A World Without Religion - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Polls on politics, news, current affairs and history.

Do you support a world without religion and what will be the effect of eliminating religion?

Yes, positive effect
17
34%
Yes, neutral effect
1
2%
Yes, negative effect
1
2%
No, positive effect
1
2%
No, neutral effect
8
16%
No, negative effect
15
30%
Other
7
14%
By Kman
#13912185
Arkady2009 wrote:Just think...9/11 was a result of extreme religious beliefs.

If religion didn't exist, 9/11 wouldn't have happened.


Communism was a secular movement and it killed 100+ million people in the 20th century.....

Bad morals and good morals will always exist, even if you outlaw religion, modern enviromentalism also strongly resembles a religion if you ask me, it has moral codes and an armageddon scenario if we do not repent. Enviromentalism has essentially become the refuge for the religious nutters that would have been knocking on your door 200 years ago and saying you should repent for your sins before the end days.
#13912245
Arkady2009 wrote:Just think...9/11 was a result of extreme religious beliefs.

If religion didn't exist, 9/11 wouldn't have happened.

That's absurd. 9/11 was a manifestation of anti-colonial rebellion, justified by religion; it would have happened regardless. ETA bombings were never informed by religion, after all.
Last edited by Dr House on 06 Mar 2012 15:41, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
By Suska
#13912316
Carter wrote:I acknowledge that there is something about our very existence that we don't understand and, unlike 'people of faith', I don't try and rationalise it away as some kind of sky-god...I simply admit that I don't know. That's agnosticism in its literal sense.
Even before you go and criticize other people for what you believe they believe first I recommend finding actual people. Not knowing what you don't know is not a method of knowing the mind of others, only of knowing what you've had a representative experience of - and what you don't get at all. That would include the people who have described religious experience as without any mystery, and people who use the word God too casually.

So you approached the matter as a psychologist - behind you the flanks of confident Army Men and the nation, and this seems to you like something other than religion, but it is only superficially different - even if those superficial differences include a battle trench and a bitter past there is one flinch response and we call it many things, and our science theories will never be more real than our theology theories, such is the nature of ideas.
#13912352
One day, Suska, you're going to learn to express yourself in English so the rest of the World can follow your train of thought... ;)

Furthermore, as well as learning to write in English you might benefit from learning to read it, too.

A: I am not a psychologist.

B: I am not in the Army.

Any questions, O mystical and sagacious one?
#13912357
Wtf?

I was under the same impression, Carter. You've mentioned being a nurse and how you work with plenty of mental cases in the military.

Why don't you tell us what's true instead of just saying what's false?
#13912362
He's playing semantics. :p He is (was?) a military nurse in the British Armed Forces (specifically in the RAF).
#13912392
No.
Religion offers a prescription for decent conduct. Moreover it encourages people to behave compassionately, putting limits on intolerant conservatisim. We can codify behaviour secularly, but when we do, we tend to occassionaly get it horribly wrong. Corporations are not people. Yes, religion also can get it wrong, but together, belief in goodness and a secular code for determining wrong from right is a better system than either system on its own.

Null effect.
Religion can be surpressed, repressed but not eliminated. Witness Russia. As soon as religion was no longer banned, churches etc were resurrected overnight.
User avatar
By Suska
#13912396
Even before you go and criticize other people for what you believe they believe first I recommend finding actual people. Not knowing what you don't know is not a method of knowing the mind of others, only of knowing what you've had a representative experience of - and what you don't get at all.
You shouldn't think you know about religion unless you have a religion. Just because it rubs up against politics doesn't mean, when you know something about politics you know something about religion. It is ignorant and impolite to criticize what you only know by stereotype. Don't trust interpretations and know who you are talking to.

That would include the people who have described religious experience as without any mystery, and people who use the word God too casually.
It goes also for those who pretend to be a special voice for the universe - which produced both the vine-grower and the crow, not to mention the intellectual and the mystic. There is as much room as there is tolerance.

So you approached the matter as a psychologist - behind you the flanks of confident Army Men and the nation, and this seems to you like something other than religion, but it is only superficially different - even if those superficial differences include a battle trench and a bitter past there is one flinch response and we call it many things, and our science theories will never be more real than our theology theories, such is the nature of ideas.
Your way is religion pretending to be without religion, and like many a rite-set before yours you aim for the same result (there is one flinch response - hammer to knee test gives a usual result... as if I need to explain that ways-of-life are never wrong or right in the way that actual people can be) and you (your cult) don't like the competition.

Robert Graves wrote:...the language of poetic myth anciently current in the Mediterranean and Northern Europe was a magical language bound up with popular religious ceremonies in honour of the Moon-goddess, or Muse, some of them dating from the Old Stone Age, and that this remains the language of true poetry 'true' in the nostalgic modern sense of 'the unimprovable original, not a synthetic substitute'. The language was tampered with in late Minoan times when invaders from Central Asia beganto substitute patrilinear for matrilinear institutions and remodel or falsifythe myths to justify the social changes. Then came the early Greek philosophers who were strongly opposed to magical poetry as threatening their new religion of logic, and under their influence a rational poetic language (now called the Classical) was elaborated in honour of their patron Apolloand imposed on the world as the last word in spiritual illumination: a view that has prevailed practically ever since in European schools and universities, where myths are now studied only as quaint relics of the nursery age of mankind...

The genuine undivided religion of Western Civilization began with language as music and poetry as truth, it was crippled and cannibalized before Socrates time, but it still managed to get him killed for badmouthing it. When you realize that the cult of Apollo was a cult of living people with a way of life described by the cult's rituals and rationales you may be struck to notice that modernity regards mainly the interaction of still thriving cults and the Universalizing character of Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism and Christianity is just a poetic way of thinking about how to organize these various natural tendencies/cults. That red is rouge is rood is obvious, that god is universe is more difficult, but only because - despising each other - we refuse to allow it.

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