[Godstud]

Everything isn't black and white. You statements in relation to this, show your naivety.

I hold a gun to your head, and say, "Fuck me.". You agree because you think I am going to kill you. That's consent, according to you.

I am the boss of a company. I say, "Fuck me.", to a female staff member. She might agree because of the implied threat to her livelihood, even though she does not want to do so.

[colliric]

It can be. It depends on where they are. It depends on your relative position of authority to the person, as well.

It has no place in the workplace to ask such a thing.

You heard it from Godstud guys.... The days of the Drunk Office Christmas Party, literally a private event that happens to be held often at the workplace are numbered......

If you are a boss of the person you are asking, then it can be extremely intimidating to where it's seen as a threat. There can be an implied threat of firing if the person is to decline.

You can also be fired for refusing to clean dirty blocked toilets in most jobs requiring you to do "occasional cleaning chores" even if you are an office worker. Or refusing to clean up a deliberate mess that your boss made just so he could ask you to clean it.

There is always an implied threat of being fired if you don't do what the boss wants regardless of what he's asking for. He could be asking you to shake his hand or "keep a cheery face when I walk past".

You're incredibly naive, aren't you?

No, but if it's not completely consensual(if there is intimidation/threat of demotion, etc.), then it most certainly be classified as such. Rape is, most often, about asserting power. This is why these powerful people often do it.

There's no such thing as "not completely consensual". What you described is purely unconsensual sex(Rape). If a person is coerced into sex, it's not consensual. However if the person doesn't fight during it and starts enjoying and giving in, regardless or not they were coerced at the start, it has become consentual sex. The woman's mind has changed during sex(which as we know means it isnt Rape, because consentuality status can change during sex... I mean we all know that right? It goes both ways.... If she can change her mind at the last second from Yes to No before he's about to splurge, it can also change from No to Yes logically).

That's why Rhett Butler didn't rape Scarlett O'Hara. She only disagreed at the start. The next scene portrays the sex as having become consentual.

[Wellsy]

We're talking about sexual violence of which it's not readily apparent how much could legitimately be significantly explained as sexual frustration. Even cases of sexual violence that seem of this nature, it's not enough in itself considering many have desires that go unsatisfied without resorting to violence as they have self control and respect for others.
So this "uncontrollable" male desire that needs to be satisfied or it leads to harassment or worse seems a dubious position to argue from.
In fact it seems to largely ignore the matter by framing it merely as that of a sexual urge without any corresponding examination of the social form in which it is expressed. Which is why there isn't yet an explicit explanation of what distinguishes the harasser and the non-harasser of similar lack of sexual fulfillment.
Hell, it's been the point that men view women as gatekeepers of sex and thus their consent as a frustrating barrier in that they have little regard for actually seducing and evoking the consent of women but only preoccupied with their own desire.
Something which characterizes those that do harass women in that a clear difference between even a bad flirt and harasser is the clear indifference to verbal and non-verbal communication.

The problem in regards to women being subject to sexual harassment and violence is a lot more complicated than men get horny and not all have someone to sleep with.


And in regards to the discussion of something being consensual or not...
http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/osjcl/Articles/Volume2_1/Commentaries/Westen-PDF-11-29-04.pdf

What matters is that she actually chooses sexual intercourse under conditions that the jurisdiction at hand regards as free of wrongful force. That is what prescriptive consent to sexual intercourse is.
...
A woman’s choice is not “free” if it is the product of pressures that, in the judgment of the jurisdiction at hand, unconditionally taint it, that is, pressures that taint her choice even in the event that she welcomes them. 30

http://moritzlaw.osu.edu/students/groups/osjcl/files/2016/07/Consent-Culpability-and-the-Law-of-Rape-Ferzan.pdf

It then argues that the best conception of consent—one that reflects what consent really is—is the conception of willed acquiescence. That is, an internal choice to allow contact—a decision that “this is okay with me”—is all that is morally required for one person to contact another.
...
To this point, I have argued that if consent is derived from our autonomy, then we ought to be able to change the permissibility of the act by an act of will alone. The corollary of this argument is that an individual is not wronged, and does not experience conduct as a wrong, when willed acquiescence is present.
...
Still, the point remains that a person is not wronged when he has chosen to allow the act. Whether viewed as “willed acquiescence,” “choice,” or “willingness in fact,” the idea remains the same—it is the internal mental action of the consenter that determines whether it is permissible for the other person to act.

