[Verv]

Would I say what is of a similar quality? :?:

As to your belief that there is no racism against non whites on social media. I assume that you have never used any social media platform? Go look at the comments on any local paper's facebook page on any matter related to crime or to immigration. You are clutching at straws here.

Which is why a lot of these places totally disable comments. Oh, sure, buried on some newspaper somewhere there are these types of comments, but when it is possible the London police will literally come and arrest people.

I can't find specific numbers on the proportion of "hate crimes" that are purely online speech, but it is probably quite significant; I know I have seen numbers before. And this does not even count the amount of comments that are simply deleted and forgotten about.

75,000 people in a country of over 60 million souls is essentially nothing and you know it (also I expect they are all concentrated in London).

You don't even know they are there because they are not known to cause any sort of problems. There is no threat of wandering into the neighborhood with an abnormal amount of Spanish and getting messed up.

Not true of Sri Lankan Tamils, eh?

Now to get to the crux of the matter. If you are happy to acknowledge that mass immigration does not happen in left wing nations I assume you are also happy to accept that it only happens in right wing ones (the USA, the UK, Germany etc)?

Those aren't "right wing" nations so much as they are Capitalist neoconservative states.

Who do you think you are debating with? Jeb Bush?

Why is it you label it as a left wing idea? Is it just a cheap debating strategy or do you just hold onto your faith in the benevolent business overlords no matter how much evidence shows them doing all the importing of surplus labour you claim to be opposed to?

The fact is that if capitalism is allowed to continue to exist they will turn the whole world into one beige coloured cultureless easily exploitable mass of people with no solidarity with one another. We will all be reduced to the same cultural void as the yanks with no connection to our ancestors, the only way to preserve the many different peoples of the world is ending capitalism. Otherwise the rat race of people going half way across the world chasing min wage jobs will carry on forever.

it is a Left Wing idea because it is Antifa going around supporting "open borders" and the likes.

How do you account for that?

[Godstud]

Antifa is a fringe group on the "left", just as nazis are a fringe group on the "right". In short, extremists.

Extremely few left-wingers advocate open borders.

[Hindsite]

Antifa is a fringe group on the "left", just as nazis are a fringe group on the "right". In short, extremists.

Extremely few left-wingers advocate open borders.

Hillary Clinton campaigned on open borders in case you forgot or did not know.

During the final presidential debate, Donald Trump stated: “Hillary wants to give amnesty. She wants to have open borders.”

Fact-Check: True

In a private, paid speech to a Brazilian bank on May 16, 2013, Clinton said: “My dream is a hemispheric common market, with open trade and open borders, some time in the future with energy that is as green and sustainable as we can get it, powering growth and opportunity for every person in the hemisphere.”

https://www.breitbart.com/live/third-pr ... n-borders/

[Godstud]

Hillary Clinton campaigned on open borders in case you forgot or did not know.

False. Hillary said she had a dream about it, but never said it was going to be a reality. You do know what a "dream" is, right?

No, Democrats Don’t Want ‘Open Borders’
President Trump has falsely claimed at least two dozen times since taking office that Democrats want to open American borders. But legislation shows that Democrats support border security measures, though not the border wall he wants to build.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/us/p ... rders.html

[Hindsite]

[Godstud]

A DREAM. Look at the definition. It doesn't mean that it's a reality at this time, and the Democrats are not supporting such a thing, either.

Dream:
contemplate the possibility of doing something or that something might be the case.

It does not mean that it can become a reality, but if everything were perfect, it could be. Martin Luther King's dream still isn't a reality.

[Verv]

@Godstud , wouldn't you say it is true that the only restrictions to totally open borders that you see from the mainstream left (and even the mainstream right in Germany) is rote practicality?

Literally, a Swedish minister was crying about this reality:
The Guardian

Trudeau had also famously made statements which implied that he supported something which amounts to Open borders, but of course it was also walked back due to practical considerations and the actual laws of the land.

Amnesty and as open of borders as possible are the rule.

Fmr. Vice Pres. Joe Biden said:

ice President Joseph R. Biden told a National Association of Manufacturers’ crowd this week that what the United States needed was more, not fewer, immigrants.

