Running Sanders Against Trump Would Be an Act of Insanity - Page 3 - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#15062779
Heisenberg wrote:
What I do like about the article though is how neatly it demonstrates a point I've made repeatedly in political arguments IRL: "Vote Blue No Matter Who" is a demand that is only ever made in one direction. These centrist ghouls are always whining about how attacking a front runner is "doing Putin's bidding" or "dividing the party" until the frontrunner is a left winger. Then, they can't wait to cry about how their consciences won't let them vote for the nominee.



Good point. As soon as Warren became the leader, the knives came out. Now they're gunning for Bernie.

The Establishment has a talent for losing.
#15062782
Heisenberg wrote:You guys literally worship a hypertensive, obese 73-year old fast food addict who refuses to exercise and is suffering early stage dementia. Forgive me if I don't think your "concerns" about a candidate's health are real.


"You guys"?

Who are you talking to?

I don't worship anyone.

And we've already dismissed the ridiculousness of the whole "early stage dementia" bullshit. That's nothing more than liberals grasping at straws, knowing they have nothing left to argue so they resort to making things up.

But, if you say he is suffering early stage dementia, please explain: Who diagnosed that and when?
#15062786
Indy wrote:


I don't worship anyone.

And we've already dismissed the ridiculousness of the whole "early stage dementia" bullshit. That's nothing more than liberals grasping at straws, knowing they have nothing left to argue so they resort to making things up.



Yet you spend an impressive amount of time trying to defend Trump and his Cult.

It's not BS. He's clearly in decline, but since he hides everything, we can't know the results of any testing, or even if testing occurred, or even if anyone is monitoring his condition.
#15062789
Godstud wrote:My father had a heart attack in 1988. He lived until 2014.
The rich in the USA(and Bernie is rich) have access to great healthcare, and Sanders might still live another 15 years. Who are you to guess when he might die?

Trump could die of a coronary tomorrow. He might live to see 100. The "what if" arguments are BS.

It's not myopic. It's realistic. No one can see the future, so it's best not to pretend that you can, as you are doing.



If we take voters' possible perceptions into account then it is not BS, because it is unrealistic to assume everybody (or at least everybody who support Sanders) to be as reasonable as we do.

I think I have made myself very clear that I am not against Sanders winning the nomination, but I do think his (relatively) advanced age means him, and his supporters, should also work hard to find a reliable and (even more) robust person as vice-president (candidate). While I talk like certain Trump supporters debating in this thread (and I am not against Trump winning again either), I express similar concern just because I think Sanders' address of it would maximise his chance of winning.
#15062790
late wrote:Yet you spend an impressive amount of time trying to defend Trump and his Cult.


IMHO it is a perception partly based on an unwillingness to accept that there can be people who can simultaneously dislike Trump critics while not actually supporting Trump.

In more extreme cases, it is even possible to have some American voters who exclusively express hatred towards Trump critics, but still not voting Trump or Republicans during the general election.
#15062791
Patrickov wrote:IMHO it is a perception partly based on an unwillingness to accept that there can be people who can simultaneously dislike Trump critics while not actually supporting Trump.

He literally said he voted for him on the previous page. I think that qualifies him as a "Trump supporter". :lol:

Indy wrote:And why would you assume I'm a "Trump fan-boy"? Because I voted for him?

;)
#15062794
late wrote:Yet you spend an impressive amount of time trying to defend Trump and his Cult.


No, I'm not.

See, I deal in facts. Liberals like you deal in emotion. You don't like someone, so you make up things that you certainly cannot support and then you run like the wind when asked to support your claims.

It's not BS. He's clearly in decline, but since he hides everything, we can't know the results of any testing, or even if testing occurred, or even if anyone is monitoring his condition.


Well, if testing hasn't been done, then there's no way to intelligently state that he's "clearly in decline".

Seriously, take a listen to some of the shit Biden and Pelosi have said. I would think the only two things that would make sense is they're either senile or drunk. Listen to Pelosi at the 1:15 point in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkOzBP4Dp1Q

That's someone who's either drunk or "clearly in decline".

How about Joe Biden?

This is from Fox News, but it clearly shows someone who's challenged expressing his thoughts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgFF2GvWFf8

Need more?

"Poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids."

"We choose truth over fact."

"This is a big fucking deal." (said in front of a hot mic in the White House upon the passage of Obamacare)

"If we do everything right, if we do it with absolute certainty, there's still a 30% chance we're going to get it wrong."

"I'm told Chuck Graham, state senator, is here. Stand up Chuck, let 'em see you." (former Missouri State Senator Chuck Graham has been confined to a wheelchair since 1981)

"In Delaware, the largest growth of population is Indian Americans, moving from India. You cannot go to a 7-11 or a Dunkin' Donuts unless you have a slight Indian accent. I'm not joking."

