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By noemon
#15212380
Telegraph wrote:
Putin is close to winning in Ukraine

Markets bet a Western sell-out on Mr Putin’s terms is the most likely outcome

Russia has amassed foreign exchange reserves of $635bn, the fifth highest in the world and rising. It has a national debt of 18pc of GDP, the sixth lowest in the world, and falling.

The country has cleaned up the banking system and has a well-run floating currency that lets the economy roll with the punches.

It has a budget surplus and does not rely on foreign investors to cover government spending. It has slashed its dependency on oil state revenues. The fiscal break-even cost of a barrel of oil fell to $52 last year, down from $115 before the invasion of Crimea in 2014.

It is the paradox of Vladimir Putin’s tenure that he runs one of the most orthodox policy regimes on the planet. “The macroeconomic team at the central bank and the treasury are exemplary,” said Christpher Granville from TS Lombard.

Mr Putin’s tight ship is a striking contrast to the prodigal socio-economic systems of the West, where money rains from helicopters and fiscal dominance prevails. “He is extremely conservative and rails against the dangers of debt,” said Chris Weafer from Macro-Advisory in Moscow.

The commodity boom is adding an extra $10bn a month to Kremlin coffers from oil and gas. It is being squirrelled away in the National Wellbeing Fund.

This rainy day reserve can be tapped as needed to cover social spending: pensions, child care, fertility bonuses for families, and mortgage subsidies for first-time buyers – components of Mr Putin’s levelling-up strategy for the 2020s.

The Kremlin could sever all gas flows to Europe – 41pc of the EU’s supply – for two years or more without running into serious financial buffers.

The West talks of “devastating” sanctions if Mr Putin invades Ukraine. Tuesday is the turn of German Chancellor Olaf Scholz to repeat the warnings in Moscow, meekly in his case. There is theatre to this ritual, at best wishful thinking, at times masking economic self-interest.

The harsher truth was summed up by Russia’s ambassador to Sweden. “Excuse my language, but we couldn’t give a shit about western sanctions,” he told the Aftonbladet newspaper.

Washington says it will inflict much harsher punishment than in 2014, starting at the top of the escalation ladder. The Kremlin may already have calculated – accurately in my view – that the impact will in fact be less.

Post-Crimean sanctions coincided with a secular commodity bust, the main reason why Russian real disposable incomes were to slide by 12pc. This time they coincide with a secular commodity boom.


Russia today has a semi-autarkic economy, and its chief trade partner is China. The copious document signed by Mr Putin and Xi Jinping at the Beijing Winter Olympics – Entering a New Global Era – establishes a de facto authoritarian alliance.

We should take the rhetoric with a pinch of salt. They remain two scorpions in a bottle, as amorous as Ribbentrop-Molotov lovers. But right now China has Russia’s back against the West, and this renders it impossible to enforce meaningful sanctions.

The Kremlin knows that Europe has vetoed the expulsion of Russia from the SWIFT network of international payments. “The West has to do something to save face but we expect nothing more than sanctions on two or three large Russian banks.

That would be disruptive but Russians are used to this. The only sanctions that would have any real impact is to try to kick Russia out of the global financial system altogether,” said Mr Granville.

“Obviously Russia would grow faster if it were integrated into Western supply chains but in a sense the damage has already happened since Crimea. Further measures would be more of the same,” he said.

It is clear that there will be no blockade of Russia’s energy nexus. Germany’s gas dependence is so total that Mr Scholz still cannot bring himself to state unequivocally that the Nord Stream 2 pipeline should be shelved after a full-blown invasion.

Whatever is done requires the unanimity of all 27 states and will therefore gravitate to the lowest common denominator.

“Europe can’t do without Russian energy, and it has nowhere else to turn. This is not just about gas: there are oil pipelines, as well as 2.5m barrels a day of refined products like aviation fuel and diesel,” said Macro-Advisory’s Mr Weafer.

Deliveries of liquefied natural gas, mostly from the US, have slowed the depletion rate of Europe’s gas reserves over the last month, with the help of mild weather.

But they are uncomfortably low – Austria (19pc), The Netherlands (24pc), France (28pc) – and global LNG capacity is stretched to the limits. A total Kremlin cut-off would bring Europe to its knees within weeks.

The White House thinks Mr Putin cannot achieve his $400bn investment plan to diversify the economy over the next decade without Western technology, but China can plug many gaps, and there is no chance of sustaining a hermetically sealed sanctions regime at global scale.


