Is social media ripping society apart? - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14870233
Is society being ripped apart by social media? Is this detrimental for the individual or for the better?


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A former Facebook executive has said he feels “tremendous guilt” over his work on “tools that are ripping apart the social fabric of how society works”, joining a growing chorus of critics of the social media giant.

Chamath Palihapitiya, who was vice-president for user growth at Facebook before he left the company in 2011, said: “The short-term, dopamine-driven feedback loops that we have created are destroying how society works. No civil discourse, no cooperation, misinformation, mistruth.” The remarks, which were made at a Stanford Business School event in November, were just surfaced by tech website the Verge on Monday.

“This is not about Russian ads,” he added. “This is a global problem ... It is eroding the core foundations of how people behave by and between each other.”

Ex-Facebook president Sean Parker: site made to exploit human 'vulnerability'

Palihapitiya’s comments last month were made one day after Facebook’s founding president, Sean Parker, criticized the way that the company “exploit[s] a vulnerability in human psychology” by creating a “social-validation feedback loop” during an interview at an Axios event.

Parker had said that he was “something of a conscientious objector” to using social media, a stance echoed by Palihapitaya who said that he was now hoping to use the money he made at Facebook to do good in the world.

“I can’t control them,” Palihapitaya said of his former employer. “I can control my decision, which is that I don’t use that shit. I can control my kids’ decisions, which is that they’re not allowed to use that shit.”

He also called on his audience to “soul search” about their own relationship to social media. “Your behaviors, you don’t realize it, but you are being programmed,” he said. “It was unintentional, but now you gotta decide how much you’re going to give up, how much of your intellectual independence.”

Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg in Lima. The social media giant has faced increasing criticism for its power to polarize. Photograph: Ernesto Benavides/AFP/Getty Images
Social media companies have faced increased scrutiny over the past year as critics increasingly link growing political divisions across the globe to the handful of platforms that dominate online discourse.

Many observers attributed the unexpected outcomes of the 2016 US presidential election and Brexit referendum at least in part to the ideological echo chambers created by Facebook’s algorithms, as well as the proliferation of fake news, conspiracy mongering, and propaganda alongside legitimate news sources in Facebook’s news feeds.

'Our minds can be hijacked': the tech insiders who fear a smartphone dystopia

The company only recently acknowledged that it sold advertisements to Russian operatives seeking to sow division among US voters during the 2016 election.

Facebook has also faced significant criticism for its role in amplifying anti-Rohingya propaganda in Myanmar amid suspected ethnic cleansing of the Muslim minority.

Palihapitiya referenced a case from the Indian state of Jharkhand this spring, when false WhatsApp messages warning of a group of kidnappers led to the lynching of seven people. WhatsApp is owned by Facebook.

“That’s what we’re dealing with,” Palihapitiya said. “Imagine when you take that to the extreme where bad actors can now manipulate large swaths of people to do anything you want. It’s just a really, really bad state of affairs.”

Facebook did not immediately respond to a request for comment.


https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... iety-apart
#14870239
Yes.

But let's go further and say Mainstream liberal Media is more to blame and the psychotic nature of groups of shareholders in media and technology companies.

None of the people running these companies has bothered to read Huxley, Wells(whos book The Time Machine is really about the destruction of society caused by the rich becoming lazy and the poor becoming heartless workers) or Orwell.

As Ian Malcolm once said "You were so preoccupied with whether or not you could, you didn't stop to think whether or not you should!"
#14870245
“Imagine when you take that to the extreme where bad actors can now manipulate large swaths of people to do anything you want.”
:lol: Bad actors have been manipulating large swaths of people since the beginning of civilization. These social media barons are pretty full of themselves, they act like they invented bullshit, stupidity, and neediness.
#14870246
No. It's not ripping society apart. A great many people don't live by social media, or at least can tell when it's simply bullshit.
#14870250
Nah. It’s not ripping society apart as such. But I wish people would stop using FB as an alternative to a proper obituary. It’s so tasteless.
#14870257
Its not ripping us apart, its just showing us how ripped up and divided we have been for a long time by eliminating tact and good manners through an emboldening of common social interactions as if everyone was an anonymous target on a political forum. :eek:

EDIT:

I heard a minister once say, years ago, that if everyone in that fairly warm-and-fuzzy church could read each others minds, they could hardly be restrained from murdering each other (imagine what the average 18 yr old has playing through his head about young ladies around him in a given hour).

