[Drlee]

Maybe you don't care about all the women and children trapped in sex slavery but for some of us it's a real concern.

Grow up. You really need to sharpen your rhetoric. Can you show me anywhere that I said I do not care about "women and children trapped in sex slavery? Of course not.

So far I am just about the only one who is not chanting "lock 'em up" which has become the republican mantra these days. That is unless a republican is the one with whom one disagrees.

All prostitutes are not children or sex slaves. What do we do with them? Make them felons? What a load of shit. It is legal, in fact encouraged, for a woman to give away sex. She can even freely trade it for a job and then later accuse the man of the crime.

The republicans want to dramatically cut money for drug treatment, housing for the homeless, health care for the poor and even food for the poor but let a woman sell herself for any of the above and she is a felon. And then they get mad at me for calling them idiots. Idiots.

[Pants-of-dog]

I do not think @Sivad or @skinster are arguing that the sex worker should be charged with anything. Instead, they are arguing that the sex worker should be given help leaving the trade, and the john should be charged with a felony.

[Rich]

A long time back I used to know a couple of prostitutes socially. I don't think either of them would have appreciated being characterised as victims. I certainly think the age of consent for prostitution and hard pornography should be set at 18. Most of the problems with prostitution are due to entanglement with other issues such as under age sex, drugs and illegal immigration. We don't need to ban prostitution to deal with these problems. I'm happy for example to bring back the death penalty for human trafficking. There's smarter ways we can deal with drugs and under age sexual perpetrators can be convicted regardless of whether the victim is a prostitute.

Prostitution needs to be properly licenced, regulated and done legally. Prostitutes should be subjected to mandatory drug testing. That way prostitution users can use prostitutes and know they are not being coerced or trafficked and they are not supporting the illegal drugs trade. Of course hate filled Cultural Marxists are far more interested in sating their hatred of White men than in the welfare of women who work as prostitutes.

[skinster]

Do you honestly think that arresting Johns will end prostitution?

It's reduced it drastically in Sweden.

The so-called Scandinavian solution is preposterous.

Nope, because see above. Or explain why your opinion is worth anything.

But I am an affluent, older, white male. I will take care of the girls. After all. It appears that women blame us for all of their problems and look to us for all of their solutions. No worries. We have been doing it since the beginning of time. We can continue until women as a group have matured to the point where they can take care of themselves.

I can't believe you typed this sentence out. But thanks for making it very clear that you're a misogynist. No wonder you're okay with sexual violence/slavery.

[Sivad]

I can't believe you typed this sentence out.

I can.

[Sivad]

A long time back I used to know a couple of prostitutes socially. I don't think either of them would have appreciated being characterised as victims.

Nobody's claiming all prostitutes are victims but many are. Criminalizing prostitution guarantees that those who have been forced into it will be dealt with as criminals rather than cared for as victims. That would be a grave injustice so it's better to decriminalize all prostitution.

Prostitution needs to be properly licenced, regulated and done legally. Prostitutes should be subjected to mandatory drug testing. That way prostitution users can use prostitutes and know they are not being coerced or trafficked and they are not supporting the illegal drugs trade.

They do that in Germany and it has created a massive sex trafficking industry.

Of course hate filled Cultural Marxists are far more interested in sating their hatred of White men than in the welfare of women who work as prostitutes.

I think most people advocating for these reforms are far more interested in ending the sexual enslavement of their fellow human beings than sating their hatred of White men. You being more concerned about the sexual satiation of White men than the sexual enslavement of women and children is way more fucked up than cultural marxism.

[skinster]

Off-topic but "cultural marxism" is a rightwing conspiracy theory stolen from German Nazis and is not an actual thing.

[Sivad]

Off-topic but "cultural marxism" is a rightwing conspiracy theory stolen from German Nazis and is not an actual thing.

It's a real thing. It doesn't have anything to do with Marxism, that's just stupid wingnut bullshit, but what it's referring to(the liberal assault on traditional culture) is very real. Traditional culture is ignorant and it does need to be dismantled but the empty nihilistic trash culture liberals are trying to replace it with is even worse.

[Hong Wu]

Friendly reminder that only 1 in 12 Americans identify as progressive and out of those 1 in 12, presumably all of them don't hate America or white males. Many of you are barking up the wrong tree, no one cares and #metoo in Kavanaugh's case seems to have helped Republicans more than Democrats.

