[Libertarian353]

So you're going to ignore the fact that trump is literally prostituting himself to the country who killed americans and mock the soldier who killed the mastermind of 9/11 who was from that said country?

I know you hate non-whites, but to spit on the american civil justice system and military. You people are a threat to our security!

[skinster]

Has anyone here watched the murder video? I've seen some comments about it here and there but I don't like watching snuff-y stuff so...

The Saudis hack apart a Saudi expatriate journalist in one of the most journalist-hostile countries in the world. Erdogan - the personification of anti-journalism - becomes the champion of a slain Saudi journalist. Not at all ironic or lacking credibility.

Erdogan being an expected opportunist re: this story is what bothers you about it?

Sorry, I don't know why that's amusing but it is.

[Hindsite]

Our mass media is a car and oil salesman, and is entirely owned by the 1%. It's as leftwing as Milton Friedman crossed with Joe McArthy.

If Trump doesn't always get good coverage, it's because he's not a dictator yet. He still needs buy-in from other oligarchs to get his lies out there.

If you believe the mass media everything Trump says is a lie.
I don't understand how any sane person could believe that. It is just too ridiculous.
I always assume Trump is telling the truth, unless proven otherwise.
HalleluYah

[anarchist23]

The brutal murder of Jamal Khashoggi has exposed the violence of the Saudi Arabian regime and regarding this, his death has accomplished much much more than if he were alive. This fact must be some comfort to his sons and his wife to be. Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salmans name will be forever tainted.

Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman has been greeted by an outpouring of public anger on his arrival in Tunisia, one of the stops on his first trip abroad since the killing of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, which critics say was designed to whitewash his image before the G20 summit later this week.
After embraces and smiles from allies in the UAE, Bahrain and Egypt this week, the powerful crown prince did not receive such a warm welcome in Tunis: at least 200 people gathered in the city centre on Monday night the day before scheduled talks with the Tunisian president, Beji Caid Essebsi.
A huge banner depicting the prince carrying a chainsaw – – a reference to his alleged involvement in Khashoggi’s gruesome murder and reported dismemberment at the Saudi consulate in Istanbul – was unfurled over the Tunisian journalists’ union building.
On Tuesday, hundreds more demonstrators carried placards reading “No to polluting revolutionary Tunisia” and “The murderer is not welcome”, in marches organised by youth and women’s rights groups.
After several weeks of shifting explanations, Riyadh eventually admitted the dissident writer was killed at the hands of a hit team sent from the kingdom, but the Saudis maintain that Prince Mohammed had no knowledge of the rogue operation.
The Tunis protests were accompanied by statements from the Tunisian journalists’ union and a dozen non-governmental organisations decrying Prince Mohammed’s visit as an “attack on the principles” of the Arab spring that brought democracy and freedom of expression to Tunisia.
“Arab citizens are often hostages to our governments,” said Suad Abu-Dayyeh, a consultant for the campaign group Equality Now. “Prince Salman is locking up and torturing women activists in Saudi Arabia. I’m delighted Tunisians are standing up to him.”
Tunisian officials stressed the “historical and fraternal” relations between Tunis and Riyadh, adding that the region would suffer if Saudi Arabia, a regional power, was destabilised by Prince Mohammed’s removal.
Tunisia is a longstanding recipient of Saudi development and aid funds. Many in the country are still angry, however, that Saudi Arabia offered refuge to the corrupt former president Zine El Abidine Ben Ali after he was overthrown in 2011, and has since refused to extradite him.
After Tunisia, Prince Mohammed is due to travel to the G20 summit in Argentina on Friday, where many world leaders are dreading the prospect of public meetings with the embattled heir to the throne.
While the US president, Donald Trump, has reiterated support for his Saudi ally, going as far as contradicting the CIA’s reported assessment that the crown prince ordered Khashoggi’s death, the possibility of shaking hands and posing for photos with the Saudi de facto leader poses a headache for the British prime minister, Theresa May, and the French president, Emmanuel Macron.
Both the UK and France have condemned Saudi Arabia’s conduct over Khashoggi’s murder and used it to pressure the Saudi-UAE coalition fighting in Yemen into renewed peace talks, but the criticism has stopped short of ending arms sales to the Gulf.
On Monday, the advocacy group Human Rights Watch took the largely symbolic step of writing to a federal prosecutor in Argentina demanding the crown prince’s arrest on his arrival in Buenos Aires for war crimes and torture.

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... a-protests

[QatzelOk]

The brutal murder of Jamal Khashoggi has exposed the violence of the Saudi Arabian regime...

Really?

The mass murder of Yemen did nothing to smear the image of this fake, Western-created regime?

