[Oxymoron]

Who the fuck is a ruler..and tells his children that during his reign he was instead a slave?

The one who was corrupt and was overthrown easily, and forced out. So by making the Egyptians look bad they can make this new Monothiestic religion, with them being the oppressed chosen people who will only find peace and success if they follow the lead of the God ordained Prophets. Being the victim is great for forging a new identity, rather then living through past glory.

What ideology?

If you didnt have a specific stance on this you wouldnt be so hostile right now.

And which scholar?, in the link you posted, the only citation and the only proponent of this theory is that charlatan Jacobovici, who is ofc not a scholar, but a UFO conspiracy theorist of the history channel

Many scholars, and just because you think some one is a charlatan doesnt make him one.

[noemon]

The one who was corrupt and was overthrown easily, and forced out. So by making the Egyptians look bad they can make this new Monothiestic religion, with them being the oppressed chosen people who will only find peace and success if they follow the lead of the God ordained Prophets. Being the victim is great for forging a new identity, rather then living through past glory.

Conspiracy theory 101. There is no such King who would deny being a King. And even if we accept this as a possible scenario, scholarship requires much more than that, it requires linguistics, archeology and so on and forth. Which all of them are lacking.

If you didnt have a specific stance on this you wouldnt be so hostile right now

All my posts have a certain layman hostility, lately, because am tired of hearing bullshit, in todays news and europe and so on. Dont be so prissy and dont feel special, you are not the first nor the last. Browse my latest posts.

You(the forum's Jews) are all very ignorant in ethnology and academia in general, the academic arguments of the Jews being an ethnos aside from a religion have been posted by myself and Anothroskon, so no luck of you trying to stick on me the claim that I deny you something of Jewish mythology just to deny you your claims to an "ethnos". Get over yourself in other words, and if you want to address the claims of others start reading proper arguments, not conspiracy theories of charalatans.

Many scholars, and just because you think some one is a charlatan doesnt make him one.

Who are they, if they are many you sure have names, speak them, and the fact that Jacobivici is a charlatan is de-facto and even Lightman(a Jewish mod) calls him such, so?

[Oxymoron]

Conspiracy theory 101. There is no such King who would deny being a King. And even if we accept this as a possible scenario, scholarship requires much more than that, it requires linguistics, archeology and so on and forth. Which all of them are lacking.

How is it lacking, the language that they speak is semitic, the Gods that they worship are Semitic no evidence at all you are right.

You(the forum's Jews) are all very ignorant in ethnology and academia in general, the academic arguments of the Jews being an ethnos aside from a religion have been posted by myself and Anothroskon, so no luck of you trying to stick on me the claim that I deny you something of Jewish mythology just to deny you your claims to an "ethnos". Get over yourself in other words, and if you want to address the claims of others start reading proper arguments, not conspiracy theories of charalatans.

You have presented no evidence or information at all about this subject, and continue to make statements as though we should accept them as fact. I understand the Greeks are superior humans that cannot be wrong, but perhaps some sort of humility could be used.

Who are they, if they are many you sure have names, speak them, and the fact that Jacobivici is a charlatan is de-facto and even Lightman(a Jewish mod) calls him such, so?

So if because Lightman is a Jew I should worship his words?

[noemon]

How is it lacking, the language that they speak is semitic, the Gods that they worship are Semitic no evidence at all you are right.

First, Semitic does not make Jew. Second, the claim of them being semitic even is due to a couple of names, and such "evidence" is too little to suffice even for the Semitic part, let alone the Jew part, which would then be a tiny sub-division of semitic. That is why you cant find anybody arguing crap like yours. If you have any scholar please feel free to post about his arguments. You are lacking basic information and understanding.

You have presented no evidence or information at all about this subject, and continue to make statements as though we should accept them as fact. I understand the Greeks are superior humans that cannot be wrong, but perhaps some sort of humility could be used.

First of all, I just said this, why would I be required to pos evidence before saying it? Are you well in your head? Second since you are asking for evidence, here it is:


Anothroskon, in a very similar thread, the only one post that addresses the issue academically:

viewtopic.php?p=1710275#p1710275

Myself:

viewtopic.php?p=13076445#p13076445

And here:

viewtopic.php?p=1751187#p1751187

Quit being a victim in other words, and if you want to learn how to address the issue of ethnology, read these sources by proper academics, not charlatans.

Listen, am not telling you to obey Lightman so get off the trip, if you want to consider the charlatan as scholar be my guest, but dont feel prissy when people call on bullshit.

[QatzelOk]

I find it very hard to believe that some people who ruled Egypt, would later write a book to tell stories to their children and tell them that instead of rulers they were in fact slaves, and lie about being slaves instead of rulers.

Well, there was a lot of different mythology out there. And the tribe that had the "slave" mythology did very well. Perhaps this mythology creates an inner desire to dominate by getting the reader to fear being dominated himself.

This seems the likely reason the Hyklos might have been portrayed as slaves in their mythology. Because, as Oxy says, it "worked."

Meaning, it gave this tribe a competitive advantage - just like Wal-mart.

[noemon]

How did that tribe do very well?

They have been conquered by everybody, they have had no country for themselves, and even now with the backing of a super-power, they still have troubles governing some fucking square kms. Are you kidding me?