[Godstud]

There is always an implied threat of being fired if you don't do what the boss wants regardless of what he's asking for.

Having sex is not "Job related", and is likely in no way associated with their job description. Your argument is utter and complete nonsense. Defend your sheep, colliric.

[colliric]

Having sex is not "Job related", and is likely in no way associated with their job description. Your argument is utter and complete nonsense. Defend your sheep, colliric.

Yes because people don't get fired for simply smiling or not smiling at the boss.. my point is there is not "extra" threat to the person's job above and beyond the normal "implied threat" associated with any Boss request.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/www.indep ... html%3famp

Oh wait they do.

Threat is always there regardless of what stupid or evil thing the boss is asking for.

This list of people in a certain company getting fired for idiotic reasons is hilarious:

[skinster]

Men need physical sexual relief. They aren't allowed to have sex with animals. With each other, in many societies and groups. With siblings.

And women have been conditioned to desire men with money, similar to the way whores have always responded to this singular pursuit.

This sociological problem won't be solved by throwing even more men in prisons, and shaming the rest.

Are you even looking for a solution, or just someone to shame? Because in sexuality, men are the Palestinians, and women are the chosen gender.

Qatz

[Tainari88]

:lol:

Qatz

Skinster, Q states 'men need sexual relief'. I must say-so do women. Both sexes need that. Unless you believe like the monks and nuns who really believe that you can 're-channel' or redirect sexual energy into something more 'elevated' in purpose.

How about the role Skinster of 'salt peter' and other drugs to help repress sexual energy? A pain in the ass for human goals that can't afford sexuality because it distracts from a mission. Boxing matches, wars, single sex populations. Amazons in Ancient Greek Mythology or all male prison colonies. Got to do something to 'dampen' the flame.

This #MeToo campaign can be solved I say....the first dude who tries to do something not approved of and clearly sexual harassment worthy? They can down the opposite pill of viagra and somehow become de-sexed.

Neutered. Spayed. Desexualized.....solution. What say you men with too much sexual energy but without any partners that are the army of the willing? Will that be an acceptable solution? LOL!

Ave Maria, los hombres locos. My God, crazy men!

[colliric]

I know you're joking but I'm going to have fun responding anyway:

Are you a Paleo Diet lover? are you Vegan? are you vegetarian? do you eat organic foods? Do you not eat artificial foods? Do you eat Organic if you have the choice to go for something "as nature intended"? Do you hate bad things happening to animals? Do you enjoy using organic products?

If you're answer is No to all then that's ok... If Yes to any one then you're a damn hypocrite for suggesting men ingest unnatural man made artificial products to unnaturally neuter their natural organic full functioning gonads.... And you're a hypocrite if you don't believe artificially neutering animals in general is cruel.

P.s. just a reminder I know you're Joking but still, I'm responding with my own Jokey response anyway.

[Tainari88]

I know you're joking but I'm going to have fun responding anyway:

Are you a Paleo Diet lover? are you Vegan? are you vegetarian? do you eat organic foods? Do you not eat artificial foods? Do you eat Organic if you have the choice to go for something "as nature intended"? Do you hate bad things happening to animals? Do you enjoy using organic products?

If you're answer is No to all then that's ok... If Yes to any one then you're a damn hypocrite for suggesting men ingest unnatural man made artificial products to unnaturally neuter their natural organic full functioning gonads.... And you're a hypocrite if you don't believe artificially neutering animals in general is cruel.

P.s. just a reminder I know you're Joking but still, I'm responding with my own Jokey response anyway.

Colliric, I am beginning to deeply like you. Despite your conservatism and such comments that are opposite to my political ideology? You I am beginning to like you so much!

I am starting to believe you need some heavy lovin' to become from a man with some issues over some freaky women you once had notions of romance with.....to a man who is transformed by EL AMOR!

In fact, you inspire this song all about EL AMOR! Colliric, this is a classic Puerto Rican bolero by Pellin Rodriguez, who sung this song about a man with pain in his heart because of a bad love, gone bad, he doesn't want to see a sad face, a cold semblance, I can't see you unhappy anymore, 'how can you dare to say that in this heart, there is no more love for you? For in my heart and in my eyes, you shall only find 'amor por ti'! Love for you! The lyrics continue, "I don't want to see your sad face, and your cold semblance, my love is yours, I can no longer deny it, to deny this love is to condemn my life, and if you look into my eyes all you will find is AMOR POR TI. Love for you!