I guess the "problem" with the murder of Jamal Khashoggi is that the West didn't rake in billions of dollars selling tanks and other weapons that were used to kill him.

Next time, Medieval King, use an expensive drone to kill "the bad guys" and Western mass media will continue to protect you from the prying eyes of Western sheeple.

[anarchist23]

Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman was advised not to participate in a press conference in Tunisia and now Trump will not formally meet the Saudi crown prince at the G20 Conference in Argentina. And Human Rights Watch is on the crown princes case as well.

The Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman who visited Tunisia amid popular protests, had to leave for Argentina on Wednesday morning, without participating in a press conference.
Tuesday and met with Tunisian President Beji Caid Essebsi in Tunis, but the Prince had to leave the country as soon as possible without participating in a press conference amid on-going protests against him.
Mohammed bin Salman who is under spotlight because of his suspected role in the murder of Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi, was advised to avoid media exposure, Iran Press reported.
 The Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman visited Tunisia as demonstrators gathered in the capital Tunis shouted "Go away assassin".
Tunisian demonstrators held placards with slogans such as "The people want Bin Salman to be judged", "No to the killer of Yemeni children" and "You're not welcome".
Mohammed bin Salman left Tunisia for Buenos Aires to take part in the upcoming G20 summit.
The Saudi Crown Prince is also expected to face protests and criticisms in Argentina.
Argentinian prosecutors are considering charging Mohammed bin Salman, with war crimes and torture.
The move comes after the advocacy group Human Rights Watch wrote to a federal prosecutor arguing that the Argentinian courts should invoke a universal jurisdiction statute in Argentinian law, to seek prosecution of the Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman for mass civilian casualties caused by the Saudi-led coalition’s campaign in Yemen, and for the torture of Saudi citizens, including the Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi, who was killed in the Saudi consulate in Istanbul on 2 October.
Related News:
Mohammed bin Salman may be charged with war crimes at G20 summit in Argentina
It is worth noting that the murder of dissident Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi has led to increased scrutiny of Saudi Arabia's role in the disastrous three-and-a-half year military aggression against Yemen.
Since March 2015, the Saudi-led coalition has carried out scores of indiscriminate and disproportionate airstrikes on civilians and civilian objects in Yemen, hitting homes, schools, hospitals, markets, and mosques,” a HRW statement said.
“Many of these attacks – if carried out with criminal intent – indicate possible war crimes. The coalition has also imposed and maintained a naval and air blockade on Yemen that has severely restricted the flow of food, fuel, and medicine to civilians. Millions of civilians face hunger and disease,” HRW noted.
A source from President of Argentina Mauricio Macri’s office on Monday declined to comment on the request for Mohammed bin Salman’s arrest. 
Meanwhile, the POLITICO reported that US President Donald Trump will not formally meet with Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman at an upcoming G20 summit in Argentina.
US President Donald Trump said recently that Washington stands with Riyadh in the wake of the slaying of Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi.

http://iranpress.com/africa-i130399

[skinster]

[One Degree]

Rally the masses. We have a new witch to burn. Lol

[skinster]

Motion to stop One Degree from responding to everything

[One Degree]

[quote="skinster"][/quote]

Don’t panic. You will have years to post after I am dead. Just be patient.

[anarchist23]

Received this from Human Rights Watch today.


[center-img]https://i.imgur.com/OSbobMm.jpg[/center-img]

(Buenos Aires) – The Argentine judiciary on November 28, 2018, took steps toward a formal investigation of Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman’s possible responsibility for war crimes in Yemen and alleged torture of Saudi citizens, Human Rights Watch said today. Mohammed bin Salman arrived in Buenos Aires for the G20 Summit on November 28.

Ramiro González, the federal prosecutor, formally asked Judge Ariel Lijo, an investigating federal judge assigned through a lottery, to examine the Human Rights Watch November 26 submission to request information from the Saudi and Yemeni governments about whether they are investigating the allegations. He also asked for the Foreign Ministry to provide information about the crown prince’s diplomatic status.

Following the prosecutor’s decision, Judge Lijo sent information requests to the Turkish and Yemeni governments and the International Criminal Court (ICC) inquiring about whether they are investigating the allegations. He also sent a request to the Argentine Foreign Ministry on the question of the crown prince's immunity and diplomatic status. Neither Saudi Arabia or Yemen are members of the ICC.

“The Argentine judiciary has sent a clear message that even powerful officials like Mohammed bin Salman are not above the law and will be scrutinized if implicated in grave international crimes,” said Kenneth Roth, executive director of Human Rights Watch. “A cloud of suspicion will loom over the crown prince as he tries to rebuild his shattered reputation at the G20, and world leaders would do well to think twice before posing for pictures next to someone who may come under investigation for war crimes and torture.”

