[anarchist23]

[center-img]http://i65.tinypic.com/6pm650.jpg[/center-img]

Meeting on Monday of Saudi prosecutor Saud al-Mojeb and his Turkish counterpart was relatively brief because of the lack of trust between Turkey and Saudi Arabia. lol

Turkey refuses to share all Khashoggi evidence with Saudis.
18:44 GMT Monday, 29 October 2018

Turkish investigators have refused to share with Saudi Arabia’s public prosecutor all the evidence they have compiled on Saudi complicity in the murder of Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi.
The Saudi prosecutor Saud al-Mojeb held talks with the Istanbul chief prosecutor on Monday morning in Istanbul, but the lack of trust between the two countries led to a relatively brief meeting of only 75 minutes.
Turkey had wanted confirmation on the whereabouts of Khashoggi’s remains, the identity of the local cooperator that the Saudis claim disposed of the body, and an update on the progress of a Saudi investigation of the 15 Saudi operatives who visited the Istanbul consulate at the time of the murder on 2 October.
Turkey’s state broadcaster TRT Haber said Saudi officials asked for the whole investigation folder, including evidence, statements and footage, to be given to them. TRT said the Saudi request was denied.
Saudi Arabia has admitted that a premeditated plan was made to kill Khashoggi, but say it was set up by a group of rogue operators without the knowledge of the Saudi crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman.
The Turkish president, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, had earlier welcomed the prosecutor’s arrival, while the foreign minister Mevlüt Çavuşoğlu had called on Riyadh to start co-operating so the whole world could know the truth about Khashoggi’s killing.
Western powers believe Erdoğan is still holding back evidence in a bid to back Prince Mohammed into a corner. Turkey has yet to release an audio tape which was allegedly a recording of the killing of Khashoggi, or evidence to show that the 15 Saudi operatives inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul made four phone calls to the crown prince’s office, as pro-government Turkish media have claimed, based on leaked information.
Khashoggi’s remains have not been found but cars from the Saudi consulate went to the consul general’s residence, with one vehicle continuing to woodland on the edge of Istanbul.
Pro-government Turkish media have published new photos of cars owned by the Saudi diplomatic mission being cleaned before police were allowed to search them.
Jamal Khashoggi is one of the Arab world’s most prominent journalists and commentators. He is an outspoken critic of Saudi Arabia who has dared to defy Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, the kingdom’s de facto ruler.
While living in Saudi Arabia, Khashoggi was told to stop writing or posting on Twitter, where he has more than 1.6 million followers. He moved to the US more than a year ago, where he continued to comment on his country both in print and on television. He wrote columns for the Washington Post and the Guardian.
His message struck a nuanced tone in the US, where he tried to acknowledge the reforms undertaken by Bin Salman while also highlighting the flaws.
Khashoggi previously had close links with the Saudi royal family, including having served as a media aide to Prince Turki al-Faisal, when the latter was director general of the Saudi intelligence agency.
He is also a former editor of the Saudi newspaper al-Watan and had worked with Prince Alwaleed bin Talal, a grandson of the first Saudi king who was detained last year as part of what the authorities said was an anti-corruption campaign.
A driver who drove some of the Saudi team to the airport after Khashoggi’s murder told A Haber television that the men had appeared relaxed and cheerful, smoking and drinking alcohol on the way home.
Khashoggi’s death has caused a major diplomatic crisis for Saudi Arabia and has cast an unwelcome spotlight on bin Salman, whom many believe must have been aware of an operation that allegedly involved several members of his personal guard and trusted senior officials.
Turkish prosecutors have prepared an extradition request for 18 suspects arrested by Riyadh as part of the Saudi investigation, including the 15 who were at the consulate, although the Saudi foreign minister insisted on Saturday that the men would be tried on Saudi soil.
Although Saudi Arabia has vowed it will conduct a thorough criminal investigation and deliver justice for Khashoggi, Turkish investigators have been faced with several delays from their Saudi counterparts. Riyadh and Ankara’s versions of what happened to the dissident writer are wildly different.
Turkey maintains there is evidence that shows Khashoggi was tortured and murdered during an appointment at the Saudi consulate by a hit team of 15 men sent from Riyadh, and his body dismembered with a bone saw.
The Saudi authorities initially denied they had anything to do with Khashoggi’s disappearance before eventually admitting he had died in a fistfight with officials who had embarked on an unauthorised extradition operation.
Police have conducted searches of woods and farmland outside Istanbul in the search for Khashoggi’s body.
Turkish investigators are still seeking permission to drain a well in the grounds of the Saudi consul general’s residence, where it is believed the journalist’s remains could have been disposed.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... SApp_Other

[skinster]

[Hindsite]

I hope that Trump has the balls to finally do something. If there was ever a time for his abrasive horribleness, this is it.

