Cultural assimilation - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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By mikema63
#14785028
Just something I want to get clear on.

I'll preface this with the fact that I'm not necessarily opposed to assimilation nor do I necessarily support it. I'm on the fence about it.

What are the criteria that need to be looked for before someone can be declared culturally assimilated?

How do you go about culturally assimilating someone? Like, what policies make someone change their cultural identification?
By Decky
#14785035
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cricket_test

The cricket test, also known as the Tebbit test, was a controversial phrase coined in April 1990 by the British Conservative politician Norman Tebbit in reference to the perceived lack of loyalty to the England cricket team among South Asian and Caribbean immigrants and their children. Tebbit suggested that those immigrants who support their native countries rather than England at the sport of cricket are not significantly integrated into the United Kingdom.[1]

Background

Post-war Britain experienced mass migration from the cricket playing countries of the West Indies and South Asia. Ever since the issue of assimilation and multiculturalism has been a controversial issue in British politics.

Tebbit, in an interview with the Los Angeles Times, said: "A large proportion of Britain's Asian population fail to pass the cricket test. Which side do they cheer for? It's an interesting test. Are you still harking back to where you came from or where you are?"[2]

Tebbit told Woodrow Wyatt in 1991 that he did not think certain immigrant communities would assimilate "because some of them insist on sticking to their own culture, like the Muslims in Bradford and so forth, and they are extremely dangerous."[3]

Legacy

The phrase "cricket test" and the associated loyalty concepts received a lot of media attention for many months after Tebbit's statement, and have been widely discussed and argued over ever since.

Lord Tebbit later claimed that his test could have prevented the Glasgow International Airport attack and the 2007 London bombs.[4] However many argue to the contrary.[5]


Seems fairly straightforward to me Mike. :excited: Would that meet your criteria?
By Decky
#14785038
Not those crickets Mike.

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If you can't understand just substitute cricket for 'gator wrastlin' and read the article again. Maybe it will make more sense to you that way. :D

I hate all sports, so I suppose I belong nowhere.


Unless you mend you ways and find new "hobbies" I fear I know exactly where you belong. :*( I will of course pray for your soul. God is all forgiving.
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By Ter
#14785050
When I lived in Zambia, President Kenneth Kaunda made a speech about the South Asians living in the country.
He said, and I will not forget it: "Their bodies are here in Zambia, their hearts are in India and their bank accounts in London."
By Decky
#14785051
How many countries have you lived in Ter? And when can we expect more breakfast reports?
#14785058
I'm an Edmonton Oilers fan, Decky. They're not the best now, but they sure used to be. My hometown, too, so it'll never change. Even when I lived in Vancouver, and cheered for their team, when Edmonton came to town, I got on my hometown jersey. :D
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By Godstud
#14785065
There's worse teams to support, I suppose... *cough* Toronto Maple Leafs *Cough*

1/3 of the team is Canadian :)
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By Ter
#14785137
Decky wrote:How many countries have you lived in Ter? And when can we expect more breakfast reports?

I lived and worked in three but I worked in quite a few more, short stints mainly.
And travelled to others.
All together maybe forty five or so : I can't give an exact number because some countries I visited do not exist any more as a country (Yugoslavia, East Germany) and in some others I was just there for a few days.

I have hit a blank with the breakfast updates. My recent breakfasts are quite repetitive or bland. I am sorry, I will get back to posting my morning hearty delicacies soon.
#14785334
Godstud wrote:I'm an Edmonton Oilers fan, Decky. They're not the best now, but they sure used to be. My hometown, too, so it'll never change. Even when I lived in Vancouver, and cheered for their team, when Edmonton came to town, I got on my hometown jersey. :D


You just failed the cricket test, since you live in Thailand you should support a thai hockey team. Clearly the Thai secret service agencies need to keep an eye on you.
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By Godstud
#14785335
Thailand does not have an ice hockey team, Solarcross.

No, I am definitely not assimilated into the Thai culture. I can admit that.

I'm very easy to find. The Thai secret service can have beers with me on the corner, as long as they're buying. I'll tell all.
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By Frollein
#14785344
I don't think the cricket test can tell you much about cultural assimilation. It tests loyalty, which can be independent of that.