"I've been here a number of times; last time was, I think, way back in 2014. But I've been here before that. I love this place. Look, what's not to like about Vermont?" (This was during his current campaign. He made his comments while in New Hampshire)

And what in the actual fuck is this??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-eD2n2dD2Y


Trump's gaffe's pale in comparison. Anyone who thinks Biden is a preferable choice to Trump should have their head examined.
#15062797
Indy wrote:
No, I'm not.

See, I deal in facts. Liberals like you deal in emotion. You don't like someone, so you make up things that you certainly cannot support and then you run like the wind when asked to support your claims.



Well, if testing hasn't been done, then there's no way to intelligently state that he's "clearly in decline".

Seriously, take a listen to some of the shit Biden and Pelosi have said. I would think the only two things that would make sense is they're either senile or drunk. Listen to Pelosi at the 1:15 point in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkOzBP4Dp1Q

That's someone who's either drunk or "clearly in decline".

How about Joe Biden?

This is from Fox News, but it clearly shows someone who's challenged expressing his thoughts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgFF2GvWFf8

Need more?

"Poor kids are just as bright and just as talented as white kids."

"We choose truth over fact."

"This is a big fucking deal." (said in front of a hot mic in the White House upon the passage of Obamacare)

"If we do everything right, if we do it with absolute certainty, there's still a 30% chance we're going to get it wrong."

"I'm told Chuck Graham, state senator, is here. Stand up Chuck, let 'em see you." (former Missouri State Senator Chuck Graham has been confined to a wheelchair since 1981)

"In Delaware, the largest growth of population is Indian Americans, moving from India. You cannot go to a 7-11 or a Dunkin' Donuts unless you have a slight Indian accent. I'm not joking."

"I've been here a number of times; last time was, I think, way back in 2014. But I've been here before that. I love this place. Look, what's not to like about Vermont?" (This was during his current campaign. He made his comments while in New Hampshire)

And what in the actual fuck is this??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-eD2n2dD2Y


Trump's gaffe's pale in comparison. Anyone who thinks Biden is a preferable choice to Trump should have their head examined.


I seriously question the reliability of the latter two videos. Especially the last: What is the point of showing someone's bare legs? Don't tell me that the video wants to suggest Biden has contacted, say, syphilis?
#15062798
Heisenberg wrote:He literally said he voted for him on the previous page. I think that qualifies him as a "Trump supporter".


I've never claimed otherwise. His competition, though, made the choice quite simple. I believe Hillary Clinton should be in prison, so no way in Hell would I ever vote for her. Donald Trump was actually far from my first choice, and I was as stunned as anyone wen he secured the nomination and, then, won the Presidency.

Do I still support Trump? Yes, I do. I want him to be a successful President, simply because an unsuccessful President hurts our country. Despite that, liberals waste little time wishing that he fails. These people are, in my view, un-American idiots who should be treated with extreme contempt and prejudice.

What I am not, however, is what one less-than-intelligent liberal here claimed; a Trump "fan boy". If Trump does something I don't like, I'm vocal about it. But I also don't jump on bandwagons. Liberals here seem to believe that if you don't agree with every single thing they say about Trump, you're a "fan boy". Agree with them or you're a "Trump worshipper".

I'm happy to know intelligent liberals who understand that supporting a President isn't "all or nothing". They understand that you can support a President while disagreeing with some of what he does.

It's just a shame that no such liberals are to be found here.
#15062800
Patrickov wrote:I seriously question the reliability of the latter two videos. Especially the last: What is the point of showing someone's bare legs? Don't tell me that the video wants to suggest Biden has contacted, say, syphilis?


Do you think the videos are doctored or fake?

The point I was making was that Biden's mind is slipping. What the fuck is he doing talking about how he loves having little kids jump on his lap and rub his legs during a campaign stop?

It's laughable that anyone could view Biden's videos and conclude that Trump is the one suffering dementia.
#15062803
Indy wrote:What I am not, however, is what one less-than-intelligent liberal here claimed; a Trump "fan boy". If Trump does something I don't like, I'm vocal about it. But I also don't jump on bandwagons. Liberals here seem to believe that if you don't agree with every single thing they say about Trump, you're a "fan boy". Agree with them or you're a "Trump worshipper".


To be fair, I found the above statement not entirely factual. Almost every post I see from the same person is criticism against Trump critics. Please give an example of a post that shows his agreement with points made by Trump critics.
#15062807
Patrickov wrote:To be fair, I found the above statement not entirely factual. Almost every post I see from the same person is criticism against Trump critics. Please give an example of a post that shows his agreement with points made by Trump critics.


Permit me to explain: The "never Trumpers" here make up bullshit. They'll say that Trump is suffering dementia and then fail to support that statement. THAT'S what I take issue with. If you say something, have the balls to back it up with facts.