Trump always has the balls to do something. What he does is just different than what the left wants.
Praise the Lord.

[Zagadka]

So, what has Trump done on this?

[Hindsite]

So, what has Trump done on this?

"We'll see what happens." - Trump

[Zagadka]

And that'll be absolutely nothing.

[skinster]

^ Indeed. His son-in-law and Mohammed Bonesaw SalmanArabia are BFFs.

[anarchist23]

Jamal Khashoggi has accomplished much much more in his death than he could ever accomplish alive.
Saudia Arabian monarchy has now been exposed for what it is, a brutal dictatorship.

US urges Saudi-led coalition to stop airstrikes in ‘populated areas’ of Yemen
Published time: 31 Oct, 2018 00:35
The US Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, has urged the Saudi-led coalition to stop airstrikes in heavily populated Yemen, shortly after Defense Secretary Jim Mattis said a that long-lasting ceasefire is the only possible solution.
"Time is now for the cessation of hostilities, including missile and UAV strikes from Houthi-controlled areas into the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates. Subsequently, Coalition air strikes must cease in all populated areas," Pompeo said in a statement.
“It is time to end this conflict, replace conflict with compromise, and allow the Yemeni people to heal through peace and reconstruction,” declared the top diplomat of the country that supplies the coalition with the bulk of its weapons, as well as intelligence and reconnaissance assistance.
‘US & UK throw money at Yemen’s humanitarian disaster while profiting from war’
Just hours earlier – while noting that American aircraft continue to provide aerial refueling and intelligence to Saudi jets attacking Yemeni targets – the Pentagon chief also demanded that the warring parties work towards a long-lasting peace. “We want to see everybody around a peace table based on ceasefire, based on a pullback from the border, and then based on ceasing dropping bombs,” Mattis said at the Institute of Peace (USIP).
Some US lawmakers have long called on US leadership to halt support for the Saudi-led coalition, which has been bombing Yemen since March of 2015, causing thousands of civilian deaths. The calls to cut the sales of weapons to the Gulf Kingdom, however, really intensified only in wake of the murder of Jamal Khashoggi, the dissident Washington Post columnist killed inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul earlier this month.
While Donald Trump has repeatedly refused to cancel the record $110 billion arms sales contract he signed with the Saudis last year, some US lawmakers paradoxically considered winding down US support for the war in Yemen as a way to punish Riyadh for the Khashoggi murder. Mattis, however, emphasized Tuesday that he views the journalist's death and the conflict in Yemen as totally separate issues.
‘Not satisfied’ after all: Trump wants more answers, but won’t scrap Saudi deals over Khashoggi case
“We've got to move toward a peace effort here and we can't say we're going to be doing this sometime in the future. We need to be doing this in the next 30 days,” he said.
US senators urge Pentagon to fully disclose its role in Saudi-led war in Yemen —
Three US senators have called on the Pentagon to immediately reveal the extent of US military support to the Saudi-led Arab coalition that launched an attack on Hodeidah, a key port city and last...
Tuesday's statements by top US leadership signals a drastic shift from a mute White House approach to the three-year-old conflict, which has claimed over 10,000 lives and plunged Yemen into humanitarian disaster.
The Arab coalition has, since 2015, been waging a brutal military campaign in Yemen against Houthi rebels, in an attempt to restore exiled president Abd Rabbuh Mansour Hadi to power. Three years of Saudi-led bombardment and a blockade of Yemen has led to a catastrophic situation in the country, with 22 million people, or 80 percent of the population, in dire need of humanitarian aid. Throughout the entire course of the conflict, Riyadh and its allies have repeatedly been accused by NGOs of indiscriminate bombings of civilians and infrastructure in the country, using mainly Western-supplied weapons.

https://www.rt.com/usa/442691-pompeo-ma ... ceasefire/

[One Degree]

Just another example of politicians of both parties believing the people are too ignorant to deal with reality. We must be fed one narrative for votes, while they pursue another. The ease at which they manipulate us reinforces their feeling of superiority over us.
How can they respect a populace so stupid they can be turned against other countries with one news story?
Russia hysteria is the most prominent example.

[Potemkin]

Just another example of politicians of both parties believing the people are too ignorant to deal with reality. We must be fed one narrative for votes, while they pursue another. The ease at which they manipulate us reinforces their feeling of superiority over us.
How can they respect a populace so stupid they can be turned against other countries with one news story?
Russia hysteria is the most prominent example.

"Oceania was at war with Eurasia; therefore Oceania had always been at war with Eurasia."