Mr Putin has an unrepeatable chance to smash the post-Cold War settlement and reassert Russian dominance over its near abroad. Nothing on the current menu of sanctions will alter his calculus.

If he steps back from an invasion over coming days it will be for one of two reasons. The first is that the US & Britain have shipped weapons to Ukraine that are sufficiently sophisticated to move the needle: anti-tank and anti-aircraft missiles.

Nato’s Eastern European states have held firm. The US and the UK have mobilised their cyberwarfare capability on behalf of the alliance. Washington has made it clear that it will support a guerrilla insurgency to raise the tariff of military occupation.

Mr Putin has to weigh the risk that Ukraine's battle-hardened reservists might put up stiffer resistance than expected and that a lightning strike on Kyiv might prove harder than it looks.

Almost nothing that core Europe is now doing has any bearing on this. The EU failed to heed the lesson of Russia’s seizure of Georgian territory in 2008. It continued disarming even as Russia armed further. It spent a decade obsessing over institutional architecture, and then trying to save monetary union from its own contradictions.

It lost sight of the greater strategic imperative during the European debt crisis, when states slashed spending on modern weaponry to meet arbitrary and pro-cyclical austerity targets. These were enormous errors of statecraft.

The other reason why Mr Putin may desist is if Germany and France have promised behind closed doors to give him what he wants without a war: Ukraine on a platter, stripped of sovereignty and locked into Moscow’s strategic orbit. To call it Finlandisation is a euphemism. It is closer to Russification.

We will find out soon enough what has been going on in these private sessions but it was revealing to see the ashen face and involuntary wince of Ukraine’s Volodymyr Zelensky as the German Chancellor spoke in Kyiv.

Mr Scholz did indeed seem to be pulling the rug from underneath his feet, deflating Ukraine’s hope of genuine independence with the soft-spoken words and careful precision of an employment lawyer, the Chancellor’s former job.

Markets are implicitly betting that a Western sell-out on Mr Putin’s terms is the likely outcome, and that Ukraine will be pressured into "voluntary" realignment – like the Czechs in 1938 – allowing business to continue as usual.

Utter cynicism is usually the safest bet.
#15212381
Russian economy wiki:

The economy of Russia is a mixed economy,[30] with enormous natural resources, particularly oil and natural gas.[31] It is the fifth-largest economy in Europe, the world's eleventh-largest economy by nominal GDP, and the sixth-largest by PPP.

Russia's vast geography is an important determinant of its economic activity, with some sources estimating that the nation contains over 30% of the world's natural resources.[32][33][34] In 2016, the oil-and-gas sector accounted for 36% of federal budget revenues.[35] Russia has been widely described as an energy superpower;[36] as it has the world's largest natural gas reserves,[37] the second-largest coal reserves,[38] the eighth-largest oil reserves,[39] and the largest oil shale reserves in Europe.[40] It is the world's leading natural gas exporter,[41] the second-largest natural gas producer,[42] and the second-largest oil exporter,[43] and producer.[44] Russia's foreign exchange reserves are the world's fifth-largest.[45] It has a labour force of roughly 70 million people, which is the world's sixth-largest.[46] Russia's large automotive industry ranks as the world's tenth-largest by production.[47] It has a large and sophisticated arms industry, capable of designing and manufacturing high-tech military equipment, and is the world's second-largest exporter of arms.[48] Russia also has the world's fifth-largest number of billionaires.[49]

Russia is the world's fourteenth-largest exporter.[50] In 2019, the Natural Resources and Environment Ministry estimated the value of natural resources to 60% of the country's GDP.[51] Russia has one of the lowest external debts among major economies,[52] and ranked high among the "very easy" countries in the Ease of Doing Business Index.[53] It has a flat tax rate of 13%, and has the world's second-most attractive personal tax system for single managers after the United Arab Emirates.[54] However, inequality of household income and wealth in the country has also been noted.[55][56][57]


No debt, no deficit, flat low taxes, second in the world in ease of doing business, 30% of the world's natural resources, the largest country in the world + high-end military & science.

If the west were to integrate Russia in its supply chains it would quickly become the most powerful economy in the world.

If the west does not reduce its debt, deficit and does not secure energy autarky, it will enter a period of depression with spiraling deflation and collective misery. This has already started and Covid-19 was the shooting gun.
By late
#15212382
In the short term, there's a good chance they are correct. I've even seen hints about Ukraine accepting some sort of concession.

