[QatzelOk]

1. I'm not American. This isn't my history at all.

Canada was part of the British Empire, and now it's in the American Empire. Your "history" of pompous twits claiming that their slick and trendy words made them immortal... goes back as far as the creation of the USA.

3. With respect sir, the sin is clearly in ignoring torture, or turning a blind eye to it to allow it to happen again and again.

This is one "sin." The wider meta-sin is one of feeling that it's one's duty to control others who haven't been as "blessed" by "God," and that the correct balance of human rights require rules made by your tribe and some kind of permanent income from ungrateful riffraff who you have "saved."

[Stormsmith]

Canada was part of the British Empire, and now it's in the American Empire. Your "history" of pompous twits claiming that their slick and trendy words made them immortal... goes back as far as the creation of the USA.

Nope. The Queen is still our queen.

This is one "sin." The wider meta-sin is one of feeling that it's one's duty to control others who haven't been as "blessed" by "God," and that the correct balance of human rights require rules made by your tribe and some kind of permanent income from ungrateful riffraff who you have "saved."

I have no idea what your second sentence means. But on sin, you act when it's necessary, eg the poor sod who was allegedly tortured and killed. On the other hand other sins should be protested and not supported, eg not going to war in Vietnam or Iraq

[Hindsite]

1. I'm not American. This isn't my history at all.

2. These are international treaties, like the Geneva Convention. America's in good and plentiful company

3. With respect sir, the sin is clearly in ignoring torture, or turning a blind eye to it to allow it to happen again and again.

1. That is why you don't understand a real American, a 20 year military veteran, like myself.

2. You should at least realize that America leads and rules international treaties if they are to endure.

3. One of your British leaders once said that America always does the right thing in the end.

[anarchist23]

Money can buy most everything.



[center-img]http://i66.tinypic.com/20arjuc.jpg[/center-img]



edit:

US penalties against Saudi Arabia over the alleged murder of Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi may never be implemented. But just in case, the oil-rich kingdom has threatened to hit back using several effective weapons.
Washington pledged ‘severe punishment’ if the Saudis ordered the killing of Khashoggi, a Saudi-born journalist, who disappeared nearly two weeks ago shortly after he entered the kingdom’s consulate in Istanbul. Turkey’s government claims they have evidence the journalist was tortured, killed and dismembered in the building.
RT talked to international oil economist Dr Mamdouh G. Salameh, who also serves as a consultant for the World Bank on oil and energy, and a technical expert with the United Nations Industrial Development Organization, to explore what action Riyadh may take in retaliation to possible penalties.
“The US should not underestimate Saudi Arabia’s ability to retaliate against any punishment in the future. Remember there’s a lesson in history dating back to 1973, which shows Saudi Arabia never hesitated to retaliate,” Dr Salameh said, referring to an oil embargo on the US, which inflicted heavy damage on the American economy.
Back then, a group of Middle East states refused oil sales to the United States, causing petrol shortages and skyrocketing prices for fuel.
The economist stressed that Donald Trump’s sanctions threat will remain only an empty threat.
“If he imposes any severe sanctions on Saudi Arabia, which now I doubt very much, the kingdom could easily cap its oil production significantly,” Dr Salameh said, highlighting that the step would inflict heavy casualties on the Republicans ahead of the mid-term elections.
Moreover, Saudi Arabia might refuse to compensate any possible loss by Iranian oil exports resulting from US oil sanctions, according to the analyst.
“Saudi Arabia is the pillar of the global oil markets, and consequently, any developments in Saudi or outside Saudi could affect oil prices,” he told RT.
Dr Salameh said that depolarization of the Saudi economy is going to happen anyway, whether there is punishment over the missing reporter or not.
“Saudi Arabia exports around one million barrels to China, and China is demanding that Saudi suppliers accept the petro-yuan experiment for oil exports,” he said. “Saudi Arabia wants to maintain its market share in China, which is currently the world’s biggest importer.
“If Saudi Arabia accepts payment in petro-yuan, it will irritate Americans, but there would be a compromise,” Dr Salameh said, adding that the kingdom could use euros for oil exports to the European Union, yuan for exports to China, and the dollar for supplies to the US.

