Is the "Alt-Left" Hurting the Republicans, or the Democrats? - Page 4 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14841359
The Immortal Goon wrote:This is true. I find it clear hat the rise of anarchist and its ideology on the far left has to do with the systematic destruction of Marxism.

Marxists have always been worried about class unity and mass movements, anarchists with showing up and breakin' stuff.


Alas, we have no Marxian dialectic present in America's classrooms. What we have is hyper-liberalism, along with virtue-signalling, self-important and spoiled over-privileged brats possessing an overwhelming need to see themselves as freedom fighters. If they are as really interested in social justice as they so passionately seem, may I suggest they go home and shoot their parents.

As for the workers, they're pretty much the enemy according to the limousine left. Bumpkins, with their backwards thinking, are apparently in desperate need of a moral vanguard, so never fear - they have one: a pompous class, completely disconnected from the effects of predatory capitalism and liberalism, virtue-signalling from deep within their gated white enclaves. And when Meryl Streep stood up and blew her righteous load all across America at that awards ceremony a while back, I felt like puking.

The problem with the rural people is not, and can never be, the rural people. I'm not talking about the lumpenproletarian wastes of space that hold fascist rallies - I'm talking about your typical, "fly-over country" types. These people do not own capital nor the means that produce it, but yet they are supposedly the gatekeepers of reactionism...a class of people completely out of touch, and deserving of every bad thing.

The white/rural working class have been utterly swindled by the right-wing (which, incidentally, is why Trump was initially opposed by the GOP - he was moving in on their prey), and with the absolute abandonment of dialectically sound theory pertaining to class-struggle and the embrace of identity politics, an alienated social class becomes easy-pickings for reactionaries.

It's not about social justice and working class empowerment. The entire American political dynamic consists of one side selling reactionism and the other side selling identity victimization. We can change the complexion of the monarchy! The community of those who rape the poor aren't diverse enough in skin tone, goddammit! Never mind abolishing it altogether...it's the "American dream", after all.

Of course, if people were to actually come together it would be all over for the bourgeoisie in two seconds flat. Bernie Sanders, the neo-corporate ass kisser that he turned out to be, was actually able to bring out such a diverse body of enthusiastic voters...and of course it scared the bejeezus out of the establishment. Good thing they had their Trump contingency in place to be uber-devisive, rabble-rousing, and poison folks against one another before all that talk of the 1%, you know, got out of hand.
#14841366
Buzz62 wrote:...
OK so what would you call a person who believes that people who dig fascism, should be silenced and attacked at every turn?


I can think of many different groups and people who would happily do that. Not just leftists.

Its difficult, isn't it. On one side, you have a bunch of hill billies who have some offensive ideas.
On the other side, you have a bunch of what...
People who want to fight with the hill-billies?

You pick the "bucket names" I don't care...


No, it is not difficult. One side is white supremacists who want to kil and oppress minorities, while the other side are fighting that oppression. There really is no debate as to which side is the better one.

----------------

Buzz62 wrote:I don't think you're the violent sort, however if you grab a bat or a can of pepper spray, and go look in a mirror?


The Immortal Goon wrote:So the "alt-left," is just another name for POD.

Wow, this term is very useful. Thank you for making it up.


Lol. Burn.
#14841379
POD wrote:No, it is not difficult. One side is white supremacists who want to kil and oppress minorities, while the other side are fighting that oppression. There really is no debate as to which side is the better one.

Seems Pelosi and Feinstein would not agree with you now. Seems they don't find either side "better" any more.
Could it be, that they've reasoned that this "hissy-fit" of the lefties has gotten way outta hand, and is now destructive to any real Democratic election hopes? Perhaps they made a deal with the devil himself, in order to get something they want?

As the intensity of public outrage disintegrates, and the facts are laid bare, what do we see?
Image

It's comical really. You people had a real opportunity to be a healing and mature voice after this tragedy...and y'all blew it big time.
Now the left leadership is busily distancing themselves from Antifa, and saying really nice things about the devil. Lord will miracles never end?
Donny just screwed Ryan and McConnell too, over the debt ceiling. Just to show he could care less about either the right or the left.
I'd suggest that's because, it doesn't take a genus to realize...yer all fuckin' crazy.

Welcome...to the "basket of deplorables". 8)
#14841389
Buzz62 wrote:Seems Pelosi and Feinstein would not agree with you now.
Seems they don't find either side "better" any more.


Sure. They can be wrong too.

Are Pelosi and Feinstein the alt-left?

Could it be, that they've reasoned that this "hissy-fit" of the lefties has gotten way outta hand, and is now destructive to any real Democratic election hopes? Perhaps they made a deal with the devil himself, in order to get something they want?


