Ukraine: 50,000 maimed Ukrainians - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

Wandering the information superhighway, he came upon the last refuge of civilization, PoFo, the only forum on the internet ...

All general discussion about politics that doesn't belong in any of the other forums.

Moderator: PoFo Political Circus Mods

#15282504
YIKES !!!!!!!!!

German link: https://www.wsws.org/de/articles/2023/0 ... s-a04.html

Translation (DeepL):
On Tuesday, the Wall Street Journal published an article describing the mass scale of injuries among Ukrainian soldiers, which is frightening.

The article stated that 50,000 or more Ukrainians have been amputated. It cites data from the German company Ottobock, the world's largest manufacturer of prosthetic limbs. [...]

The article says: "67,000 Germans and 41,000 Britons had to undergo amputations during the First World War, when the procedure was often the only way to prevent death."

The number of Ukrainian soldiers killed in this war is one of the best-kept secrets of the conflict. [...]

During the First World War, 880,000 British soldiers died, or 12.5 per cent of the country's deployed soldiers. If amputations among Ukrainian soldiers dwarf those in the UK during the First World War - when this procedure was far more common than today - it means that the death toll among Ukrainians is in the hundreds of thousands.

[...]

Julian Borger admits in the Guardian: "Hopes for a quick breakthrough proved too optimistic in the face of stubborn defences." He continues, "The first casualty of the Ukrainian counter-offensive was wishful thinking. Hopes that Russian troops would abandon their trenches and flee vanished into thin air on the battlefield."


Wtf ? Trenches ?? The ukrainian military hasnt even reached the damn defense lines of the russians yet, and they might never manage to do so.

And if there is ONE thing thats invincible in the west then its wishful thinking and not taking the russians seriously.

They wont take them seriously until the russians have won and will simply dictate terms.




Final part of the article:
Despite their talk of defending "self-determination", the US and the Nato powers see Ukrainians as cannon fodder in their conflict with Russia.The United States has sought to weaken Russia in a bloody war of attrition with the aim - in the words of US President Joe Biden - "to rubble the ruble".This was to be achieved by destroying a whole generation of Ukrainian youth whose lives are being wasted in the name of King Dollar.


I agree with that completely.
#15283588
https://thegrayzone.com/2023/08/15/west ... -amputees/

With Ukrainian forces reportedly suffering a level of amputations reminiscent of WWI, a New York Times proxy war propagandist is spinning amputees as sex symbols and painting their gruesome injuries as “magical.”
:eek:

I am literally lost for words. People who got maimed by WW1 often ended their lifes in suicide. Fortunately we can help cripples nowadays a lot better than back then, but its still not a fate I'd wish to anyone.


On August 1, The Wall Street Journal reported that “between 20,000 and 50,000 Ukrainians” have “lost one or more limbs since the start of the war.”
I'm very glad now because I thought they just wrote 50,000, and only based on a single companies report, suggesting that cripples who use other companies products wouldnt even be included. So its fortunately not as horrible as I though.


The New York Times’ columnist and ardent liberal interventionist Nicholas Kristof practically fetishized the mass disfigurement of Ukrainian combat veterans in the name of Washington’s war du jour.
Saying I resent this person would be an understatement.

And about what else is said here about this, if a woman would only be interested in me if I lose a limb in a war, I definitely wouldnt want that woman.

Okay being 50+, I have a different perspective on romance issues. Younger men might think otherwise, and I wont hold it against them.

By the way, the example image shows a person that hasnt actually lost either arm. They MAY have lost a leg, but its not shown. Reality isnt like this. Its pretty normal that if you get maimed by war you may even lose all four limbs. Its also pretty normal that the part of the human body located near the legs and needed for biological procreation got damaged as well. This image by itself is a propaganda lie, since they dont show the deficiencies they talk about. Losing a leg is the most harmless variant and even that isnt actually shown.


But when reporting on Ukrainian casualties, major news outlets typically refer to the figure as a “closely guarded state secret.”
In other words, they dont care about ukrainians; the ukrainians are just cannon fodder for the glory of the US empire. Otherwise they would at least try to estimate the losses, no ? These are human lifes, after all.

Not to mention that actually the number of losses of the ukrainian side are more important to us western supporters of Ukraine than russian losses, since it shows how good or bad the chances are for Ukraine to archieve their goals.