[jimjam]

What a bunch of incompetent fuck ups the Saudis are. Fifteen men and a bone saw ………. Whitey could have done a better job by himself. America really has the best killers and thugs.

[Rancid]

What a bunch of incompetent fuck ups the Saudis are. Fifteen men and a bone saw ………. Whitey could have done a better job by himself. America really has the best killers and thugs.

USA! USA! USA!

[Rich]

"Oceania was at war with Eurasia; therefore Oceania had always been at war with Eurasia."

A work of fiction. Orwell's 1984 is a parody of the Soviet Union. I'm an arch anti-Communist and have called out Stalin's alliance with Hitler and his third period idiocy many times, but the Soviet Union and the Comintern never embraced the alliance with Hitler in the demented style of 1984.

1984 is a play on 1948, a year of another major turn of Soviet policy. However the swings of Soviet policy from the mid 1920's were all within norms present within Bolshevism from its start and can be seen in the debates over Duma participation in 1907/8.

[pugsville]

A work of fiction. Orwell's 1984 is a parody of the Soviet Union. I'm an arch anti-Communist and have called out Stalin's alliance with Hitler and his third period idiocy many times, but the Soviet Union and the Comintern never embraced the alliance with Hitler in the demented style of 1984.

In what way was it not demented? They were denouncing each other as absolute evil before, then had some crazed cooling off during , and then back to being absolute evil. How isn't that pretty similar to 1984?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E ... ntrop_Pact

[Potemkin]

In what way was it not demented? They were denouncing each other as absolute evil before, then had some crazed cooling off during , and then back to being absolute evil. How isn't that pretty similar to 1984?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E ... ntrop_Pact

Which is no different from the history of Europe for the preceding thousand years. As Lord Palmerston once said, "Nations do not have permanent allies or permanent enemies; only permanent interests." The reason Orwell and other erstwhile 'fellow travellers' were so exercised about the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was because they had once thought the Soviet government would somehow be different. But how could it be different? Its survival depended on heeding Lord Palmerston's truism. Was Stalin to blame for the naivety of Western upper-class idealists?

[Beren]

America really has the best killers and thugs.

Competence, jimjam, it's all about competence. How many did you kill in Vietnam? 2 million at least? Maybe you lost the war, but you won the butchering!

[pugsville]

" The reason Orwell and other erstwhile 'fellow travellers' were so exercised about the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was because they had once thought the Soviet government would somehow be different. But how could it be different? Its survival depended on heeding Lord Palmerston's truism. Was Stalin to blame for the naivety of Western upper-class idealists?

certainly wrong about Orwell, his opinion of Stalin and the Soviet Government was already extremely low by 1939. Orwell was not so excised by the the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, your stat5ement is just not historically correct with regards to Orwell. And regardless of upper class idealism it is strange behavior to desperate embrace in friendship someone you have been denouncing for decades as the very embodiment of evil.

[Igor Antunov]

There has been global MSM collusion to keep this at the forefront of the news cycle, spun in such a way as to sully US relations with Saudis to as usual discredit Trump. All in time for the midterms. Suddenly the entire western world gives two shits about some random journalist that got in too deep in an absolutist shit hole. Lol, fake reality.

[Potemkin]

certainly wrong about Orwell, his opinion of Stalin and the Soviet Government was already extremely low by 1939. Orwell was not so excised by the the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, your stat5ement is just not historically correct with regards to Orwell. And regardless of upper class idealism it is strange behavior to desperate embrace in friendship someone you have been denouncing for decades as the very embodiment of evil.

My point remains - the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was merely typical Realpolitik, the same sort of thing every European nation has been engaging in for the past thousand years or more. Stalin had to buy time to prepare for the onslaught (which he always knew was coming sooner or later), and in retrospect the Pact gave him the time he needed. It was a stunning act of Realpolitik, and it worked.

I agree that Orwell's disillusionment came earlier, during the Spanish Civil War, but he too was exercised about it. He refused to see that it made perfectly rational (albeit profoundly cynical) sense as a temporary measure of Realpolitik.

[Ter]

My point remains - the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was merely typical Realpolitik, the same sort of thing every European nation has been engaging in for the past thousand years or more. Stalin had to buy time to prepare for the onslaught (which he always knew was coming sooner or later), and in retrospect the Pact gave him the time he needed. It was a stunning act of Realpolitik, and it worked.

This is a good example of what the Germans call "Hineininterpretierung".
With hindsight you can say that Stalin foresaw the coming treachery of the Germans but then why were the Soviets so eager to occupy half of Poland and in an effort to keep it, assassinate thousands of Polish elite officers in Katyn ?