Amor, por ti.....Amor por ti, You need a classic, I will invoke it just for you:

Here it is:

[colliric]

I'm a Richie Valens fan...

Los Lobos cover(from the movie):

Comes from having a South American Nanny who had her Radio always tuned to classic Latino Rock songs(but they played his English stuff all the time too, most famous Latino Rock star, but he sung in English most of the time)... Plus the now classic Lou Diamond Phillips biopic was frequently played on tv.

Of cause he sung this romantic classic in English:

[Tainari88]

Good night darling @colliric it is way past midnight here where I am located. I had a great day of bowling, playing arcade games and eating at an Indian buffet lunch and drinking mint tea as my little son ate cake and hot chocolate. A great day today!

You are a very sweet man. You don't need to worry Colliric, some decent and beautiful woman who appreciates your qualities will come along, and you will persuade her to do a lot of things. Without any force involved. Just colliric, and Evita Peron charisma....big kiss on both cheeks for you! No more hysteria for anyone. Buenas noches simpatico!

BTW, Richard Valenzuela, died so young. But he had a lot of people who loved him. That is what is important in life darling Colliric. Having people who love you for you.

[AFAIK]

It's either consensual or it ain't, like being sorta pregnant.

Have you ever heard of statutory rape?
You should look it up.
Also, phantom pregnancy is a thing.

[Suntzu]

Have you ever heard of statutory rape?
You should look it up.
Also, phantom pregnancy is a thing.

They call it statutory rape for a reason. Little Susie, who is 16 years and 364 days old, spreads her legs and gives it up. Bam! Statutory rape. Tomorrow it would be O.K.

Still, you are either pregnant or you are not. I've heard of butt babies but I think it is urban myth.

[The Immortal Goon]

I, for one, am stunned that the supporters of the party of pedophelia are saying that underaged women secretly want to be raped.

[Drlee]

And women have been conditioned to desire men with money, similar to the way whores have always responded to this singular pursuit.

I know it was said in jest.

But this is a notion that I hear really often. It is not really true. Women are conditioned to like bad boys. The smart ones settle for men with money some of the time.

I know several really short men who are all of a sudden six feet tall when they stand on their inheritance. There was a time when a janitor from Detroit could marry a fashion model from Russia for the price of a US immigration visa. We actually had to pass a "no sweetheart, you have to stay married a little longer than a week" law.

It is ironic that we look down on women who are selective in their marriage choices but are just fine with the doctor who marries the waitress with big tits.

Story of winning.

I knew a man who was the archetypal 6' geek. Horned rim glasses and everything short of a pencil pocket. He drove a Prius because he thought it was the right thing to do. What he had going for him was a very lucrative patent and a big selling ap. He had a boat load of money. But he could not get a date under a palm tree. One day a really pretty girl flirted with him and sold him a gym membership. He met a wing man at the gym who taught him to clean up his act. In a matter of a few months he was a buff, 6', well dressed and BMW driving stud muffin. Though he was still awkward in manner he looked like the whole package. I met him for lunch on a business matter and couldn't believe the change. Tanning booth color and all. Even our (gorgeous) waitress took a shot at him, writing her cell number on my receipt and handing it to him. Six months later I saw him and he had become engaged to the mousy, vapor thin geek girl in his office who had been awkwardly flirting with him for as long as anyone could remember. And the moral of the story is.........

[Tainari88]

I know it was said in jest.

But this is a notion that I hear really often. It is not really true. Women are conditioned to like bad boys. The smart ones settle for men with money some of the time.

I know several really short men who are all of a sudden six feet tall when they stand on their inheritance. There was a time when a janitor from Detroit could marry a fashion model from Russia for the price of a US immigration visa. We actually had to pass a "no sweetheart, you have to stay married a little longer than a week" law.

It is ironic that we look down on women who are selective in their marriage choices but are just fine with the doctor who marries the waitress with big tits.

Story of winning.

