alive black man into an inanimate template for a chalk outline.

How many hours did Botham Jean work on Thursday before he was awakened by an armed intruder? Where did he park his car? How many verbal commands did he issue to Guyger to get the fuck out of his home?

Why should anyone give a nanosecond to contemplating Amber Guyger’s work schedule, what she was thinking, or what kind of mistakes she made when she allegedly killed a man? Why does her intent even matter?

This is why this case has nothing to do with racism or police brutality while simultaneously having everything to do with police brutality and whiteness. The media, law enforcement authorities and even juries are willing to comb through an infinite number of haystacks in search of a single needle with which they can affix mercy and understanding on cops and white people.

This dangerous game of white absolution is the exact reason the Trayvon Martin story makes black people so furious. If George Zimmerman had not stopped or followed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, he would still be alive. Trayvon is dead because of George Zimmerman’s actions. Yet the American justice system found a way for 12 jurors to find him not guilty.

Even though we know crime is largely a socioeconomic problem, no one even asks about intent, reasons or even why are there so many more poor black people. This is why judges sentence black criminals to sentences that are 20 percent longer than whites who commit the same crimes and why black suspects are offered plea deals less often than whites. It’s also the reason why police officers are rarely convicted for on-duty killings.

Apparently, black people aren’t even capable of reason and it is never a white man’s intent to kill.

And this is what it is to be black. To have your story told by the men whose bullets are still embedded inside your corpse. To be demonized by the men whose arms were wrapped around your throat as you begged them to allow you to breathe. This is us, moving targets, made for beatings, bulletholes and chokeholds.

We are not afforded the same humanity as whites. Even in death, we are inanimate, soulless bodies who must have done something wrong that forced them to stop our aggressively violent hearts from beating so loud.

Here is a true story that has never been told:

On Thursday, September 6, 2018, an armed burglar broke into the Dallas home of a Botham Shem Jean and shot him dead.

She was not a burglar, though. She was an excusable eraser. She was an innocent white woman who stumbled upon a tragedy and defended her life, which was obviously more valuable. But she is not a killer. She is a creator.

... of dead, black things.
https://www.theroot.com/everything-youv ... 1828980378

[skinster]

This is a start. Next, put her in prison for the rest of her life.

[Rancid]

My guess is the best she will be able to get away with his manslaughter. This means she could get as little as 2 years in prison. 20 years is the max for manslaughter. That is, unless they manage to up the charges.

[skinster]