[noemon]

[Red_Army]

It would be cool if our "non-intervention" in this area coincided with a cessation of aid to Israel, Turkey, and Saudi Arabia who are happy or indifferent with all these people our state department want to pretend to care about being genocided. I wish John McCain was alive to pretend to care about this and also arm Turkey some more.

[Rich]

I wish John McCain was alive to pretend to care about this and also arm Turkey some more.

It would be cool if our "non-intervention" in this area coincided with a cessation of aid to Israel, Turkey, and Saudi Arabia who are happy or indifferent with all these people our state department want to pretend to care about being genocided.

I agree with all this except ceasing aid to Israel. If I might be permitted to recycle an old (British) Socialist Workers Party slogan:

"Support Israel with no illusions!"

That's no illusions that they'll show any gratitude for our support.

[SpecialOlympian]

It would be cool if our "non-intervention" in this area coincided with a cessation of aid to Israel, Turkey, and Saudi Arabia who are happy or indifferent with all these people our state department want to pretend to care about being genocided. I wish John McCain was alive to pretend to care about this and also arm Turkey some more.

Are you some kind of idiot? President Deals figured out how to do military stuff, but Saudi Arabia pays for it. Hell, maybe we can make some money off of this.

[Patrickov]

The conflict goes back to the late period of the Ottoman empire.
Before the Turks and Kurds fought each other, they fought beside each other.
And most of the genocides the Ottoman empire had done in their fall period were done by Kurdish forces under the empire's banners.

Once the empire was gone, and Turkish nationalism rose up, they collided with each other.
Add the fact that the French and the British had mandates that cut through Kurdish territories, they ended up being divided into many states and ruled over by people whom they had committed massacres against under the Ottoman banner.

In short, the reason why the Turks and the Kurds hate each other is because of Turkish nationalism rising to claim the entire region as Turkish and establishing its republic over Turkish and Kurdish lands alike.

The reason why Kurds and Iranians hate each other is that the Kurds were key part of the Ottoman forces, whom the Iranian empire fought many wars against and as such the Kurds in Iranian lands were and are seen as infiltrators.

The reason why Arabs and other groups hate the Kurds is that the Kurds helped in genocides against them and the conflict simply never died out.


To quote my grandfather in how he referred to the Kurds, they're "Ottoman dogs". Also adding that he constantly pointed out how the Kurds will gladly sell their neighbors to the highest bidder in reference to them selling out to the highest paying empire, gladly killing and destroying on behalf of other empires and power for a pay. In this case, the US, though probably Russia or China soon.

So, to sum it up, like the Poles circa 230 years ago, the Kurds had their "land" partitioned by three hostile neighbours. Worse than the Poles, they have no British or French to make friends with.

Seriously you said Kurds are going to sell out something, but now that they have no homeland I fail to see what they really can sell, and I don't see the US, Russia or China have interest in these people. (For China's case, they are on the course of being surrounded and partitioned (?) themselves anyways)

[Beren]

I haven't heard of her before, but it's amazing she got killed so soon.

[Potemkin]

https://twitter.com/K24English/status/1182977963618426881?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1182977963618426881&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Findex.hu%2Fkulfold%2F2019%2F10%2F13%2Fszirai_kurd_gyilkossag_usa%2F
I haven't heard of her before, but it's amazing she got killed so soon.

The Turks probably long ago drew up a list of Kurdish political leaders to whack if and when they could get their hands on them. The hit teams were probably geared up and ready to go when Trump fired the starting pistol....

[Beren]

The Turks probably long ago drew up a list of Kurdish political leaders to whack if and when they could get their hands on them. The hit teams were probably geared up and ready to go when Trump fired the starting pistol....

Sure, but wasn't she aware of that?

[Potemkin]

Sure, but wasn't she aware of that? :?:

Nobody ever believes they can get whacked until it happens to them, Beren. And by then it's too late. She got complacent, is my guess.

[Beren]

Nobody ever believes they can get whacked until it happens to them, Beren. And by then it's too late. She got complacent, is my guess.

Well, it's also a mystery to me how Khashoggi could walk in that lethal trap he's never come out of alive or even in one piece.

[Potemkin]

Well, it's also a mystery to me how Khashoggi could walk in that lethal trap he's never come out of alive or even in one piece.