The Human Rights Watch submission described violations of international humanitarian law during the armed conflict in Yemen, for which Mohammed bin Salman may face criminal liability as Saudi Arabia’s defense minister. The submission also highlighted his possible complicity in alleged torture and other ill-treatment of Saudi citizens, including the murder and alleged torture of the journalist Jamal Khashoggi.

The prosecutor’s written decision outlines states’ obligations to investigate alleged war crimes and torture and constitutes a ringing endorsement of the principle of universal jurisdiction, Human Rights Watch said. Under this principle, judicial authorities in the country are empowered to investigate and prosecute international crimes no matter where they were committed, and regardless of the nationality of the suspects or their victims.

Universal jurisdiction cases are an increasingly important part of international efforts to hold those responsible for atrocities accountable, provide justice to victims who have nowhere else to turn, deter future crimes, and help ensure that countries do not become safe havens for human rights abusers.
The inquiry to Argentina’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs about the crown prince’s diplomatic status in Argentina is intended to help determine if Argentina’s Supreme Court should directly examine the case. The Argentine Constitution provides that, in certain kinds of cases involving foreign officials, the Supreme Court has exclusive jurisdiction.

If the judiciary decides to open a formal investigation, the investigating federal judge would then gather further evidence to establish Mohammed bin Salman’s role in international crimes

The Argentine Foreign Ministry has stated that Mohammed bin Salman has immunity to attend the G20 Summit because he is an official diplomatic envoy under the 1969 Convention on Special Missions, to which Argentina is a party, according to media reports. Under the convention, “[t]he receiving State may, at any time and without having to explain its decision, notify the sending State that any representative of the sending State in the special mission … is persona non grata.” The sending state would need to either “recall the person concerned or terminate his functions with the mission,” in which case he would lose his immunity.

Existing immunities should not stop the Argentine judiciary from investigating the case, Human Rights Watch said. If an inquiry into the allegations of war crimes or torture is opened, the status of Mohammed bin Salman’s immunity could potentially be challenged as it would raise important legal questions regarding the extent of immunity for grave international crimes.

“Argentine judicial authorities should move quickly, within the boundaries of Argentine and international law, and demonstrate that they are committed to accountability for the most serious crimes,” Roth said.

HRW

[Rich]

This is why any attempt to impose "freedom" and "democracy" on the Middle East by force of arms is either idiotic or dishonest, and is doomed to failure in either case. There's no guarantee the people are going to vote the way you want them to vote. And clearly, if the people don't vote the way we want them to, then the elections are 'invalid' and we must restore 'order' by invading them. Lol.

It reminds me of Brecht's cynical quip after a workers' uprising was violently suppressed in East Germany in 1956: "The government has lost confidence in the people, and must therefore elect a new one!"

Leaving Saddam in power was idiotic.

How much longer should we have given Saddam to create and independent middle class?
How much longer should we have given Saddam to reverse and heal the growing sectarian divide in Iraq.
Should we have waited for Saddam to die, in the hope that Uday would develop and heal Iraq?

I'm the left's nightmare, a Centrist with memory.

You see I remember the spring of 2003 and the lefties weren't worried that Iraq would be a failure, they were worried that the Americans would be welcomed as liberators as they were in Grenada, Panama, Bosnia and Kosovo. They were worried that Iraqis would see the Americans as freedom fighters, like the Poles, Czechs, Hungarians, Romanians, Lithuanians, Latvians and Estonians. I said don't worry no one will be thanking America for invading Iraq. The American Jew Madeline Albright had said the sacrifice of half a million Iraq children was worth it. That cost fell mostly on Iraq's Shia, I was pretty confident that there wouldn't be much gratitude on display. I said that America would invade hand power to the Iranian allied Shia and leave.

I was right and nearly everyone else was wrong.

Of course it would be cretinous to expect instant Liberal democracy, but it was obvious to me that majority Shia ruled Iraq would allow the population to evolve towards secularism under majority rule as the Iranian populace has done under the post 79 Shia government. Similarly with Kurdish autonomy.

[skinster]

^ Err yeah, the Iraq war was a good idea.

[Istanbuller]

I think we will have something on table as Democrats get majority in the house of representatives in January 2019. Bipartisan solution is not off the table.

Saudi Arabia isn't really a country. It is a place which is being governed by a tribe. It should be held accountable for what it has done. This is not hard to do.

[anarchist23]

US lawmakers have begun moving to cut weapons sales to Saudi Arabia both over the Khashoggi affair and the ongoing war in Yemen, considered one of the world’s worst humanitarian disasters.