[skinster]

^ I saw the video of that woman who appears to be quite clearly unhinged. When she was pretending to be on the phone calling cops on a child that did nothing wrong, she gave her name, address and telephone number. One would hope for her sake that she gave incorrect information. I think she also claimed to be a cop.

It's a real thing. It doesn't have anything to do with Marxism, that's just stupid wingnut bullshit, but what it's referring to(the liberal assault on traditional culture) is very real. Traditional culture is ignorant and it does need to be dismantled but the empty nihilistic trash culture liberals are trying to replace it with is even worse.

No, it is not a real thing. It's a fantasy in the minds of modern day nazis.

[Albert]

Self convincing that she was raped (or they are just lying) or is it real?

[Hong Wu]

Sooooo, Stormy Daniel's defamation suit against Trump was thrown out AND they have to pay attorney's fees. This means that the GoFundMe money that was being paid to porn star Stormy for her lawsuit will end up going to Trump...

I wonder if siding with porn stars etc. against due process was a bad call in the long run?

[QatzelOk]

I do not think @Sivad or @skinster are arguing that the sex worker should be charged with anything. Instead, they are arguing that the sex worker should be given help leaving the trade, and the john should be charged with a felony.

Exactly.

In money-ravaged colonies like Vietnam and China, part of their revolutions were meant to get their prostitute little sisters off the streets.... through equalization of income and education.

By suggesting that prostitution be facilitated, you are giving up on the kinds of social equality that will lead the human race back to dignity and possibly survival-oriented progress. Facilitating poor and desperate people "getting raped for money" replaces natural human sexuality with industrialized human sexuality. Porn is another symptom that we are sick and this sickness caused by sexual-regulation-of-human-cattle is probably responsible for many horrible behavioral atrocities of modern humanity.

Prostitution has been "liberalized" (like casino gambling) in many places, and rape continues to be a thing in all of these places. Prostitution eradicates rape in much the same way casinos eradicate poverty: not at all.

[Victoribus Spolia]

In money-ravaged colonies like Vietnam and China, part of their revolutions were meant to get their prostitute little sisters off the streets.... through equalization of income and education.

By suggesting that prostitution be facilitated, you are giving up on the kinds of social equality that will lead the human race back to dignity and possibly survival-oriented progress. Facilitating poor and desperate people "getting raped for money" replaces natural human sexuality with industrialized human sexuality. Porn is another symptom that we are sick and this sickness caused by sexual-regulation-of-human-cattle is probably responsible for many horrible behavioral atrocities of modern humanity.

Prostitution has been "liberalized" (like casino gambling) in many places, and rape continues to be a thing in all of these places. Prostitution eradicates rape in much the same way casinos eradicate poverty: not at all.

Statistics have already been provided in this thread showing that actual rape is reduced by legalized prostitution.

Likewise, the whole idea that being a prostitute is to be raped by definition is to take the notion of consent and voluntarism and twist it beyond recognition.

If you make a contract with someone, that is the highest form of voluntarism, even more so than the verbal consent that would occur on a date.

By agreeing to accept money, so that a dude can practice his money shot from 3 feet away, your not being raped or assaulted.

Does this mean you like your job? No, but that is irrelevant. I don't like my job but that doesn't make me an actual slave. I have agreed to employment at this job and therefore am here by willful employment via contract. I can call myself a slave in a colloquial way, but its not actual slavery. Likewise, a prostitute can refer to her job as being "raped for a living," but that is colloquial, its not actual rape.

For instance, if I paid the girl in the picture below to take this shot of milk (because I'm into kinky stuff like throwing milk on people....JK), she has not been raped. She has consented via contract to this act.



Now how does this reduce rape? Besides that we know that actual violence against women via rape and assault are reduced when prostitution is legalized, the why seems kinda common-sense. In a society that lacks restrictions for outlets of naturally aggressive male-sexuality, you will have less violence committed by the stronger sex against the weaker sex.

Men often have an insatiable desire to fuck and this is correlated to the same hormone that likewise makes men fight each other in violent ways. This is how men are. In times past, marrying such off at an early age or sending them to war was a way to keep society civilized; however, in our decadent world men are still men but no longer are able to get married as before and are not so likely to die in combat.....pornography and prostitution give outlet to these aggressive sexual impulses in a way that prevents them from being vented in a violent and destructive manner where woman are being raped, beaten, and stabbed in back alleys on a regular basis.

