[B0ycey]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56285087

Only in Tory wonderland. You clap them, admire them and call them vital. And then you reward them 1% as a pay rise.

BoJo promoted this virus as the biggy and the days of bitchslapping the NHS are over now. This is going to be a booming outcry and the u-turn is going to be spellbounding.

[Rancid]

Sounds like the UK treats its healthcare workers like the US treats its teachers.

[B0ycey]

Sounds like the UK treats its healthcare workers like the US treats its teachers.

Indeed. But compared to the private sector, they are paid handsomely. Care workers looking after dementia and learning difficulties patients are on minimum wage and won't even see 1% because care homes here are private.

But I digest, it isn't about the pay rise because that would just go out of the NHS budget in any case. It is thar our covid response was too expensive and now they are trying to balance the books so cannot increase the NHS budget. But it is hypocritical considering what the government have been saying and frankly insulting to nurses. The government after all have been the cause of our hysteria and now they will not get away with bitchslapping the NHS.

[Beren]

The NHS will be privatised sooner or later.

[skinster]

The NHS is already privatised to some degree.

There have been protests in a few cities over the last week. I hope they continue.

[Rancid]

The NHS will be privatised sooner or later.

Get ready for sky high medical bills!

[ness31]

I read a book recently and it was from the POV of an ex NHS doctor. After I was done, I understood why they love life when they emigrate down under.

[Politics_Observer]

@Rancid

Yeah, that's what I was about to say, if they privatize the NHS be ready pay outrageous amounts of money for simple procedures. What is the reason behind privatizing the NHS? Is it because the NHS is inefficient or is it because one of the political parties in the UK is trying to underfund it in an attempt to kill it so they can reward their rich donors who want to get in on the private medical insurance business? What is the reality and objective facts here on what is behind the move towards privatizing the NHS? Just because something is being privatized doesn't necessarily mean it is because the private sector can do a better job. Politics can be at play here too. So, I am interested in here the objective facts only and then drawing logical conclusions only from those objective facts.

[Unthinking Majority]

Is 1% even keeping up with inflation for 1 year? lol.

[Politics_Observer]

I will say this about America's healthcare, given the outrageous cost of private insurance and medical bills, it certainly encourages you to take responsibility for your own health.

[B0ycey]

Yeah, that's what I was about to say, if they privatize the NHS be ready pay outrageous amounts of money for simple procedures. What is the reason behind privatizing the NHS?

The UK public won't tolerate the US style privatisation NHS service. Any government that even tried it won't see a single seat in the next election - so it would be the ultimate political suicide. Health is like number one priority for voters here. So it isn't about insurance but contracts. That is the government offer private contracts to make the service more affordable for them in terms of public expenditure. That is what people talk about when the say the NHS is going or becoming privatised. But even so, I agree that when you look into these contracts, profits seem to make the service worse than before for the sake of savings to the government a few pence. So perhaps the argument about privatisation in the UK isn't so much about cost to the populous but service provided.

[B0ycey]

Is 1% even keeping up with inflation for 1 year? lol.

No. Labour call it a pay cut - which it is. The argument is that no other public service is getting 1%, which would be fine normally if you hadn't been clapping all year saying how vital they are. Basically the government have handed a FU after spending a year over playing this crisis. And that is why BoJo is a clown.

[AFAIK]

It's a slap for carers and the billions being spent to upgrade our nuclear arsenal is a further insult.

Right wingers in Europe know that privatising healthcare is a no go so they under fund it in the hope that people will go private rather than wait 6 months for an operation.

[B0ycey]

It's a slap for carers and the billions being spent to upgrade our nuclear arsenal is a further insult.

I have been waiting for someone to start a thread on this. 215 warheads is enough to blow up any nation. Another 80 means fuck all. But even worse than that it is projected to be another £40bn on top of the £205bn to renew Trident, and Scotland may well go independent by the next decade - or in a generation at least. Not only that we have just spend £400bn on covid and we have slashed our aid bill to .5%. Can you imagine if politics was run by sane people how much further our tax might go?

[Puffer Fish]

I agree that NHS is woefully underfunded, but it is also overburdened.

You can't just keep adding more poor people to the population and expect everything to just be fine and operate exactly like before.

People don't THINK about these things. They just take this government service for granted. Like it is some constant of nature that will not change.

Yeah, keep on adding people from other countries and 20 years later just see what the level of service is like THEN !


(In other words, the problem isn't really that the lifeboat is too small, it's that you've added too many people in it)

[Politics_Observer]

@B0ycey

Yeah, here in the U.S. when a private company performs a government service cheaper than the government, it usually means it's because that private company is cutting corners to save a few bucks to turn a profit when offering a service cheaper than what the government is paying. When you cut corners, that could be costly and the government can end up paying a high price later on down the road for relying on private contractors who are cutting corners to try to offer the same service more cheaply. Really, at the end of the day, the government isn't getting the same service at a lower price when you look at it over the longer term. Plus the service might not be as good.

[Unthinking Majority]

It's a slap for carers and the billions being spent to upgrade our nuclear arsenal is a further insult.

Right wingers in Europe know that privatising healthcare is a no go so they under fund it in the hope that people will go private rather than wait 6 months for an operation.

Doesn't explain why leftwingers underfund it also. Maybe for all politicians these things don't buy enough votes.

I like universal government-funded healthcare, but it's inhumane when not funded properly. If you want talented people to become nurses you should pay them well. Nurses are the backbone of the healthcare industry and anyone who has ever been through the system knows that.

[Rancid]

Is 1% even keeping up with inflation for 1 year? lol.

At least in the US, inflation has been about 2% each year since the 2008 crisis. If UK inflation is similar, then it's a pay cut.

[Rancid]

@B0ycey

Yeah, here in the U.S. when a private company performs a government service cheaper than the government, it usually means it's because that private company is cutting corners to save a few bucks to turn a profit when offering a service cheaper than what the government is paying. When you cut corners, that could be costly and the government can end up paying a high price later on down the road for relying on private contractors who are cutting corners to try to offer the same service more cheaply. Really, at the end of the day, the government isn't getting the same service at a lower price when you look at it over the longer term. Plus the service might not be as good.

Although this is true. In some industries the companies overbid like crazy, and the companies make more money than they should be making. THis happens a lot with county and city projects. Mainly because city councils are often full of local business people.

All except 1 of the Austin city council members own more than one property (and are constantly buying/selling)

FIRE THE MALL, pieces of shit.

[Politics_Observer]

@B0ycey

The UK public won't tolerate the US style privatisation NHS service. Any government that even tried it won't see a single seat in the next election - so it would be the ultimate political suicide. Health is like number one priority for voters here. So it isn't about insurance but contracts. That is the government offer private contracts to make the service more affordable for them in terms of public expenditure. That is what people talk about when the say the NHS is going or becoming privatised. But even so, I agree that when you look into these contracts, profits seem to make the service worse than before for the sake of savings to the government a few pence. So perhaps the argument about privatisation in the UK isn't so much about cost to the populous but service provided.

The next question is why is this happening? Is it because the government is not allocating the tax dollars properly or is it because the taxpayers aren't paying enough in taxes to pay for it? Or is it that the taxpayers are paying enough money for it, tax dollars are being allocated to the NHS but are being spent unwisely on private contractors who are unable to provide acceptable service?