https://www.rt.com/business/441584-saudi-arabia-us-khashoggi-retaliation/

[anarchist23]

"US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo told Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman he had 72 hours to complete his "investigation" into the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, or risk wrecking the kingdom's place on the world stage" - Sourcea tell @axios‬
1:31 PM - Oct 18, 2018
Pompeo had previously expressed confidence that the Saudi probe into Khashoggi’s disappearance would be “thorough, complete and transparent.” Pompeo told reporters on Wednesday that he discussed the investigation with the crown prince during their meeting, adding that the pair also emphasized their nations’ “many overlapping interests.”
The terse exchange conflicts with earlier reports, which depicted their meeting as an amiable consultation. "Defending the Saudis is becoming less tenable for Trump by the day, as a flood of reporting supports that Khashoggi was gruesomely murdered inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul," Axios concluded, adding that "despite the all-smiles photos, it seems like Pompeo had a fairly tense conversation with MBS."
The case has certainly been a headache for Pompeo. The US secretary of state told reporters on Wednesday that he didn’t want to get into specifics while discussing the circumstances surrounding the disappearance of Jamal Khashoggi, who was last seen entering the Saudi consulate in Istanbul, Turkey on October 2. The Saudis, coincidentally, are also not keen on broaching the subject.
“I don’t want to talk about any of the facts,” Pompeo said when asked if the Saudis told him if Khashoggi was dead or alive. “They didn’t want to either, in that they want to have the opportunity to complete this investigation in a thorough way. And I think that’s reasonable thing to do to give them that opportunity. And then we’ll all get to judge. We’ll all get to evaluate the work that they do.”
The Trump administration’s willingness to give the Saudis the benefit of the doubt is hardly surprising, former US diplomat Jim Jatras told RT. According to Jatras, shared animosity towards Iran will help ensure that the strong economic, political and military ties between Washington and Riyadh will remain intact – regardless of who is responsible for Khashoggi’s disappearance.

https://www.rt.com/usa/441618-pompeo-warned-saudis-probe/

[Rancid]

https://www.rt.com/usa/441618-pompeo-warned-saudis-probe/

It's more like 72 hours to sweep everything they can under the rug so taht we can move forward with business as usual.

[anarchist23]

https://www.rt.com/usa/441618-pompeo-wa ... dis-probe/

It's more like 72 hours to sweep everything they can under the rug so taht we can move forward with business as usual.

Probably. As I quoted.

https://www.rt.com/business/441584-saud ... taliation/

[skinster]

[One Degree]

It should be mentioned that $100 million is to be spent in Syria on reconstruction I believe. It was expected about this time anyway.

[skinster]

The US is going to rebuild the state it played a major part in destroying with aid from the KSA who were the other major players in the destruction of Syria. People believe anything they're told.

[jimjam]

Donald: "The Saudi leaders “assured me that they will conduct a complete, thorough investigation of all of the facts surrounding Mr. Khashoggi"
-----
Nothing says "thorough investigation" like large cleaning crews, and a fresh coat of paint!

Farmer to withhold condemnation of chicken killing pending thorough investigation by fox.

[Rancid]

The US is going to rebuild the state it played a major part in destroying with aid from the KSA who were the other major players in the destruction of Syria. People believe anything they're told.

you call this a tragedy, I call it BUSINESS!!

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Ter]

If the regime in Saudi Arabia can do this to one of their citizens in Europe, can we imagine what they do with their citizens at home ?

It is not just the killing that is scandalous, it is the way they did it.

I have no words.

[Rancid]

If the regime in Saudi Arabia can do this to one of their citizens in Europe, can we imagine what they do with their citizens at home ?

Agreed. If you notice, the royal family invest all of their money abroad. Precisely because they don't give a shit about the citizens at home.