Maybe? Does it matter? The opinion of some centre right polticians is of absolutely no importance to me. Does Pelosi's eagerness to pander to the right for votes magically make the alt-left a thing?

As far as I can tell, this has nothing to do with the topic. Which is the total lack of any group that is actually alt-left.

As the intensity of public outrage disintegrates, and the facts are laid bare, what do we see?
Image

It's comical really. You people had a real opportunity to be a healing and mature voice after this tragedy...and y'all blew it big time.
Now the left leadership is busily distancing themselves from Antifa, and saying really nice things about the devil. Lord will miracles never end?
Donny just screwed Ryan and McConnell too, over the debt ceiling. Just to show he could care less about either the right or the left.
I'd suggest that's because, it doesn't take a genus to realize...yer all fuckin' crazy.

Welcome...to the "basket of deplorables". 8)


Why would I want to heal some imaginary rift between me and racist people?

They want to oppress and kill minorities, which is most of my family. Should I be "mature" and meet them halfway? Maybe let them oppress me and be racist against my loved ones only on odd numbered days. Would that be an acceptable compromise? And what exactly would I get out of it? The awesomeness of living with racist people? Can't wait!

Is that it takes to be considered healing and mature by you?

Is the alt-left any person who is unwilling to compromise about racism?
#14841423
Pants-of-dog wrote:Sure. They can be wrong too.

Are Pelosi and Feinstein the alt-left?

Maybe? Does it matter? The opinion of some centre right polticians is of absolutely no importance to me. Does Pelosi's eagerness to pander to the right for votes magically make the alt-left a thing?

"Alt-left" is a basket that includes Antifa, BLM and those who support and encourage their violent actions and notions of extreme measures to remove any people they deem undesirable, in much the same way the "alt-right" carries on.

Pants-of-dog wrote:As far as I can tell, this has nothing to do with the topic. Which is the total lack of any group that is actually alt-left.

"Is the "Alt-Left" Hurting the Republicans, or the Democrats?"

Pants-of-dog wrote:Why would I want to heal some imaginary rift between me and racist people?

They want to oppress and kill minorities, which is most of my family. Should I be "mature" and meet them halfway? Maybe let them oppress me and be racist against my loved ones only on odd numbered days. Would that be an acceptable compromise? And what exactly would I get out of it? The awesomeness of living with racist people? Can't wait!

Is that it takes to be considered healing and mature by you?

Is the alt-left any person who is unwilling to compromise about racism?

'alt-right' or 'alternative right' is a name currently embraced by some white supremacists and white nationalists to refer to themselves and their ideology, which emphasizes preserving and protecting the white race in the United States in addition to, or over, other traditional conservative positions such as limited government, low taxes and strict law-and-order. The movement has been described as a mix of racism, white nationalism and populism ... criticizes "multiculturalism" and more rights for non-whites, women, Jews, Muslims, gays, immigrants and other minorities. Its members reject the American democratic ideal that all should have equality under the law regardless of creed, gender, ethnic origin or race.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right
I don't see the word "kill" in there. Do you?

Racism is going nowhere. It has always existed, and it likely always will. Knowing that, the question becomes, "how to deal with this in a rational manner?" As I said, the word "kill" does not appear in this "alt-right" platform. However you and I have seen "alt-lefties" call for killing. That suggests the "alt-left" is a little unhinged, while the "alt-right" appears to be more organized in their messaging. Regardless of their thoughts on the matter, or the dead people they want to identify with.

So "how to deal with this in a rational manner?"
Well, my mother taught me to ignore "bullies" and they'll shut up and go away.
This was very good advise because "bullies" desire and demand attention. So it stands to reason that the most rational way to deal with the "alt-right" is to ignore them. Their media can't survive without finance, and if only the "alt-righties" visit Brietbart, it'll go away too.

I known your situation and would have to believe you and your family is pretty darn good at ignoring stupidity and racism. That would be what I'd characterize as "healing and mature".
#14841454
Buzz62 wrote:"Alt-left" is a basket that includes Antifa, BLM and those who support and encourage their violent actions and notions of extreme measures to remove any people they deem undesirable, in much the same way the "alt-right" carries on.


Yes, it is a term used by the right to try and draw a false equivalence between the alt-right and certain people on the "left".

But please note that antifa is not an organised group, and BLM has nothing to do with it except that conservatives don't like it.

"Is the "Alt-Left" Hurting the Republicans, or the Democrats?"


Yes, your thread title is hilarious considering the fact that the alt-left does not exist.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt-right
I don't see the word "kill" in there. Do you?


Way to ignore my point.