I knew a man who was the archetypal 6' geek. Horned rim glasses and everything short of a pencil pocket. He drove a Prius because he thought it was the right thing to do. What he had going for him was a very lucrative patent and a big selling ap. He had a boat load of money. But he could not get a date under a palm tree. One day a really pretty girl flirted with him and sold him a gym membership. He met a wing man at the gym who taught him to clean up his act. In a matter of a few months he was a buff, 6', well dressed and BMW driving stud muffin. Though he was still awkward in manner he looked like the whole package. I met him for lunch on a business matter and couldn't believe the change. Tanning booth color and all. Even our (gorgeous) waitress took a shot at him, writing her cell number on my receipt and handing it to him. Six months later I saw him and he had become engaged to the mousy, vapor thin geek girl in his office who had been awkwardly flirting with him for as long as anyone could remember. And the moral of the story is.........

Drlee you tell little anecdotes well. I don't know about women are conditioned to like bad boys. I don't. I don't like sexist men, racist men, arrogant men, I just don't like assholes. Period. And I don't give a damn about money.

I like men with intellect and curiosity. And who are kind, good and warm and with good character. Few of those around. I never believed that as a woman I had to find a man with a fat bank account. I smile, because I met my husband when I was very young. And he was very young. And we were BROKE. Not a dime to our names. I think we could only afford to buy a coconut that was chilled on the beach for $1 only. But we had such fun together! Dancing, talking, el paseo, that is the traditional stroll you go on with your girlfriend when you are dating. You talk and get to know each other better. I had no plans to marry very young. Wanted to just go to the university and study and work part time. But my husband wanted to get married. He was and still is a man with tremendous social skills, and persuasive as all hell. A charming person with such a beautiful loving nature. With women most of all. Men? He had many male friends, but he did not trust them around his girlfriend, he said 'los hombres no puedes confiar con las novias. Son unos barbaros.' which meant, "The men can't be trusted with girlfriends. They are barbarians.' I wonder about that?

Don't you think Drlee, that it is wonderful to be loved for being you? Not because you are rich or wealthy or this or that? But because you are you....? No matter how old you get or how bald or if you are infirm or vulnerable or whatever? You will always be loved because of who Drlee is in this life?

You should find a woman Drlee (maybe I am being presumptious and you are already married for many years to that woman), that doesn't care if you are broke, sick, vulnerable and without any great asset. Only who you are and she loves you for that and nothing else matters? That is the kind of love I love. And I love to love that way. It is the BEST feeling in the world!!

If more men were loved that way? So many issues with power and insecurities and hatred and envies and pain and sorrow and so many things about alienation, loneliness and depression and hopelessness? It would be gone. Forever.

I like you Drlee. Despite all that I disagree with you on many things. But I think in your center? The core? It is a man of character. I do.

TIG is a great man too. My great goal with him is for him to become a lot more "Latino" and pursue relaxation. And have fun!!

[anna]

Tavis Smiley, a man whom I have long respected even though I profoundly disagree with a most issues, is one of the only men aggressively standing up to #MeToo. Most of the rest are cucking out.

The only guys I hear using the word cuck or its derivatives are the red pill-popping, MGTOW safe space alt-right types.

That your source is ROK comes as no surprise.

And yes, source is relevant.

[anna]

I am technically married still, and yes she was an abusive individual. I can't go into it though. Complicated situation. Nasty stuff.

Have you considered that your focus on women as abusers leads to your projecting onto other women? Yes, there are abusive mothers and wives. However the majority of abuse is committed by men. Or do you think men don't do the same and worse as you've seen women do?

And out of curiosity, why didn't you intervene on behalf of the child you saw being carried abusively?

[Beren]

Men need physical sexual relief. They aren't allowed to have sex with animals. With each other, in many societies and groups. With siblings.

And women have been conditioned to desire men with money, similar to the way whores have always responded to this singular pursuit.

This sociological problem won't be solved by throwing even more men in prisons, and shaming the rest.

Are you even looking for a solution, or just someone to shame? Because in sexuality, men are the Palestinians, and women are the chosen gender.

This sociological problem won't be solved by casual gay sex, beastiality, incest, or prostitution as well. Are you even looking for a solution, or just trolling?

As for skinster, she's clearly looking for power and believes feminist indoctrination of hetero boys and men is the solution.

[anna]

Why would someone wait decades to come forward?

Many reasons. They were young and the perp was a relative and they feared threats and/or repercussions.

They were professional subordinates and feared damage to career.

They felt no one would believe them.

They shut it away in a corner of their minds and got on with life - until Weinstein, when they found courage through the solidarity of women rising up to speak out.

Cultural rejection.

And many, many more. Most women have a story to tell. And a reason why they didn't tell anyone for a very long time and maybe never.