Social media just brought us closer to that reality than we had ever been before by enabling everyone to speak their minds without restraint.
Last edited by Victoribus Spolia on 12 Dec 2017 12:50, edited 2 times in total.
#14870259
Victoribus Spolia wrote:its just showing us how ripped up and divided we have been for a long time

I'd say that it displays our divides more due to the increased reach of a single voice. Before the interwebs, it was kinda hard to get heard beyond shouting range. Now, constant instant global communication to events happening concurrently.
#14870262
Zagadka wrote:I'd say that it displays our divides more due to the increased reach of a single voice. Before the interwebs, it was kinda hard to get heard beyond shouting range. Now, constant instant global communication to events happening concurrently.


I don't disagree, I would just add that it puts the uglier sides of human nature, such as narcissism, on display for every individual who opts to log-in.
#14870390
Facebook is an alternate society for people who clearly don't have much of a social life. If they had a great social life, they would not need to prowl around the feeds for material to gawk at and laugh at. Or they wouldn't spend so much time uploading stuff.

For some FB is an interesting conversational piece to break the ice with. They'll say, "You know, some kid on FB posted this pic..." and then they can entertain others with that story.

Society started to be torn apart when the Internet arrived. So many people would go into chat rooms or use those IM clients. People like to hide behind screens so they can say all kinds of stuff without seeing other people, without fear of being punched for any rude comments they make. The Internet just lets people be the cowards they always were. People fear confrontation.
#14870392
Zagadka wrote:I'd say that it displays our divides more due to the increased reach of a single voice. Before the interwebs, it was kinda hard to get heard beyond shouting range.


And yet at a real-life social event getting attention is easy, while on the internet (e.g. twitter, reddit) you have to say outrageous nonsense or otherwise stand out to get it. It's all a huge pissing contest for tiny bits of attention by random people.

Victoribus Spolia wrote:I don't disagree, I would just add that it puts the uglier sides of human nature, such as narcissism, on display for every individual who opts to log-in.


Born in another time we would all be warmongering rapists. It's circumstance that makes us who we are.
#14870394
I think MB did a thread on Marshall Mcluhan's media theory which pretty much confirms that the ability of social media as a platform for the masses would have an effect on society as a whole. Common sense would know this to be true. How else can you explain both Trump or Brexit?

Social media is both good and bad for society. It is good because it gives ordinary people who before the internet would never have a platform to air their views and bad because it allows wankers like Trump, Stone, Manafort, Jones, Farage and co to bullshit and spread lies to a foolish or desperate audience who are looking for hope. I suppose more regulation is needed to prevent this manipulation.

But I do think people are starting to question things they read on the internet now. It's just three years too late. Perhaps the tide is turning for rational thinking again. Maybe there is hope for society after all.
#14870405
Not even close.

A lot of the people who are arrested are done so because of social media in terms of assault or terroristic threats over what was said on FB or (if you want to include it in Social Media since it is the primary carrier) text messages. Somehow, fifteen years ago, one would probably see a similar case where a guy was going through the wrong part of the closet and found love letters from his wife to an unknown sweetheart or vice versa. There is nothing new under the sun.