The long term picture is quite different. Russia is immense, yet has an economy smaller than Italy. Their per capita income is low. The investment climate is not good.

Their money comes from petroleum. The sheik of SA once said that the Saudi came from tents to palaces, and will go back to tents when the oil runs out.

One last thing, Putin is a tactical thinker, not strategic. His moves are often quite strong. But it's likely they will breed resistance, just as Europe weaned itself off OPEC back in the old days.

We're in the early years of the transformation of the energy economy. As electric vehicles of all sorts proliferate, the lack of demand will push oil prices down. War and disease are keeping them somewhat high, but neither is likely to last.

One more 'last' thing. One option the West has is to use cruise missiles and drones to destroy military hardware. Putin would have to embrace large deficits to rebuild his military. While this is not likely, the more he does his bully routine, the closer the world gets to putting him in his place.
User avatar
By noemon
#15212383
Russia is the 11th largest economy despite being cut-off from western supply-chains.

The idea that Russia is economically weak is old & anachronistic.
By late
#15212384
noemon wrote:
Russia is the 11th largest economy despite being cut-off from western supply-chains.

The idea that Russia is economically weak is old & anachronistic.



I didn't say it was weak, I was saying it's a petroleum economy.

It's often called the Curse of Oil.

Before all this craziness, oil prices were low. Do you remember when crude prices went negative? Prob not, and it doesn't matter, commodity markets can get crazy.

But the long term trend was lowering crude oil prices, and I expect we will get back to that, eventually.
#15212386
late wrote:It's often called the Curse of Oil.


I would amend this to say the curse of resource riches.

There is a strong correlation between a nation being resource rich and being corrupt. Lots of research on this topic, but what happens is basically the government and business elites enrich themselves by controlling all the resources, and leave little for the common person.
#15212403
@noemon

I got to disagree with you on the part where you said the Ukrainian crisis is a win for Russia. I don't see how that is the case. The Ukrainian crisis was a big mistake for the Russians. Putin has certainly made NATO more united and I think he underestimated NATO and Biden in this crisis.

However, besides the current crisis, Russia does have vast natural resources and a lot of great talent in science and engineering. Russia certainly has great potential. But, that doesn't mean anything if Russia doesn't crack down effectively on corruption in it's country. Corruption, is what causes a great deal of problems for Russia in developing it's economy.

A lot of Russians here in the United States complain about the fact that Russia has low wages. Corruption plays a big part in this, plus spending too much on the military that their economy can't really afford at this point. Ultimately, if Russia wants to be strong again, it will have to make a serious effort to crack down on corruption and a serious effort in developing it's economy.

Russia should be encouraging strong foreign investment in it's economy. But, in order to do so, that means they need to crack down on corruption. Otherwise, foreign investors will see investing in Russia as too risky.
User avatar
By noemon
#15212405
NATO has not unified any more than before, nor anything substantial has changed on the western front. He has exposed western disunity once again as well as exposed several other holes and leaks.

He has extracted the Finlandisation of the Ukraine and created an atmosphere where we should be thankful for him not invading thus changing the goalposts.
#15212406
@noemon

He hasn't invaded, not because it is out of the kindness of his heart, but because of the targeted economic sanctions he and his circle of elites would be hit with. Plus, the fact that NATO this time around was more united changed his calculus. But he still might invade. If he invades, he is going to do great damage to Russia's standing in the world and he could very well find himself in a costly and protracted partisan war funded by the West while his troops occupy a hostile Ukraine.

He could also just take a Russia friendly piece of Ukraine without taking parts of Ukraine that would be hostile to a Russian occupation. If he did, the occupation of that part of Ukraine would not be too costly for him, but he and his inner circle would suffer some pretty severe sanctions from what I am understanding in news reports.
#15212428
Putin may want to expand Russia to include Ukrainians because Russia’s own population is declining. Russia’s population declined by 997,000 between October 2020 and September 2021, largely due to COVID-19. Despite the Kremlin’s efforts to increase the birth rate, a 2019 government report said Russia’s population could drop by more than 12 million by 2035. Russia’s total population of about 145 million is lower than it was when Vladimir Putin first came to power in 2000.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/13/russias-population-undergoes-largest-ever-peacetime-decline
#15212429
lol If you believe "Putin didn't invade because of sanctions" you're insane. It would be a huge fuck up for Putin to invade Ukraine and it's obvious to anyone thinking that Putin has other levers to pull to influence Ukraine. I think the UK and US harping about imminent invasion is just a way for them to sell a bunch of weapons/guaranteed loans to Ukraine AND as a face saving move when Putin obviously doesn't invade where they can take credit for stopping something that wasn't going to happen by their incessant talking about it. They literally just did the latter with the bullshit false flag they talked about.