[One Degree]

The US is going to rebuild the state it played a major part in destroying with aid from the KSA who were the other major players in the destruction of Syria. People believe anything they're told.

I never said whether I believed it. I said that information was included in the story the tweet was referencing.
I felt the tweet was misleading without the additional information.

[Red_Army]

It's hilarious how cucked conservatives are supporting Donald "Saudi-succing" Trump. This should be condemned by anyone who had any real intention of draining "the swamp". Saudi Arabia is a big part of that swamp.

[Rancid]

It's hilarious how cucked conservatives are supporting Donald "Saudi-succing" Trump. This should be condemned by anyone who had any real intention of draining "the swamp". Saudi Arabia is a big part of that swamp.

To be fair to Mr Trump. Pretty sure if a Democrat were president they wouldn't do/say much of anything either.

[Red_Army]

Being fair to Trump would be holding him accountable to his words. Democrats and Republicans having identical priorities on a multitude of issues further discredits Trump's claims to be a swamp drainer.

[Rancid]

Being fair to Trump would be holding him accountable to his words. Democrats and Republicans having identical priorities on a multitude of issues further discredits Trump's claims to be a swamp drainer.

Yes yes, in principle, yes.

Still.....

[blackjack21]

Democrats are covering for the KSA too, jimjam.

When are Hillary and Obama going to comment on this story?

I hardly see how it's more interesting than Clintonistas killing off Seth Rich after her deep state operatives at the FBI tipped her off that he was going to testify against her. Honestly, I find it puzzling that these type of murders happen in the US with the full participation of police forces and the media and we're just supposed to believe that it was a "botched mugging," but we're supposed to be "shocked! shocked!" that an absolute monarchy does this to its subjects when it allows nobody to vote and is only now considering allowing women to drive cars (bad idea). People also keep using the term "murder," but it isn't clear if it is an unlawful killing in Saudi terms.

Yeah, since the guy was a scumbag working for the left-wing Washington Post anyway.

Well, Khashoggi must have been doing some spy work for Bezos, et. al. for this to be a story. The left is so sloppy anymore, that nothing they do is a surprise.

Perhaps you're right, but I don't think this guy getting cut up into little pieces while he was still alive and right before his wedding is something that civilized peoples should simply overlook.

Call me old-fashioned.

I agree, but he's not an American or from a civilized country by Western standards. We have our own problems, like Antifa running wild in the streets, the Senate pushing presumption-of-guilt without a corroborated charge, etc. How the fuck do we run around telling people how to act when we just held a Kangaroo court in the Senate Judiciary Committee. Is that lost on anybody? It's not like we've got a lot of moral authority or anything.

So different cultures in the US must be respected, but it is okay for us to tell them how they must act in their own country or punish them? This equality and human rights stuff is real confusing. What happened to the right to autonomy and self government?

Yes, especially in view of tolerance and multiculturalism. Clearly, the Saudis have a different culture. Aren't we supposed to respect that, and feign a polite interest in their different ways?

So if the guy next door is beating the shit out of his kids, and possibly sexually abusing them, then you'd shrug and walk away because it is just his family? (intentional strawman)

Well, that's okay if they're illegal aliens, right?

You could stop and realize the same sense of superiority that created human rights was the same one we used to enslave Africans and kill Native Americans. Remember, we justified our actions due to our superiority. We now apply that to the whole world while pretending we are much superior to our heathen ancestors. Self righteousness is a human flaw we just refuse to recognize in ourselves.

The bizarre thing to me is that they want to do this after what they tried to do to Brett Kavanaugh, as though America had any right to go around preaching to others about human rights after it effectively violated the ban on Bill of Attainder against Kavanaugh, and presuming him guilty.

Nope. The Queen is still our queen.

Yes, but she's our pawn, and so is Canada.

It is not just the killing that is scandalous, it is the way they did it.

I have no words.

I have two: Seth Rich.