Cultural assimilation can't happen with immigrants, and with the following generations only when they mingle with people from their host country. As long as you have strong family units and immigrant communities, cultural mores and customs will be preserved.
#14785345
mikema63 wrote:Just something I want to get clear on.

I'll preface this with the fact that I'm not necessarily opposed to assimilation nor do I necessarily support it. I'm on the fence about it.

What are the criteria that need to be looked for before someone can be declared culturally assimilated?

How do you go about culturally assimilating someone? Like, what policies make someone change their cultural identification?


Cultural assimilation can come in a number of flavours with an emphasis that will vary in importance according to different perspectives.

Tebbit's cricket test mentioned by Decky is a loyalty test. Loyalty is something that will matter to people with a martial or security perspective, so government, police and the armed forces in particular. Loyalty probably doesn't matter as much now as it did in the early 20th century because military technology has reduced the military potential of ordinary people to somewhere close to zero, (well excepting terrorism which is mostly of only nuisance value).

TL;DR The military man wants to know whose side you are on.

Another aspect is cultural commerce, how well people can socialise and do business with each other. The number one thing here is common language and following from that compatible social mores, cues and customs / laws. This is something that tends to matter most to civilians.

TL;DR The civilian wants to know if you speak the same language.
#14785392
mikema63 wrote:Just something I want to get clear on.

I'll preface this with the fact that I'm not necessarily opposed to assimilation nor do I necessarily support it. I'm on the fence about it.

What are the criteria that need to be looked for before someone can be declared culturally assimilated?

How do you go about culturally assimilating someone? Like, what policies make someone change their cultural identification?


Cultural assimilation has degrees. Some people can be assimilated only minorly while others achieve complete assimilation.

In the latter case, an assimilated person comes from a family that is fully inter-married with the local inhabitants, has adopted the religion of the country, speaks only the language of the country and it is only their surname which distinguishes them from others.

However there can be lesser degrees of assimilation. For example, someone might not be inter-maried and still speak another language and have another religion but they can still be very patriotic and well disposed towards the country in which they live.
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By mikema63
#14785397
So, assuming you are only aiming for them to be well disposed to the country (seeing as I don't see a way to force them to intermarry) how would you measure their disposure? What policies would cause it?
#14785405
mikema63 wrote:So, assuming you are only aiming for them to be well disposed to the country (seeing as I don't see a way to force them to intermarry) how would you measure their disposure? What policies would cause it?


Its very difficult to do it. Based on previous discussions we have had, I know you are well aware that measuring these types of attitudes is incredibly difficult. You can enact policies but to change a person's beliefs, feelings and behaviour is really not something the state can achieve. It is just as in the case of trying to end institutional discrimination in the USA, the policies only go so far.

I would say the best solution is not invite such large numbers of settlers into a country in such large numbers in such a short space of time. If this happens then assimilation will be essentially impossible.

The attitude of immigrants to their new country will be defined by many factors. These include their economic status, their reception by the wider society, the appeal of the host culture and the relationship of this country to the lands from which they originally came. I think it is very dififcult to quantify.
#14785408
Probably education is the key to culturally assimilate migrant groups and if they speak the language of their adopted country fluently and learn its history, they are culturally assimilated. What's dangerous is a separate education system for a migrant population. Korean Japanese students still retain their culture by attending all-Korean schools up until high school and all subjects are taught in Korean. There are photos of the Kim family to worship in every classroom. Britain has the same problem with Muslim students attending Islamic schools.

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Four Islamic schools ordered to close following fears over extremism or pupil safety continue to operate because the Government is powerless to shut them down, the Daily Mail can reveal.
One allegedly taught girls that men can beat their wives. Another distributed leaflets saying music is an ‘act of the devil’. They could continue operating for months, if not years, after launching legal appeals against closure. The four fee-paying independent establishments include a girls’ boarding school, Jamia al-Hudaa in Nottingham, that was ordered to close last month after Ofsted found books in the library by individuals banned from entering Britain.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z4bEXMjMzM
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