I don;t agree with the point made by Trump critics here simply because those points tend to be either lies or emotional outbursts. I have my criticisms of Trump, and I honestly couldn't care less if you find my statement "entirely factual". Unlike many liberals here, I don't lie.
#15062809
Indy wrote:
Do you think the videos are doctored or fake?

The point I was making was that Biden's mind is slipping. What the fuck is he doing talking about how he loves having little kids jump on his lap and rub his legs during a campaign stop?

It's laughable that anyone could view Biden's videos and conclude that Trump is the one suffering dementia.


Frankly yes, as far as I know political advertisements in the United States master in smearing people. To put it in perspective, I believe there are tons against Trump as well.

The last video clearly shows Biden giving a speech with a bunch of kids. Talking too seriously for the whole length would be super-boring. Videoing him loosen up a bit for just a minute or so is not sufficient to prove the point that he is suffering dementia, although I do agree that he is too old as well -- as I said, he better find some good person as his running mate.

One more thing: Biden suffering dementia is not a proof that Trump isn't.

I wonder why can't people be more direct when they present their points?
#15062813
Indy wrote:I don;t agree with the point made by Trump critics here simply because those points tend to be either lies or emotional outbursts. I have my criticisms of Trump, and I honestly couldn't care less if you find my statement "entirely factual". Unlike many liberals here, I don't lie.


Not intentionally lying maybe, but sometimes certain shared material may suggest that the sharer has believed some lies told by others.
#15062814
Patrickov wrote:Frankly yes, as far as I know political advertisements in the United States master in smearing people. To put it in perspective, I believe there are tons against Trump as well.


Those weren't political advertisements. Those were news clips.

The last video clearly shows Biden giving a speech with a bunch of kids. Talking too seriously for the whole length would be super-boring. Videoing him loosen up a bit for just a minute or so is not sufficient to prove the point that he is suffering dementia, although I do agree that he is too old as well -- as I said, he better find some good person as his running mate.


He's talking about kids rubbing his legs and how he loves when kids jump in his lap. If he wasn't running for President he'd have a restraining order against him.

One more thing: Biden suffering dementia is not a proof that Trump isn't.


Quite true.

But it's interesting, don't you think, that the ones who are saying Trump is suffering from dementia mention nothing of the fact that Biden doesn't even know what state he's in.
#15062829
Indy wrote:
Those weren't political advertisements. Those were news clips.


The last video is obviously a political advertisement (or more frankly, a smearing video) edited from a news clip that probably does not have such intention.

I admit I did not click the second because I saw it is from Fox News.



Indy wrote:He's talking about kids rubbing his legs and how he loves when kids jump in his lap. If he wasn't running for President he'd have a restraining order against him.


He has kids himself so it is possible he's just summarising what he did when his kids were small, or what he did with his grandkids recently (if he has, that is).

The video is taking it too "seriously" IMHO. And as I said, the video clearly is a biased political advertisement.


Indy wrote:But it's interesting, don't you think, that the ones who are saying Trump is suffering from dementia mention nothing of the fact that Biden doesn't even know what state he's in.


To be fair it is far too early to say who is gonna make it among the Democrats, so there is little point assuming certain one is to be up against Trump in the general election.

On the other hand Trump seems not going to have competitions among Republicans. If he's removed and Pence rolls up then there's even smaller possibility that someone will challenge him.

By the way, if Trump, by any wicked chance, got removed, is that Pence would still be able to run twice, thus theorectically can be president for more than 8 years?
#15062842
Indy wrote:

Well, if testing hasn't been done, then there's no way to intelligently state that he's "clearly in decline".

How about Joe Biden?

Trump's gaffe's pale in comparison. Anyone who thinks Biden is a preferable choice to Trump should have their head examined.



You can compare video of Trump between now and 10 or 20 years ago. He struggles to remember words any adult should know. His discourse is astonishingly simple for someone in a responsible position.

Biden's not as bad, but I agree for the most part. His best days are behind him.

Speaking of facts, 3 polls of presidential historians have put Trump at the bottom of the heap: worst ever. Biden knows how a White House works, and wouldn't try to run the country by tweet.

I can understand, if you haven't studied history, but that is a freak show. You have to go back to Woodrow Wilson in a coma (his wife was running the country) to find something as wacko as this.
#15062843
Patrickov wrote:
IMHO it is a perception partly based on an unwillingness to accept that there can be people who can simultaneously dislike Trump critics while not actually supporting Trump.

In more extreme cases, it is even possible to have some American voters who exclusively express hatred towards Trump critics, but still not voting Trump or Republicans during the general election.



That has been a constant since Reagan. I've seen a ton of Republicans that won't admit to whatever's controversial that day. Put a few beers in them, and the truth comes out.
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