Hence, the argument that prostitution IS rape or assault is nothing but sophistry.

[maz]

Exactly.

In money-ravaged colonies like Vietnam and China, part of their revolutions were meant to get their prostitute little sisters off the streets.... through equalization of income and education.

Yeah ok, but what about the US, where there is equalization of education and mostly income, but some women willingly enter into prostitution and the porn industry?

Instagram is practically a federally approved version Backpage.com.

What is the excuse then?

[Victoribus Spolia]

[Sivad]

There is no libertarian solution to sex trafficking, you allow prostitution and you're contributing to the sexual enslavement of tens of thousands of women and children.

[skinster]

Prostitution has been "liberalized" (like casino gambling) in many places, and rape continues to be a thing in all of these places. Prostitution eradicates rape in much the same way casinos eradicate poverty: not at all.

<3

VS thinks dude who pay women and children - or their pimps - to let them fuck them are suddenly lovely, non-violent, non-rapist guys, just because, money/food/shelter. How romantic.

[Victoribus Spolia]

There is no libertarian solution to sex trafficking, you allow prostitution and you're contributing to the sexual enslavement of tens of thousands of women and children.

That is not necessarily true.....the absence of a state in the middle east would not necessarily guarantee a mass market for alcohol. This has a lot to do with population demand and our culture only has unusually decadent demands because of social deterioration which has been primarily facilitated by the influences of the state.

VS thinks dude who pay women and children - or their pimps

You mentioned children, I didn't.....you have a weird way of slipping that in...is this a fetish of yours or what?

to let them fuck them are suddenly lovely, non-violent, non-rapist guys, just because, money/food/shelter. How romantic.

Not an argument and suffers from more than just a bit of presumption as to my thoughts regarding the character of those who stoop to purchasing sex.

[Drlee]

VS thinks dude who pay women and children - or their pimps - to let them fuck them are suddenly lovely, non-violent, non-rapist guys, just because, money/food/shelter. How romantic.

As VS said. You and Sivad have to resort to dishonesty to make any kind of an argument. Why? Because the argument that all prostitutes are slaves used for rape is indefensible. It is simply not true.

Prostitution is not about "romance" anymore than playing a soldier a movie is about bravery.

Clearly you and Sivad know little about prostitutes and prostitution. (Qatz too.) This is an odd turn in this thread. We conservatives are humanizing the prostitutes and their customers and the so-called liberals are dehumanizing them. There is a lot bad about prostitution and a great deal of that simply because it IS illegal. But that is not what I am talking about. I am talking about frail vulnerable human beings, both acting out their own sadness. (Inserting here that I know wealthy hookers who do not believe they are abused at all.)

I object to the term "John". Many prostitutes are make. Some women in prostitution see "Jane". You should spend some time with prostitutes and try to understand what their lives are really like. Why they do it and what they get out of it. Not all are crackheads. But what of them. Where is your solution to the grinding poverty and desperate drug abuse that drives people to prostitution. Where is your compassion for the loneliness that would drive a man to a women for sex? Or imaginary love.

You both should spend some time in a topless bar. Watch the men shoveling five dollar bills into a woman's g-string expecting no more reward than a smile and a fantasy. And happy to get that. Look under the bravado and you find deeply lonely people. Both of them.

So here are two conservatives, VS and I, representing the humans who are prostitution. We ask you to stay out of something you do not understand at all. Your petty moralizing and hyperbolic talk of children and characterizing Johns as felons brings down the wrath of a self-righteous public on already fragile people. You destroy the very people who in your naivete you think you are protecting.

I have to lecture you about how to be a liberal or libertarian I guess. So get the fuck out of other people's lives unless you are invited in. Stop appointing yourself Certified Christian Hero rushing into a situation you understand not at all. If you want to do something about prostitution then get off your entitled asses, find some charities serving poor, homeless, addicted and disenfranchised people and work. Don't be in charge. Don't write a check. Go their and learn. Then when you have spent a year or two seeing what it is really like and come to understand in some small way what these people really experience, then offer your opinions. As one who used to feel the way that you do I can tell you that you will not hold the opinions you do now.

At the end of the day you will find out that prostitution is never the disease. It is a symptom. And none of the three of you has a fucking clue what the disease even is.