What is troublesome is that the attention spans of people have gotten dismally condensed. One hundred and forty characters is not enough for me so I’ve all but given up on Twitter. Most of my Facebook posts that are 4-5 paragraphs garner a response of one or two words. So I’ve stopped posting much on FB as well.
While I think the literary canon is pretty much a waste of time, I did appreciate some of the works in the canon. Huck Finn was a joke, I thought. I am probably among the last generation that will ever be expected to read 3-400 books during my school career, write book reports, 20 page essays, etc… The generation behind mine is not dumber, not lazier, or inferior in any way to mine or the generation that proceeded mine; what they are is mentally trained to boil everything down to the essential element and try to decide if it affects them. FB didn’t do that…our shrinking competitive world did that. Today, you’re either quick or you’re dead in terms of being successful at school. The reason is because We’ve given up learning for the sake of learning. Everything is geared toward getting a job when you leave school. And the sad thing is that the most important thing about getting hired is usually who you know; not what you know. You’re much more likely to be hired if you’re attractive than unattractive; friendly instead of reclusive, and lets face it, lighter skinned instead of darker skinned—just a fact of the matter.

A few years back, I got a job at an apartment complex. I needed a job to fit in between postings so I decided I wanted an inside job where I could do school work and not be too stressed. So I went to the complex and interviewed. “Do you have any experience?” No. “Have you ever sold anything?” No. “Are you available on Sundays to work?” No. I got hired based on one thing. As we went from building to building, the developer had decided they were not going to name the buildings 1, 2, 3, etc…. One was named Arcadia, one named Shenandoah, one named Yellowstone. I mentioned that the names were all national parks. The manager was impressed that I knew that and that I had the gift for gab talking about Lindsay Davenport and Steffi Graff as we moved through the tennis courts.

Anyway, the assertion that Social Media is ripping us apart is frankly stupid. What is doing it or has done it is that our values have been hijacked. We no longer value craftsmanship. We no longer value good intentions. We no longer value input. We have become, for want of a better term, individual mini Wal Marts. In some cases, this is forced because wages have stagnated and we can’t afford to keep expensive insurance or expensive vehicles or expensive clothing; just the basics to get us through the day. Really, the next time you go buy a toaster or can opener or pitcher, you will probably buy the cheapest one knowing that in 9-20 months, you’lll be back to buy another because what you’re buying is so cheaply made, it’s makes more sense to buy a replacement than spend a little more for the better quality item.
#14870453
MistyTiger wrote:Facebook is an alternate society for people who clearly don't have much of a social life.

Not true. I mostly use Facebook to keep up with old friends from college and see all the family pics of my niece and nephews and such. I mostly use Twitter to follow company announcements and some comedians for the lulz.
#14870465
Zagadka wrote:Not true. I mostly use Facebook to keep up with old friends from college and see all the family pics of my niece and nephews and such. I mostly use Twitter to follow company announcements and some comedians for the lulz.


Ok, not quite what I meant. I should've said that what I was talking about was for those people who log in ALL the time and stay logged in for days on end without logging out, I think some of my highschool friends are like that.

Your use would be normal use and you don't seem like the obsessive facebook prowler type at all.

When I do log into FB, I briefly look at the feed and see what my cousins and friends are up to and check for messages.
#14870664
No. It's not ripping society apart. It's opening it up.

Change happens and how we adapt to technology is entirely up to us.

MistyTiger wrote:Facebook is an alternate society for people who clearly don't have much of a social life.
I use Facebook to interact with friends who are in foreign countries, and far away. When a friend shows up, in person, the FB goes off in an instant. I'm with Zagadka on this one.

Few people stay logged on all the time and are actually there. many walk away from laptops and the like, and leave themselves logged on. it's not an actual indicator of how much time they spend on FB.
#14872658
Victoribus Spolia wrote:...I would just add that it puts the uglier sides of human nature, such as narcissism, on display for every individual who opts to log-in.

The ultimate in human narcissism has been on display for many years. Isolated suburbanites, competing with each other for toys they see on commercial mass media, turned a billion people into complete assholes.