A trove of text messages sent by slain Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi to another dissident activist abroad suggest that he was far more deeply opposed to the de facto reign of Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman than previously known, and that he was actively funding a project to invigorate his opponents, according to CNN.
The CNN report also suggests that the communications between Khashoggi and the Montreal-based activist, Omar Abdulaziz, may have been accessed by Saudi security officials, and contributed to the plot that led his death.
"The more victims he eats, the more he wants," Khashoggi reportedly wrote in one text message after the arrest of Saudi activists in May. "I will not be surprised if the oppression will reach even those who are cheering him on."
At one point in the texts, Khashoggi likens the Crown Prince and his entourage to the the family of Muammar Gaddafi, the burial late leader of Libya who ran the country as his personal fiefdom for decades.
More than two months after Khashoggi’s death at the hands of Saudi hitmen dispatched from Riyadh to Istanbul to strangle him, dismember his body, and somehow get rid of his remains during a consular visit, controversy continues to surround Prince Mohammed, who is believed by US spies and others to have ordered the hit.
Several US newspapers, citing unnamed officials in Washington, reported that American spies had detected 11 text messages between Prince Salman and his deputy Saud al-Qahtani, the ranking official allegedly behind the operation, in the hours during and after Khashoggi’s kidnapping and murder. US lawmakers have begun moving to cut weapons sales to Saudi Arabia both over the Khashoggi affair and the ongoing war in Yemen, considered one of the world’s worst humanitarian disasters.
En route from a G20 summit in Buenos Aires where he was shunned or scolded by Western leaders but embraced by Russian president Vladimir Putin, Prince Mohammed on Monday visited Mauritania and Algeria en route home from Latin America. In Algiers, his talks with Adelaziz Bouteflika were cancelled, over the ailing president's suffering from flu, according to the presidential office. Despite written statements against his visit by intellectuals and politicians, no protests greeted him amid a ban on public gatherings in the capital.
Local media reports suggest Prince Mohammed may cancel a planned visit to Jordan amid rising and vocal opposition in the kingdom, which allows limited press and civil freedoms. "The timing of the visit is not appropriate,” Basil Okoor, the editor in chief of a local news website, was quoted as saying.
The CNN report, which quickly went viral on Arabic social media, resurrected a matter Saudi authorities have been hoping sweep away. It showed that Khashoggi regarded the crown prince as a “beast,” and a menace, lacking the respectful tone of his Washington Post columns and television appearances. "May God rid us and this nation of this predicament," he wrote in June.
The CNN report alleged that Khashoggi was planning to use tens of thousands of dollars of his own money and raise funds to fund a previously reported project to create an army of “bees” on social media to take on the pro-Prince Mohammed troll army.
The project involved dispatching SIM cards from abroad to dissidents so they could get online without being monitored by Saudi Arabia’s extensive surveillance system.
But the two men panicked when they received word that the Saudi regime knew about the project. “God help us,” Khashoggi wrote in August.
Hillary Clinton says Trump is ‘part of the coverup’ in Khashoggi killing during speaking tour
Later, Canadian technicians reportedly discovered that Khashoggi’s phone had been hacked, very likely by the Saudi government using tools it bought from an Israeli company called NSO.
Amnesty International last week said it is considering legal action against NSO for allegedly spying on its staff, after Israeli media reported the same company had offered Saudi Arabia surveillance software for hacking mobile phones belonging to activists connected to Khashoggi, including Mr Abdulaziz.
Mr Abdulaziz's lawyers have now filed a lawsuit in Tel Aviv, alleging NSO broke international law by selling its software to regimes which disregard human rights.
To many supporters of the Saudi regime, the content of Khashoggi’s texts will be regarded as treacherous, and a number of social media accounts used his private words to justify his treatment at the hands of his killers.
“The Saudis should thank CNN for the report that exposed the real Jamal to the public,” wrote one pro-Saudi user with 15,000 followers. Adding that Khashoggi “deserved this brutal killing.”
The Saudis have continued to deny the Crown Prince's involvement and maintain that the killing was as a result of a rogue operation.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... 6.html?amp

[skinster]

[redcarpet]

Even if arms sales are cut to Saudi Arabia, well, it's very cut-throat in the competition in the arms race; another state will just get the weapons and equipment anyway. Maybe those beloved democracies like China, Turkey or the Congo (yes the civil war is getting worse with no end in sight still!)

[skinster]

[skinster]

[blackjack21]

US lawmakers have begun moving to cut weapons sales to Saudi Arabia both over the Khashoggi affair and the ongoing war in Yemen, considered one of the world’s worst humanitarian disasters.

That would just drive them to other partners, most likely Russia. However, Britain and France will certainly jump in as well if they can.