Deep down, most people are convinced they are immortal and invulnerable, Beren. They are full of misplaced self-confidence, until the bone saw comes out....

[Beren]

Deep down, most people are convinced they are immortal and invulnerable, Beren. They are full of misplaced self-confidence, until the bone saw comes out....

I understand that if someone doesn't know what he's doing, but if you know what you're doing and who and how your enemies are, you should be careful.

[Potemkin]

I understand that if someone doesn't know what he's doing, but if you know what you're doing and who and how your enemies are, you should be careful.

Indeed. But most people don't believe it will ever happen to them, until it does. And then it's too late. Even Mafia bosses have been known to make that mistake.

[Beren]

Indeed. But most people don't believe it will ever happen to them, until it does. And then it's too late. Even Mafia bosses have been known to make that mistake.

Khashoggi asked MBS's kid brother, who assured him it's safe for him to enter the consulate in Turkey, and he believed him.

[Atlantis]

At this stage, Turkey is probably the most hated country in the world. @Istanbuller, how does it feel to be the pariah of the world?

Except for Pakistan there is no country that actually supports the Turkish invasion. Pakistan and Turkey are the centers of Sunni terror.



Up to now, hundreds have been killed, more than 130,000 Kurds have fled the Turkish forces and about 800 ISIS affiliates have escaped their camps. And this is only the beginning.

[foxdemon]

You gotta hand it to the Turks. They can now take credit for the amazing achievement of getting most of the world on the same side.

[Atlantis]

Initial news suggests that there has been a deal between local Kurdish leaders and Damascus for Syrian forces to move into Kurdish-held areas to defend them against the Turkish invasion.

If it is true, it could be a game-changer. Putin and Iran would have achieved their objective of expelling US troops from the region and Assad can set about retaking the rest of the country. Erdogan may be crazy, but I don't think he would risk a direct confrontation with Assad, who would probably get air-cover from the Russians.

Syrian Kurdish leader says deal reached with Damascus and Moscow

ERBIL (Kurdistan 24) - Kobani Military Council leader Ismat Sheikh Hassan on Sunday evening told Kurdistan 24 that his group had reached an agreement with the Russian and Syrian governments after being convinced that Syria's Kurds had been abandoned by US President Donald Trump.
...
A local source told Kurdistan 24 that the deal will be restricted to areas near the border, but not for the other territory further south.

So far, there have been no official statements from Russian authorities, but Syrian state media, the Syrian Arabic News Agency (SANA), wrote in a breaking news bulletin, “Syrian Arab Army units move north to confront Turkish aggression on Syrian territory.”

Shortly after the Kobani Military Council statement, pro-Syrian government Al Mayadeen outlet and UK-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights (SOHR) both reported that the Syrian army would enter Manbij and Kobani within the next 48 hours. also reported the same story.

Pro-state Syrian television station Alikhbariya also confirmed the Syrian army had started moving northward towards areas east of the Euphrates, announcing, “The Syrian Arab Army started a movement towards the north of Syria to face the Turkish aggression.”

Kurdish officials in the past have stated that if they were forced to choose between cooperating with either the Syrian government or Turkey, they would rather deal with Damascus to prevent Kurdish populations from being persecuted and displaced, as happened when Turkey occupied the city of Afrin in March 2018.
...
It is not yet clear if there will be similar deals for other areas along the sprawling border with Turkey in Hasakah province or in Arab-majority cities like Manbij, Raqqa, and the countryside of Deir al-Zor.

Analyst Ranj Alaaldin, a fellow at the Brookings Doha Center, tweeted that, according to reports, the Syrian regime troops were already moving north to Kobani.

“In 2016, Assad vowed to retake every inch of Syria from his foes. The US isn’t withdrawing. It is surrendering to the regime and its backers, Russia and Iran.”

Other reports suggest that Syrian Army Soldiers are already in Manbij, that they are accompanied by Russians and that local forces have joined them:

https://gyazo.com/b2d86575224bb77b188e7eda2f9e9be4

[Beren]

Putin's playing this masterfully. Never accept an ice cream from that man!

[Potemkin]

What's the betting that all of these developments have taken Trump completely by surprise? Lol.

[Atlantis]

Putin's playing this masterfully. Never accept an ice cream from that man!

Trump probably made a deal with Putin, dirt on Biden in exchange for the ME.