Specifically, he called for a “constant, unrelenting stream” of new immigrants — “not dribbling [but] significant flows,” to bolster the national economy, The Hill reported.

“We need it badly from a purely — purely economic point of view,” Mr. Biden said, The Hill reported.

Later, on Twitter, he wrote: “The final thing we need to do together is pass immigration reform … We need it badly. -VP at manufacturing summit,” Newsmax reported.

Washington Times

These are very typical positions.

This basically amounts to advocating for open borders, whether you are a conservative like Merkel or a moderate liberal like Biden or an extreme liberal and Utopian like Ocasio-Cortez who has talked about abolishing ICE and, no doubt, would support policies that make Biden look like a moderate.

[Godstud]

@Godstud , wouldn't you say it is true that the only restrictions to totally open borders that you see from the mainstream left (and even the mainstream right in Germany) is rote practicality?

Yes. I think good immigration laws and border restrictions are absolutely necessary. I do not advocate open borders UNLESS you have a situation where both countries operate with unified immigration laws, and are at least very similar in government/welfare/social security systems.

I wouldn't suggest it between Canada and USA, because I think they differ enough that it would only cause problems for one or the other. Can you imagine the problems if North and South Korea did such a thing? Pandemonium!

Trudeau had also famously made statements which implied that he supported something which amounts to Open borders, but of course it was also walked back due to practical considerations and the actual laws of the land.

Right. Thank the gods for those laws.

Abolishing ICE is completely plausible IF the regular immigration enforcement actually goes after businesses hiring the illegals. Remember... ICE was only created in 2003.

[skinster]

You guys are off-topic again. Where is @Zagadka to save the day?

Back on topic:

[Hindsite]

A DREAM. Look at the definition. It doesn't mean that it's a reality at this time, and the Democrats are not supporting such a thing, either.

Dream:
contemplate the possibility of doing something or that something might be the case.

It does not mean that it can become a reality, but if everything were perfect, it could be. Martin Luther King's dream still isn't a reality.

What the Democrats have been supporting clearly has not been working to prevent illegal entry of drug dealers, gang members, rapists, and murders from entering the country. So I thing it is worth building a border wall as Trump suggests to see if that might help with the crime pouring into the country.

[Godstud]

What the Democrats have been supporting clearly has not been working to prevent illegal entry of drug dealers, gang members, rapists, and murders from entering the country.

FFS, What the republicans did, didn't do anything EITHER. Do you honestly believe it was better during the Bush years, or was your head in the sand?

So I thing it is worth building a border wall as Trump suggests to see if that might help with the crime pouring into the country.

Seeing as a wall in many places has done nothing to curb illegal immigration, it's fucking moronic to think yet more walls will help, seeing as most illegals enter the country at the fucking border crossings.

If something doesn't work, you don't keep doing the same stupid thing over and over again, hoping for different results.

Border Walls Don’t Stop Immigration, but They Do Undermine Integration
Border walls are gaining popularity in Europe and the U.S. In this excerpt from the Mercator Dialogue on Asylum and Migration’s 2017 assessment report, researchers explain how walls don’t stop immigration but shift migration patterns and harm integration.
https://www.newsdeeply.com/refugees/com ... ntegration

What Border Agents Say They Want (It’s Not a Wall)
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/22/us/p ... crats.html

[Hindsite]

California’s senators want de facto open borders

By Jeremy Carl June 22, 2018 Updated: June 23, 2018 10:50 a.m.

Well, President Trump has confirmed liberals’ fears by defying the rule of law — the problem for liberals is that he has done so is in response to their own demands on immigration.

The administration is almost surely correct in its original reasoning that as a result of the 1997 Flores consent decree and its 2016 extension by the Ninth Circuit, absent legal changes, the administration cannot legally detain families together, as he attempts to do in his new executive order.