Noemon is right, NATO doesn't look more unified at all. Germany obviously wants Nordstream 2 and to stop paying 5xs as much for gas and doesn't give a fuck about anything else. I'd bet that Ukraine is forever doomed to be pulled back and forth by Russia and NATO with the various Ukrainian oligarchs switching sides depending on their interests and watching the standard of living of the average person decrease further.
By Rich
#15212431
We need to take a strong stand against Putin and tell him he mustn't cross the Dnieper (in Ukraine). Also he should stay out of Kyiv oblast.
User avatar
By Fasces
#15212437
Red_Army wrote:lol If you believe "Putin didn't invade because of sanctions" you're insane.


Especially because... what sanctions? They're easily avoided.

The number one thing the West could do to shut down the Russian kleptocracy is stop SWIFT transfers, and they refuse to do it because it'd hurt their bottom line - and Ukraine does not justify a couple million off their bottom line, to them.
User avatar
By Rancid
#15212443
Red_Army wrote:Putin has other levers to pull to influence Ukraine


His other levers have failed. His cyber war fare and misinformation campaigns to try and turn Ukraine into Belarus have largely failed. This is part of the reason for this tantrum he's throwing. At the same time, he can certainly continue to pull those levers until he gets a "hit". He only has to get it right once after all.

That said, I agree with you and others that I suspect there will not be an invasion.
#15212446
As things stand, it's highly unlikely that Russia invades anything unless the Russian command structure is compromised. Too much to lose with uncertain gains, plunging into the great unknown when you can simply wait until your enemies tire and give in. The buildup of forces surrounding Ukraine is a provocation but mostly power projection aimed at securing concessions in the negotiations.

Russia and Putin learned a hard lesson in the 90's about being dependent on outside actors and have insulated themselves from being blackmailed to the table. When the pro-West Ukrainian president Viktor Yushchenko was elected in 2004, running on a platform of Ukraine joining the EU and NATO, Russia suddenly demanded that Ukraine pay the same rates for oil and gas as Western European states. Energy prices skyrocketed and deliveries were cut on occasion in 2006 and 2009, paving the way for pro-Russian president Viktor Yanukovych. With the new administration prices were lowered to stabilize the new government.

So I guess economic sanctions can achieve desired political events but only if the target is in a dependent state. Russia today with their pivot towards China is not in that position.

Pipeline Politics: Russian Energy Sanctions and the 2010 Ukrainian Elections
#15212465
Rancid wrote:His other levers have failed. His cyber war fare and misinformation campaigns to try and turn Ukraine into Belarus have largely failed. This is part of the reason for this tantrum he's throwing. At the same time, he can certainly continue to pull those levers until he gets a "hit". He only has to get it right once after all.

That said, I agree with you and others that I suspect there will not be an invasion.


Largely failed? You haven't seen the cyber warfare and misinformation campaigns even begin. You act like everything is settled as of your post. Just like the row over the bridge in Canada. It's not over. Have you been keeping up on the news? He's running refugees from north Africa into Europe through Belarus to destabilize Europe. Has been for quite a while now.

I have no idea if there will be an invasion or not.

Because our position on so many fronts has been weakened, you want to call it a tantrum. It's a serious threat. What's next? Poland? Or China moving on Taiwan? Please don't diminish the importance of all manners of SHTF because you want to get ahead of another possible shoe dropping. You sound like the incompetents in the White House. Yeah, no big deal here. If we win, we win. If we lose, we win. Huh??

He's playing chess and we're playing idiocracy. No, I'm not saying that b/c I hate America or the Biden administration. I'm saying it b/c it's true, unfortunately.
User avatar
By Rancid
#15212471
BlutoSays wrote:You act like everything is settled


It's not settled. Nothing ever really is.

To be more clear, his efforts to turn Ukraine into another Belarus have failed thus far. Which is part of the reason he's getting aggressive.
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