Why would any king, tell his grandchildren that during his reign he was a slave?

WTF? Would you? How did this mythology produce any glory? If they were indeed the Kings of Egypt, their children and grand-children would be more glorious thereafter since they would be driven by a desire to return to such status. Troy worked very well for Alexander literally, and Alexander worked very well for Rome, and the combination of these 2 worked very well for Byzantium and so on and forth. In what kind of world are you living?

[QatzelOk]

They have been conquered by everybody, they have had no country for themselves, and even now with the backing of a super-power, they still have troubles governing some fucking square kms.

"Conquered" is an interesting way to put it.

Why is this victim group so prominent in the halls of power?

This renders your text very weak. Almost meaningless.

[noemon]

What renders my text meaningless? Excuse my stupidity, but please do the favor to this illiterate grunt and deconstruct your glorious text.

Am all ears.

[QatzelOk]

Your argument is a pile of texts that say this group was always the victim.

Meanwhile, the same group is very dominant, and has a particular control over text distribution.

So your text-based methodology has a fatal flaw in this subject. It's like using cave-shadows to "demonstrate" that the shadow-makers are good people and useful to the cave.

[Oxymoron]

Quit being a victim in other words, and if you want to learn how to address the issue of ethnology, read these sources by proper academics, not charlatans.

Your more full of yourself then the Pope, goodday Mate.

[noemon]

Qatzel, you live in shadow world, dont assume that everybody does; in real terms this tribe did not do very well, it has been stateless for ever and this is the worst it can get for a tribe, to not have any territory to govern and be subject to the whims of everybody. You can go on living in fantasy world, its not my concern.

And Oxy, the sources that I gave you are indeed proper academics, whether you like it or not. And if you read you will like it, be certain of that. If you do want to be taken seriously, get to reading, its going to be for your own good in both the short and long-run.

[Oxymoron]

And Oxy, the sources that I gave you are indeed proper academics, whether you like it or not.

I didnt dispute that, nor attack the character of the academics, unlike you. I am open to all sources of information.

And if you read you will like it, be certain of that. If you do want to be taken seriously, get to reading, its going to be for your own good in both the short and long-run.

Whether you take me seriously or not, is not a concern to me. I suggest you start reading something outside the people who agree with your preconcieved notions.

[noemon]

I suggest you start reading what I gave you instead of idolizing such people:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simcha_Jacobovici

Or market them as "scholars". This is food for people to not be taking you seriously.

[Oxymoron]

Noemon stop putting words in my mouth, and this discussion is over. Debating with you is like pulling your own nails out with plyers.

[noemon]

What words did I put in your mouth? You did market this guy as a scholar and also posted a link with this Hyksos theory formulated by him alone. Debating with you is what you said since you rely on insulting memes, and alleged ideologies that you infatuate in your head.

Many scholars, and just because you think some one is a charlatan doesnt make him one

[Oxymoron]

What words did I put in your mouth? You did market this guy as a scholar and also posted a link with this Hyksos theory formulated by him alone

I dont Idolize anyone for one.

The Hyksos thread was a question and to get more input not to "educate" anyone.

[QatzelOk]

in real terms this tribe did not do very well, it has been stateless for ever and this is the worst it can get for a tribe, to not have any territory to govern and be subject to the whims of everybody

The terms you mention aren't "real." They're the definition of a nation-state, which is no more real than living as a marginal minority in someone else's state.

Perhaps Jews - like gays or left-handed people - simply don't require a state.

You are defining "victimhood" as not having a state, and then saying "The Jews were victims."

Why not define "victimhood" as not owning the Central Bank?

---

The Hyksos thread was a question and to get more input not to "educate" anyone.

Asking questions and getting more input is the definition of education, ffs.

[noemon]

Qatzel, man is a territorial animal, tribes are herds that group together to do exactly that, take over a territory to call their own, that is the quintessence of society, of the tribe, the ethnos, the nation, the empire, which are all states. Not having one does not make you a "victim", but simply unsuccesful and pitiful, definitely it doesnt make you supreme and dominant. Dominant to what? The mood of any given alien bureaucrat/governor and his/her whims?

Now please go on and post whatever fantasy you decide to infatuate to sustain your meme. I dont give a crap, I know you do not agree even if you are in agreement, so its pointless. Am done here, am defintely not going to sit here trying to convince someone that a King would never call himself a slave just so he can get behind a "victimhood" narrative that supposedly breeds glory and success, when it simply doesn't quite evidently.

Carry on without me.

[QatzelOk]

am defintely not going to sit here trying to convince someone that a King would never call himself a slave just so he can get behind a "victimhood" narrative that supposedly breeds glory and success

Didn't Hitler call himself a slave to his people?

Don't all kings believe a variation of this fantasy?

[noemon]

I dont know if he did, but even if he said something along the lines, that he is a servant to his people, because that is what politicians of modern-day nations are supposed to be ideally, not slaves but public servants, that is completely out of context. Hitler didnt gather the Germans and told them that Bismarck was in fact a slave. Neither did Bismarck leave a will, and said..."em guys I wasnt really a Kaiser, but a slave to the French". I mean please, what are we discussing here?