[Suntzu]

You have it the wrong way round. It is the US that is an Israeli client state.

They were afraid the Liberty would tip their hand. They figured they could sink her quickly with all hands and it would be just another mysterious ship disappearance.

[ArtAllm]

You have it the wrong way round. It is the US that is an Israeli client state.

Yep, and Trump's behaviour after the election is the best prove for your thesis.
As Putin pointed out in his interviews, it does not matter who is the POTUS, the foreign policy of the USA does not change. So it does not make any sense to influence the American elections.

If Russians really wanted to influence the foreign policy of the USA, they would have created a "Russia Lobby", subverted American financial system, the MSM and created a lot of pro-Russian advocacy organisations.

If you have achieved that, any American president will do what you tell him to do.

Trump has to be hostile to Russia, a state that never killed any Americans, and kiss the ass of the Israel Lobby. Only this way he can stay in power and prove that he is not a "puppet of Russians".

[MB.]

Not sure about that. The pilot who dropped the bomb, Yftah Spector, said it was mistake. There were many attacks of this sort during the war. Israel was just becoming American client, why would they deliberately attack the ship?

Well, I certainly can see this argument as well. Israel did end up paying millions of dollars in damages to the families of those killed. However, the intensity of the attack is what leads me to question the "honest mistake" theory: after all, Liberty was bombed, strafed and then torpedoed, by at least two aircraft and several MTBs. Would the attack still have taken place had the Liberty been escorted by an American destroyer? I don't know the answer to this.

it does not matter who is the POTUS, the foreign policy of the USA does not change. So it does not make any sense to influence the American elections.

Putin was explicitly taking about US foreign policy towards Russia, US foreign policy clearly does change depending on who the President is, although I certainly can agree that foreign policy does not hold really any interest for the average American voter, as evidenced by the fact that foreign policy was only debated for about 15 minutes over the course of all three recent presidential election debates. Anyway, debate about Russian hacking is clearly off topic here.

[skinster]

Putin was explicitly taking about US foreign policy towards Russia

IIRC, he was talking about US foreign policy in general being what it would be regardless of which of the two parties win.

[Ter]

The truth is that Israel will act unilaterally whenever it judges its national security to be at risk. They were planning to drop nukes on the Arabic capitals if things got too heavy in the 1967 war

That sounds plausible.
Wouldn't you agree that in case a country's existence is threatened, it can use everything at its disposal, including atomic bombs, to defend itself?

[Pants-of-dog]

That sounds plausible.
Wouldn't you agree that in case a country's existence is threatened, it can use everything at its disposal, including atomic bombs, to defend itself?

Is this what you believe?

[Suntzu]

Yeah, atomic bombs are different than regular old bomb bombs. You are deader and glow a bit. When the U.S. did it, it was different and was for the children.

[Ter]

Is this what you believe?

Are you Jewish?

[noir]

@Suntzu , do you believe Israel did it deliberately?

Must admit before the internet never heard about the issue. It probably came from Stormfront and now every one is debating about USS Liberty. Giving Israel was just switching from French to US protection it simply doesn't make sense.

[MB.]

There really is no reason to doubt the official story. As I mentioned in my earlier post, Israel did pay cash to the families of those who were killed. It seems highly unlikely that four fighters and three MTBs would have carried out this attack had Liberty been supported by its escort destroyer. So it seems unlikely those assets were dispatched specifically to target the CIA spy ship.

And yes, the vast majority of the criticism here comes from American libertarians who often tend to also be anti-semetic since they believe Zionists control the world through cartel banking and the federal reserve, etc. For those people, Liberty is a clear case of Israeli duplicity and subterfuge, professing friendship with America but stabbing her in the back- if you will- behind the scenes.

Since there's really no evidence showing up here, I'll just direct you all to the last time we had this debate.

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=130885

[noir]

It's the internet revolution that brought to light their discourse. They manage to put it into the mainstream debate.

[Suntzu]

True, the Liberty incident was covered up, but to believe this was an accidental attack one has to believe the Israelis are incompetent and the Liberty crew is lying. Israel deliberately tried to sing the Liberty to keep its imminent surprise attack on Egypt secret.

[noir]

Hard to argue with antisemitic conspiracy theories. Israel was waiting for a green light from Johnson administration to launch the attack. How can they hide anything from them? Not to mention the soft spot James Jesus Angleton, the chief of CIA, had for Israel ever since he met the first pre Israel "Mossadnicks" in Italy after war.

[Pants-of-dog]

Are you Jewish?

I have no idea why you decided to become anti-Semitic.

Anyway, do you believe that a country can defend itself by any means necessary when being attacked by a foreign power?

[Suntzu]

I generally support Israel. In this case there is no doubt in my mind that this attack was deliberate. I believe that if the survival of the U.S. was at stake we would kill Israelis. Israel is our ally and a good one. They are not necessarily our friend.

[noir]

Simply not logical. It came from Stormfront.

[Suntzu]

No it didn't. http://www.gtr5.com/

[noir]

The question is only if it was a deliberate attack.

[Suntzu]

How can you read first hand accounts and believe anything else?

[noir]

It doesn't make sense. After 20 years of cool relations with Washington who was tied till then to Oil Lobby, it simply not logical that they will decide to attack Americans deliberately now when the Americans were finally closer to their side. Close relations with America was Ben Gurion (Israel's first PM) main obsession.