Suburban-car-isoloation also prevented us from spontaneously socializing with each other for the last two generations, thus compounding our assholeness many times over. (our, us, the society we are part of)

Social media has us 'talking' to one another again. It's not pretty, but it's the only way to counter the ultimately-fatal but well-polished lies of commercial media. And commercial media is responsible for more damage than a thousand nukes.
#14872661
4cal wrote:Not even close.

A lot of the people who are arrested are done so because of social media in terms of assault or terroristic threats over what was said on FB or (if you want to include it in Social Media since it is the primary carrier) text messages. Somehow, fifteen years ago, one would probably see a similar case where a guy was going through the wrong part of the closet and found love letters from his wife to an unknown sweetheart or vice versa. There is nothing new under the sun.

What is troublesome is that the attention spans of people have gotten dismally condensed. One hundred and forty characters is not enough for me so I’ve all but given up on Twitter. Most of my Facebook posts that are 4-5 paragraphs garner a response of one or two words. So I’ve stopped posting much on FB as well.
While I think the literary canon is pretty much a waste of time, I did appreciate some of the works in the canon. Huck Finn was a joke, I thought. I am probably among the last generation that will ever be expected to read 3-400 books during my school career, write book reports, 20 page essays, etc… The generation behind mine is not dumber, not lazier, or inferior in any way to mine or the generation that proceeded mine; what they are is mentally trained to boil everything down to the essential element and try to decide if it affects them. FB didn’t do that…our shrinking competitive world did that. Today, you’re either quick or you’re dead in terms of being successful at school. The reason is because We’ve given up learning for the sake of learning. Everything is geared toward getting a job when you leave school. And the sad thing is that the most important thing about getting hired is usually who you know; not what you know. You’re much more likely to be hired if you’re attractive than unattractive; friendly instead of reclusive, and lets face it, lighter skinned instead of darker skinned—just a fact of the matter.

A few years back, I got a job at an apartment complex. I needed a job to fit in between postings so I decided I wanted an inside job where I could do school work and not be too stressed. So I went to the complex and interviewed. “Do you have any experience?” No. “Have you ever sold anything?” No. “Are you available on Sundays to work?” No. I got hired based on one thing. As we went from building to building, the developer had decided they were not going to name the buildings 1, 2, 3, etc…. One was named Arcadia, one named Shenandoah, one named Yellowstone. I mentioned that the names were all national parks. The manager was impressed that I knew that and that I had the gift for gab talking about Lindsay Davenport and Steffi Graff as we moved through the tennis courts.

Anyway, the assertion that Social Media is ripping us apart is frankly stupid. What is doing it or has done it is that our values have been hijacked. We no longer value craftsmanship. We no longer value good intentions. We no longer value input. We have become, for want of a better term, individual mini Wal Marts. In some cases, this is forced because wages have stagnated and we can’t afford to keep expensive insurance or expensive vehicles or expensive clothing; just the basics to get us through the day. Really, the next time you go buy a toaster or can opener or pitcher, you will probably buy the cheapest one knowing that in 9-20 months, you’lll be back to buy another because what you’re buying is so cheaply made, it’s makes more sense to buy a replacement than spend a little more for the better quality item.


I found this post outstanding. It is very very intelligent and thoughtful and full of truth.

I also think one has to keep in mind that you are talking about a specific culture. English speaking WASP influenced North American societies. Not all societies.

I loved it! ;)
#14872693
4cal wrote:Anyway, the assertion that Social Media is ripping us apart is frankly stupid. What is doing it or has done it is that our values have been hijacked. We no longer value craftsmanship. We no longer value good intentions. We no longer value input. We have become, for want of a better term, individual mini Wal Marts.

I agree with your diagnosis, but I think the causes of our rampant social stupidity and lack of integrity are more generally due to commercial mass media and suburban isolation, along with long work hours.

All of this has made us unhappy and stupid.

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