[Pants-of-dog]

Cops talk about how awesome it is that they cancelled a teacher at a college:
https://www.lawenforcementtoday.com/pro ... ets-fired/

Professor cancelled for supporting AntiFa:
https://reason.com/2019/08/26/antifa-pr ... -kirkwood/

[skinster]

Wrong cancellation victims, PoD. Only people who support the U.S. state or Zionism can be victims of cancellation. People opposed to fascism or Palestinian oppression don't count.

[wat0n]

Since when cancellation and snowflakism are exclusive purviews of the left?

[skinster]

Glenn Greenwald has been going on the attack of the OP letter since we found out that some of the signatories refused to have him sign on to the letter for his own political opinions, showing what hypocrites they are. This podcast is great.

[Rancid]

@wat0n
Still, kind of back to my original point about leaders.

I think a movement that has strong leaders would be able to put a damper on the moral grandstanding, and remind everyone to focus on the cause rather than themselves.

[skinster]

@Rancid, can you name one person we might know that you were speaking about?

[Rancid]

Since when cancellation and snowflakism are exclusive purviews of the left?

Agree 100%. The problem is, the people that engage in this behavior (right or left) don't understand/see this. Hence why they think that pointing out a wrong on the right/left, justifies a wrong on the left/right (notice I swapped left and right the second time). People like this don't understand the basic saying that two wrongs don't make a right.

Though, I think your article kind of points this out, that moral grandstanding isn't unique to left or right, but it is a characteristic of both the extreme left and extreme right.

Ultimately, I think it's those of us that are in the middle and more level headed that need to speak out against the extremism on both sides. We also have to be careful to not let them drag us into their bullshit. Another characteristic of these people (left or write) is that "if you are not with us, you are against us". That doesn't work. It just inflames and alienates.

@Rancid, can you name one person we might know that you were speaking about?

Proving anything to you is futile. I could give you 1000 examples, and you would not accept it. It's very easy to find if you know how to think objectively, you can even find it in your own re-tweets even. You can find it in right wingers and left wingers, if you just really open you mind a bit.

Ultimately, you need to introspect, and think more critically about your own beliefs, and your own logic, and you own posting style. I cannot do that for you. You spend too much time looking outwards at others, and not enough inwards.

[Pants-of-dog]

Getting fired for reporting sexual harassment:
https://www.youngwomenstrust.org/what_w ... harassment

[wat0n]

@wat0n
Still, kind of back to my original point about leaders.

I think a movement that has strong leaders would be able to put a damper on the moral grandstanding, and remind everyone to focus on the cause rather than themselves.

I agree, but I also think that moral grandstanders can be tactically useful for those leaders since they help to keep people mobilized. I honestly don't know how will the West (this is not exclusive to the US in the slightest) will get out of this peacefully.

Another issue is that there also seems to be a problem with having strong leaders to begin with, and in the US there is also something odd going on with the renewal of political leadership in general - I am not sure why is it that the 3 leading Presidential candidates (Trump, Biden, Bernie) are all 70+ years old. I haven't lived for long enough in the US to understand that, but it's probably the symptom of something else that may or may not be related to moral grandstanding and cancel culture in general.

[Pants-of-dog]

Why is it described as a culture?

[Rancid]

I agree, but I also think that moral grandstanders can be tactically useful for those leaders since they help to keep people mobilized. I honestly don't know how will the West (this is not exclusive to the US in the slightest) will get out of this.

I agree, that can be useful to a particular cause, but dangerous left to their own devices. I think we will get out of it, two ways mainly:

- fatigue, being polarized on anything is simply emotionally exhausting. People will just get tired of hating.
- Those of us that are more level headed will finally speak up more. IRL, I find myself speaking up a little more, because I'm just tired of the "off with their heads", "if you not with us, you're against just", bullshit.

Maybe that optimism is unfounded, dunno.