What do I get out of compromising with racists?

If I am supposed to be all healing and mature, what do I get out of it?

Racism is going nowhere. It has always existed, and it likely always will. Knowing that, the question becomes, "how to deal with this in a rational manner?" As I said, the word "kill" does not appear in this "alt-right" platform. However you and I have seen "alt-lefties" call for killing. That suggests the "alt-left" is a little unhinged, while the "alt-right" appears to be more organized in their messaging. Regardless of their thoughts on the matter, or the dead people they want to identify with.


What do I get out of compromising with racists?

So "how to deal with this in a rational manner?"
Well, my mother taught me to ignore "bullies" and they'll shut up and go away.
This was very good advise because "bullies" desire and demand attention. So it stands to reason that the most rational way to deal with the "alt-right" is to ignore them. Their media can't survive without finance, and if only the "alt-righties" visit Brietbart, it'll go away too.


Your mother was wrong.

I know how to stop racist bullies, as I lived in the prairies decades ago when racisst used to drive around looking for minorities to beat up.

Now, what do I get out of compromising with bullies?

Apparently, I get the opportunity to sit meekly by and do nothing while they get all violent and racist, according to you and your mom! Woohoo!

I known your situation and would have to believe you and your family is pretty darn good at ignoring stupidity and racism. That would be what I'd characterize as "healing and mature".


So I should just ignore the racism that people target at me and mine each day. So that it keeps happening.

No. I get nothing out of that, unless you count "having to live with racism" as a benefit.

In conclusion, I should just accept racism and let racist people do whatever they want and sit meekly by because you decided that these imaginary alt-left exist.

No.
#14841482
Pants-of-dog wrote:Yes, it is a term used by the right to try and draw a false equivalence between the alt-right and certain people on the "left".

Certain people on the left. Hmmm...
http://dailycaller.com/2017/08/24/armed ... st-police/
Now, the "alt-right" is just as filthy. so what's the difference between them?
Its getting to the point in America and Europe, where the differences between "right" and "left" politically, are being blurred and disappearing.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/4 ... g-violence
So ya...there's that...

personally I don't care what you call them all. They are violent, awful people who need a good spanking.

Pants-of-dog wrote:But please note that antifa is not an organised group, and BLM has nothing to do with it except that conservatives don't like it.

Now who's dreaming in technicolor?

Pants-of-dog wrote:Yes, your thread title is hilarious considering the fact that the alt-left does not exist.

Did anyone ask you to take part?

Pants-of-dog wrote:What do I get out of compromising with racists?

If I am supposed to be all healing and mature, what do I get out of it?

Peace? Besides, I didn't say "compromise", did I.
No I said IGNORE.

Pants-of-dog wrote:Your mother was wrong.

I know how to stop racist bullies, as I lived in the prairies decades ago when racisst used to drive around looking for minorities to beat up.

Me too. Yet I also remember those pricks being identified and shunned by their piers, and when caught, punished by the law.

Pants-of-dog wrote:Apparently, I get the opportunity to sit meekly by and do nothing while they get all violent and racist, according to you and your mom! Woohoo!

So I should just ignore the racism that people target at me and mine each day. So that it keeps happening.

No. I get nothing out of that, unless you count "having to live with racism" as a benefit.

In conclusion, I should just accept racism and let racist people do whatever they want and sit meekly by because you decided that these imaginary alt-left exist.

No.

I'm not your keeper, nor do I care to stop you from waging this battle.
But you must realize that your opposition and confrontation tactics, only prod these shitty people to get louder and stronger. You do not have the power to stop them, and neither does the law, as long as they don't hurt anybody.
I don't think someone like me, can really appreciate your position. You are...unique.
But at present, the legal system we enjoy, affords citizens the right to voice their opinion. And, being that actors at the extremes of either side are basically angry shit-heads, there are enough people around who will abuse this right in order to hurt people...mostly emotionally.
I would only ask, I suppose, that you use your "senses". ALL of them. Which includes your eyes.
Examine the optics of ur typical alt-right/alt-left encounter. Examine the recounts of the sequence of events. And examine the results.
The Antifa "brand", if that makes you feel better about it, is currently taking it in the proverbial teeth right now. And why? Because AT the Charlottesville riot, and in the aftermath, they managed to give themselves a black-eye. Is that really something you want to associate yourself with?
There are no good choices. Probably because racism is such a basic and destructive instinct in today's world. But it exists, and its rather obvious now that the tactics of this "alt-left" don't work.
On the other hand, one could make a career outta racism. Use it as a tool for financing. Like a professional activist. But then again, you wind up having to aline yourself with advocates for destruction and violence against...society.
Like I said, I don't know if there's a "good" choice available.
There is one that works though.
Ignore "stupidity".
#14841501
Buzz62 wrote:Certain people on the left. Hmmm...
http://dailycaller.com/2017/08/24/armed ... st-police/


Did you notice that pooor right winger crying about how antifa was terrorising everyone never used the term "alt-left"?