Its the same pattern as in the war against Saddam Hussein. Independend studies estimated that at very least a million iraqi civilians must have died during the occupation of Iraq by the USA. But we'll never know because the US military didnt bother to count the victims and they've been the only ones in a position to do so.

The US elites dont care how many ukrainians are dying in this war, how much ukrainian soil is lost to Russia, or about the fate of Ukraine. They only care how much Russia gets hurt by this war. Which actually is mostly a negative value. They regained territory, they managed to decouple their economy from the west, and they strengthened their relations with countries that actually respect Russia and value their friendship with Russia, such as China and India, as well as really the undeveloped South as a whole.

So instead of trying to get the best possible estimates of how many ukrainians have lost their lives or got maimed in the war, the western press gives absurd estimates about how many russian soldiers must be dead by now and when you ask about the foundation for these numbers, wellm they are simply wishful thinking. Actually serious estimates of the west like the one conducted by the BBC, based on solid techniques, yield numbers around 30,000 dead for the russian side so far. Which is actually pretty close to what the russians tell us their losses are. But the BBC just cant help but claim that actual losses must certainly be higher. Why ? Again just wishful thinking.


A study this June by the Kyiv International Institute of Sociology which found that 78 percent of Ukrainians have had close relatives or friends injured or killed as a result of the conflict suggests the casualty figures are orders of magnitude greater than those publicly admitted by the Ukrainian military.
:(


Despite the best offers of liberal interventionists like the New York Times’ Nicholas Kristof, who attempted to reframe war amputees as an indicator of Ukrainian fearlessness, rather than unambiguously grim symbols of an utterly catastrophic situation, Western citizens are increasingly repelled by the deluge of pro-war propaganda.
Thats nice, but doesnt help anymore. The west has literally given Ukraine every resource they could possibly give. It wasnt enough, not even by a very long shot. And Ukraine had to engage in absurd military operations to keep the west happy.

Even if you listen to what NATO experts had to say about the ukrainian war very early on, they said that Ukraine should militarily hold the line and focus on negotiations. But the west never allowed Ukraine to do so.

I think Scott Ritter also mentioned that once or twice. Well, technically Ritter is also a NATO expert, I guess.


Markedly, there was “slim backing for US military forces to participate in combat operations” – just 17%.
Fortunately thats not even a remote possibility, since right now, with stockpiles emptied by Ukraine, the USA is in no shape whatsoever to fight an opponent like Russia anyway, and the US military, being aware of the realities of the world much more than the Washington elites, would outright refuse to do such a futile suicide mission.


Since publishing its grim survey of Ukraine’s amputation epidemic, The Wall Street Journal has churned out another depressing read for proxy war boosters. On August 13, the WSJ reported that Kiev’s failure to make headway in its vaunted counteroffensive has forced military planners to look ahead to Spring 2024 for another opportunity that “might” tip the balance.
Arrogance and ignorance. Thats the only two weapons of the west against Russia since the start of the war. Its just amazing how stupid these people are.
#15283592
Maybe the world should be helping to END the war, instead of supplying weapons for it to continue?

I know... It's a controversial take.
#15283593
Just going to say it's remarkable here that people against the US/NATO war against Russia in Ukraine are the only ones concerned about actual Ukrainians being maimed and killed in this war. I have shown in the article above, which @Negotiator commented on, and elsewhere showing the (ongoing) press-ganging going on Ukrainian cities where young men are dragged off the streets of Ukraine and forced to fight on the front lines, where their average shelf-life is about four hours...whereas the likes of the warmongers like John Rawls, Rugoz, Gandalf etc. are all MOOOOOAR WEAPONS, average Ukrainians be damned!

When more weapons it only means more war. The Russians would like the war to be settled sooner, as they have repeatedly stating they do not enjoy fighting a war against their brothers in favour of the the U.S. Empire and NATO. The Russians have, after all, made repeatedly peaceful negotiations with the Ukrainians well before the Ukrainian government started this war (against ethnic-Russians within Ukraine).

Godstud wrote:Maybe the world should be helping to END the war, instead of supplying weapons for it to continue?

I know... It's a controversial take.


Indeed.

Look at this shit. This is inexcusable! >: htt[…]

Harvey Weinstein's conviction, for alleged "r[…]

Israel-Palestinian War 2023

It is pleasurable to see US university students st[…]

World War II Day by Day

April 27, Saturday More women to do German war w[…]