Another issue is that there also seems to be a problem with having strong leaders to begin with, and in the US there is also something odd going on with the renewal of political leadership in general - I am not sure why is it that the 3 leading Presidential candidates (Trump, Biden, Bernie) are all 70+ years old. I haven't lived for long enough in the US to understand that, but it's probably the symptom of something else that may or may not be related to moral grandstanding and cancel culture in general.

Yea... I have no clue...

[Rancid]

Why is it described as a culture?

Without looking up a formal definition. It's basically a shared system/phylosophy of values & beliefs/ideas. It's often deeply intertwined with the shared history of the people that belong or identify with the given culture.

Something like that, anyway.

EDIT:
I didn't answer the question, sorry.

So basically, cancel culture are people that participate in calling out for firing people for their misdeeds. Often it is justified, and often it's not. The problem is, that we've gone too far with it, as there are cases where it's just not justified, and ultimately hurts the over all cause of promoting inclusion and diversity.

Their shared culture is the shared belief that they have to call for the firing and destruction of the lives of everyone that fucks up. Cancel culture is about judging people on their worst mistake for the rest of their life. Not too different on how we handle the prison system and people that get arrested. really. Ironic, isn't it?

[skinster]

Proving anything to you is futile. I could give you 1000 examples, and you would not accept it. It's very easy to find if you know how to think objectively, you can even find it in your own re-tweets even. You can find it in right wingers and left wingers, if you just really open you mind a bit.

Ultimately, you need to introspect, and think more critically about your own beliefs, and your own logic, and you own posting style. I cannot do that for you. You spend too much time looking outwards at others, and not enough inwards.

I didn't ask for 1000 examples, maybe just one or two, so I know who you were talking about, since your entire post was vague in its complaints about BLM, people you think are SJWs, trans rights activists etc. If you can't share a single example, that says more about you than it does about me.

[Rancid]

maybe just one

Already gave one example in my first post. WHy do you need everything spoon fed to you?

[skinster]

Who is that person? You just mentioned groups of people. You can type the above and not type their name again?

So basically, cancel culture are people that participate in calling out for firing people for their misdeeds. Often it is justified, and often it's not.

When is it justified?

Does the case of Bari Weiss being a signatory of the OP letter seem justified to you? Since she spent her earlier years trying to cancel professors and journalists for their politics? Or do you think she's a hypocrite?

[Rancid]

When is it justified?

The cops that killed George Floyd is an example of where it's justified. Clearly that cop is a monster, and the other cops are cowards. Why do you need help with this? What are on about?

Anyway, a case where it's not justified would be my opening example with my alma mater.

[Rancid]

Or do you think she's a hypocrite?

If that's true, then yes, that's kind of the definition of a hypocrite no? Are you really this dumb?

[skinster]

No, I'm not dumb, but I do read threads when I get into them. If you read this one, you would see I am opposed to Bari Weiss and her hypocrisy, whereas wat0n thinks she's a victim.

Being called dumb by someone like you is hilarious though.

The cops that killed George Floyd is an example of where it's justified. Clearly that cop is a monster, and the other cops are cowards. Why do you need help with this? What are on about? :?:

Did you read the OP? It's not about cop-killers.

I was asking you for examples in the groups you were talking shit on, such as BLM, SJW, trans-rights activists etc. - you were referring to them without giving an example of a single one of them from any of the three groups. If you have no example, you can say 'I was talking shite' and move on.

[wat0n]

If that's true, then yes, that's kind of the definition of a hypocrite no? Are you really this dumb?

Indeed, Bari Weiss is undoubtedly hypocritical, since she has been a canceller herself. So are those who just choose to disregard what she says about the workplace harassment she claims in her letter while automatically believing in the alleged or real victims in other cases.

But it's not surprising people like @skinster somehow can't understand that hypocrisy can be happening across the board.

[skinster]

Indeed, Bari Weiss is undoubtedly hypocritical, since she has been a canceller herself. So are those who just choose to disregard what she says about the workplace harassment she claims in her letter while automatically believing in the alleged or real victims in other cases.

Twat0n takes serial-harrasser and victim-extraordinaire Bari Weiss' words as fact.