Now, the "alt-right" is just as filthy. so what's the difference between them?
Its getting to the point in America and Europe, where the differences between "right" and "left" politically, are being blurred and disappearing.
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/4 ... g-violence
So ya...there's that...

personally I don't care what you call them all. They are violent, awful people who need a good spanking.


Well, one difference is that the alt-right actually exist, while the alt-left do not.

Now who's dreaming in technicolor?


Go ahead and provide evidence for your claim that antifa and BLM have organised together into the "alt-left".

Did anyone ask you to take part?


You did, implicitly. By starting this thread.

Peace? Besides, I didn't say "compromise", did I.
No I said IGNORE.


The kind of peace where I am forced to ignore open acts of discrimination?

That does not benefit me at all, but it does benefit people who want to egt away with being racist.

So, this is not a good reason for me to compromise with or ignore racists.

Me too. Yet I also remember those pricks being identified and shunned by their piers, and when caught, punished by the law.


No. But I like your admission that merely ignoring them does not work.

I'm not your keeper, nor do I care to stop you from waging this battle.
But you must realize that your opposition and confrontation tactics, only prod these shitty people to get louder and stronger.


No. We have seen that the racists cancel their rallies and events because they are scared of being punched in the face.

This directly contradicts your claim.

You do not have the power to stop them,


Watch us.

The history of the civil rights movement, feminism, and LGBT rights movements indicates that committed and organsied groups of egalitarians can and do make significant changes, even if they cannot totally eradicate bigotry.

and neither does the law, as long as they don't hurt anybody.


Since I am not counting on the police to eradicate racism, I will simply agree.

I don't think someone like me, can really appreciate your position. You are...unique.
But at present, the legal system we enjoy, affords citizens the right to voice their opinion. And, being that actors at the extremes of either side are basically angry shit-heads, there are enough people around who will abuse this right in order to hurt people...mostly emotionally.
I would only ask, I suppose, that you use your "senses". ALL of them. Which includes your eyes.
Examine the optics of ur typical alt-right/alt-left encounter. Examine the recounts of the sequence of events. And examine the results.
The Antifa "brand", if that makes you feel better about it, is currently taking it in the proverbial teeth right now. And why? Because AT the Charlottesville riot, and in the aftermath, they managed to give themselves a black-eye. Is that really something you want to associate yourself with?
There are no good choices. Probably because racism is such a basic and destructive instinct in today's world. But it exists, and its rather obvious now that the tactics of this "alt-left" don't work.
On the other hand, one could make a career outta racism. Use it as a tool for financing. Like a professional activist. But then again, you wind up having to aline yourself with advocates for destruction and violence against...society.
Like I said, I don't know if there's a "good" choice available.
There is one that works though.
Ignore "stupidity".


Again, if I simply ignore racism, then the racists get to do whatever they want and I just have to sit meekly by while people I love are discriminated against.

No.

I gain nothing from it, and the racists get all the benefits.
#14841518
Benefits?
POD...what is it, above all else, that racist organizations crave?
CREDENCE. ATTENTION.
So your baby cries every night till you pick her up.
Does she learn to sleep through the night without crying if you continue this pattern?
Ya maybe when she's 10 or so...and likely because she finally realizes how childish she's being.

Racists need the media. They need opposition and outrage, in order to justify their own beliefs.
But if their efforts are met with indifference or even ridicule, and if the media simply ignores them completely, have they accomplished anything of value to them? No. Because they've been out smarted, and have to go home knowing their great purpose...is a public joke.

One feeds off the other POD.
If no fuel exist...neither can survive.
But if they (you) continue to fight, it could take a much longer time for these racists to realize how childish they are.
If they ever do...
#14841733
Yes. Apparently, white nationalists, identified as the most violent of all extremists in America by the FBI and the DHS, are actually victims of horrible oppression from groups like Antifa and others who don't murder people.

The reason @Buzz62 and others feel righteous caps-lock fury is the horrible mistreatment of neo-Nazis, the KKK, and other white supremacists in America. People even have the audacity to insult some of them by calling them Nazis! In other cases, people even go so far as to counterprotest and demonstrate against them!

Apparently, we are supposed to feel sympathy for Nazis getting punched in the face despite their aim of enacting violence against people for being black, Jewish, and so on. Or so the blubbering Nazi apologist crybabies want us to believe.
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