But whatever its shortcomings, the administration’s effort is still far better than the bill offered by Democratic Sen. Dianne Feinstein — “Keep Families Together” — which is a monument to careless lawmaking that incredibly has been signed onto by all the Democratic, and two independent, senators. The bill was drafted so sloppily that it makes no distinctions between those arrested for crossing the border illegally and those accused of serious criminal acts who are also parents. As Sen. Tom Cotton, R-Ark. — the Senate’s most prominent immigration hawk — noted, the Feinstein bill will also encourage further kidnapping of children by ruthless gangs of human traffickers (a growing problem even acknowledged by the New York Times). One provision that stipulates a “strong presumption” in favor of family unity and a “presumption that detention is not in the best interests of families and children” effectively requires the vast majority of illegal immigrants arriving with children to be released into the general population rather than detained.

Republicans have known about the family separation issue and have been attempting to address it legislatively. Both major House immigration bills — introduced long before the latest immigration dustup — contain provisions that specifically supersede the Flores consent decree to allow families to be detained together.

The primary cause of the current crisis was the Obama administration’s wink-wink amnesty policies, which encouraged an enormous influx of illegal immigrants. Border crossings of adults with children soared from less than 15,000 in 2013 to almost 78,000 by the last year of the Obama administration. The numbers of pending immigration cases involving unaccompanied minors at the border pending went to 78,000 from less than 3,500 when Obama took office, according to the White House. This was not caused by any enormous objective change in the conditions in Central America, but because of specific policy incentives created by the Obama administration related to deportation procedures and asylum claims.

While the media breathlessly highlights cases of immigrants allegedly fleeing violence, a recent comprehensive United Nations study of thousands of Central American refugees suggested that from 1 to 5 percent of them came to the United States for reasons related to their security. The overwhelming majority acknowledged being economic migrants. But the Obama administration actively encouraged the abuse of the asylum process through changes in how “credible fear” claims (the first stage of an asylum claim) were handled. As a result, claims went from 5,000 in the first year of the Obama administration to 94,000 in the administration’s last year, according to Attorney General Jeff Sessions.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/opinion/art ... 018760.php

We need real border walls, not just fences.

[Godstud]

Stupidity. A 30 foot wall only makes a market for a 31 foot ladder. You didn't read a fucking thing I posted, did you @Hindsite?

75% of all illegals entering the USA come through border crossings. This is a FACT.

[Hindsite]

Stupidity. A 30 foot wall only makes a market for a 31 foot ladder. You didn't read a fucking thing I posted, did you @Hindsite?

75% of all illegals entering the USA come through border crossings. This is a FACT.

That is where the walls are needed. And if necessary make them 50 foot tall. HalleluYah.

[Godstud]

Are you drunk?

They cross LEGALLY, at these border crossings, and over-stay. A wall is NEVER going to prevent this.

50 foot wall? Grow up. Why not make it 100' tall. I am sure that won't cost more than the GDP of USA. You can cut SS and Medicare to all those old stupid retirees. That'll help pay for it.

[Hindsite]

:eh: Are you drunk?

They cross LEGALLY, at these border crossings, and over-stay. A wall is NEVER going to prevent this.

50 foot wall? Grow up. Why not make it 100' tall. I am sure that won't cost more than the GDP of USA. You can cut SS and Medicare to all those old stupid retirees. That'll help pay for it.

Illegal immigrants can not possibly cross legally. I am not stupid or drunk. I am the Near Genius.
HalleluYah

[Godstud]

@Hindsite You're not even closes to average intelligence, let alone genius.


Most immigrants who enter the country do so legally, federal data shows
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/won ... 404a64cbc5

But hey, don't let facts get in the way of your beliefs and ignorance.

[Hindsite]

@Hindsite You're not even closes to average intelligence, let alone genius.


Most immigrants who enter the country do so legally, federal data shows
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/won ... 404a64cbc5

But hey, don't let facts get in the way of your beliefs and ignorance.

I am talking about illegal immigrants from the southern border, not all immigrants.

[Godstud]

Learn to read an article before blathering on in ignorance.

In fiscal 2016, for instance, the Department of Homeland Security estimated 628,799 people who had previously entered the country legally overstayed their visa that year.

If you over-stay a visa, you are then considered illegal. Can you understand that?

[Hindsite]

Learn to read an article before blathering on in ignorance.

If you over-stay a visa, you are then considered illegal. Can you understand that?

Again, I am talking about illegal immigrants from the southern border, not all immigrants.