How Psychiatric Medications are a Direct Cause of Western Liberalism - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14896574
Preamble: Most people don't form their political opinions out of direct, detailed (aka professional) understanding of a given policy area. Even though I'm a highly educated person, I wouldn't expect my opinion to be taken seriously as a matter of discussion outside of one or two public policy areas because as someone who gained a certain degree of competence in those areas, I also came to appreciate which areas I don't have expertise in, given how complicated modern policies can be.

This is why I get frustrated sometimes that so many people these days act as if they "know everything". Celebrities in previous generations used to be asked for their political opinions and they would refuse to provide them because they were only entertainers; most people from previous generations appreciated that they understood some things and they also appreciated what they didn't understand. This doesn't happen nearly as often today. The change didn't occur because suddenly everyone "knows everything", the change happened for other reasons.

If you can accept the controversial (by today's standards) idea that people should know what they're talking about before weighing in on important subjects, you might be able to go one step further. What is it, exactly, that causes people to come to one opinion or another in policy areas that they should know they don't understand? We already know that political opinions stem largely from factors other than debate: physical attributes (stronger and taller people are more likely to be conservative), economic status (the top and bottom of the economic spectrum tend to be fiscally liberal, the middle more conservative) and familial beliefs all strongly effect political orientation and none of those things indicate understanding of a policy area in of themselves.

Debate happens anyway and this can be a good thing. But having a debate doesn't mean that people have suddenly become informed. All too regularly, neither side in a debate was informed in the first place. The winner of the debate does occasionally (although very rarely) elicit a change in policy opinions but not because they were the more knowledgeable party. If someone who lacks knowledge of an area appreciated that, they wouldn't have tried to debate with a more knowledgeable person in the first place. What actually happens is that people are emotional creatures and when dealing with a subject that they (or perhaps neither) party actually understands, they come to their conclusions for emotional reasons. Whichever side causes the other side more anxiety wins the debate and then the political opinion changes. Actual understanding of the policy area is not relevant here since usually, neither side possessed it to begin with and they won't have gained said knowledge from each other during debate.

Finally we get to the role played by psychiatric medications. Various types of anxiety and depression-blocking medications prevent negative feelings from arising in specific types of situations. I will give two examples here.

First, the example of the "sanctuary city" policies. Let's imagine an illegal alien with a skull/MS13 tattoo on their face gets brought in for illegal possession of a firearm. It's sanctuary city policy to not deport such a person. I believe that you must be on anxiety-blocking medications for this to not make you anxious. If someone immediately gets in your face and calls you racist, that will make you anxious even if you're on an anxiety blocker. If you imagine a long-term source of anxiety, such as this person later on killing someone, your medication blocks this type of anxiety and so you do not treat the position that they should be deported as a serious or reasonable conclusion.

Second, let's consider firearm laws. I'm somewhat experienced in this area. I'm not aware of a convincing argument that gun control laws reduce murder, suicide or overall crime rates. Even so, immediate possession of a gun causes immediate anxiety. Media coverage of dramatic (but statistically insignificant) events causes immediate anxiety. These are not experiences affected by anxiety-blocking medications. Concerns about long-term impact are exactly the kind of anxiety that most anxiety-blocking medications are designed to treat, therefore arguments about the long-term effects of gun control do not have an influential effect upon those who are taking said medications.

It's my opinion that no one who is on mind-altering medications should be weighing in on a policy debate of any kind. Unfortunately the ubiquitous nature of these medications among the upper classes in the west correlates strongly with the existence of seemingly suicidal (in the long term) western liberalism. I think it's easy to see why that is.
#14896590
Your topic is almost completely unrelated to what you wrote, to any significant degree.

I'm not aware of a convincing argument that gun control laws reduce murder, suicide or overall crime rates. You like to ignore these arguments, that's why.

Strict state gun laws linked to fewer suicides and murders
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKBN1GH39W

It's nice to ignore Australia's experience with gun control, as well.

Psychiatric medications are not a direct cause of Western Liberalism. False statement, and very misleading as to what you are truly talking about.
#14896613
HongWu wrote:I also came to appreciate which areas I don't have expertise in

Like psychopharmacology, for example?

Neurologists, rather than psychiatrists, have long since determined that both anxiety and depression are symptoms sets caused by reduced levels of serotonin in the synaptic spaces. Serotonin is the carrier for messages across the synapse and reduced levels impedes message flow in the brain, which causes confusion and misinterpretation of data being processed therein.

Modern medications act to prevent the brain's over-absorption of serotonin, which is the cause of its loss from the synapses. Thus anyone with an anxiety spectrum and/or depressive disorder who is NOT on an SSRI or SNRI is much less reliable in terms of decision-making than someone who is.


*For the unaware, Cartertonian is a specialist mental health nurse and registered nurse teacher* ;)
#14896758
This thread's premise is ridiculous. You posit that liberals have irrational reactions to certain policy positions and then cite a completely irrational explanation for that belief. You clearly have no understanding of mental health or causality. Just because anti-anxiety medicine occurred alongside western liberalism doesn't mean there is any sort of causal relationship. During the heyday of conservative values that people like you never lived through, but are still inexplicably nostalgic for (the 1950s) - huge swaths of the American public were prescribed amphetamines. By your own logic good old fashioned American values are the insomniac delusions of tweekers.
#14897173
Godstud wrote:Your topic is almost completely unrelated to what you wrote, to any significant degree.

I'm not aware of a convincing argument that gun control laws reduce murder, suicide or overall crime rates. You like to ignore these arguments, that's why.

Strict state gun laws linked to fewer suicides and murders
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKBN1GH39W

It's nice to ignore Australia's experience with gun control, as well.

Psychiatric medications are not a direct cause of Western Liberalism. False statement, and very misleading as to what you are truly talking about.



I don’t think it is politically possibly to implement Australian style gun laws in America because it would be seen as racist.

The way the laws are structured is that if you want a gun you have to show reason why you should own it. That means you have to be a farmer, hunter or member of a shooting club. As a result it is mainly white males who are permitted ownership of firearms. If we applied these laws in America a whole lot of black people would loose their guns.

One thing that is very different in gun culture between the two countries is the norms around carrying guns. In Australia one can only carry a gun in public if it is unloaded and at least wrapped in a blanket, generally packed in its case. One must also have the permit available for offical inspection. In America many states allow people to carry loaded weapons ready for use.

So there is a big difference in culture.
#14897191
The OP was a bit longwinded and rambled. I nearly fell asleep, really soporific stuff.

Why must insanity and psychiatric issues cause western liberalism? Couldn't it be caused by people who just want a change from old school conservatism?

There would be less gun violence if the population fell drastically and if most guns were destroyed by angry citizens who decided that guns do more harm than good.
#14898537
Interesting post.

First, one thing you have to understand is that some people have abnormally high levels of anxiety. I am one such person. Meds help me by normalizing my anxiety levels, so that I still experience what you would describe as normal and healthy anxiety. Even while on the high dose of meds that I am right now, I still experience anxiety just as everyone else.

I didn't read everything here yet but I just needed to throw that out there for thought.

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