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By CasX
#4735
FRieDPHaNToM wrote:Really? Any proof of that? 30 eurapean nations backing us sounds like not too many disagree with it. And he got booed by OTHER CELEBRETIES! those are the most liberal people there are, and even they thought he was full of it.

Btw: Hi, I'm new here.


Apart from the US, and perhaps Britain (?), I haven't heard of any nation in the world that supports a unilateral strike against Iraq. I mean the people, not the government.

The worst thing is the the US is ignoring the people of the region where the conflict will take place - the Middle East. The arabs are overwhelmingly against the war.

Think of this if you were in their position. Say you live in Brazil. India is drumming up support to attack you for little substantial reasons, but have large commercial interests in your region. Public opinion polls in all the nations of the world are against India attacking you, apart from India. The UN has denounced the proposed invasion and any unilateral strike. India's only allies are Cambodia and Ethiopia, who have joined the Indian side, against the strenous objections of their own people. Everyone in your region denounces the war. Bolivia, Argentina, Paraguay, Colombia, Venezuala etc are all totally opposed to any invasion, as it will further destabilise the region and cause major suffering. It will also only further India's own interests. India, however, against the beliefs of the people in South America decides to launch a war against Brazil, halfway around the globe and over and above the total objection of almost the entire world, especially all South Americans, who the Indians obviously think they know better than, because this is in the interests of Indian 'national security'. India invades you, and gloat over how technologically superior they are to you, and how 'bloodless' the war is, while they bomb your country to smithereens, kill many innocent civilians, and control the media, to make sure the world can see all the happy, smiling Brazilians. No-one sees the dead bodies, the blood, the houses destroyed by 'smart' bombs, and the children who will grow up with no parents because a nation on the other side of the world knows better than the rest of the Earth.

Welcome to the second dimension of the Iraqi war.
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By FriedPhantom
#4740
I'm too lazy to find the links that say that 29 other european nations are for the war, but I do have a letter from a human sheild that disputes your "arabs are strongely opossed to the war."

------------

pulled from the London Telegraph:
I was a naive fool to be a human shield for Saddam
By Daniel Pepper
(Filed: 23/03/2003)

I wanted to join the human shields in Baghdad because it was direct
action which had a chance of bringing the anti-war movement to the
forefront of world attention. It was inspiring: the human shield volunteers
were making a sacrifice for their political views - much more of a
personal investment than going to a demonstration in Washington or London. It
was simple - you get on the bus and you represent yourself.
So that is exactly what I did on the morning of Saturday, January 25. I
am a 23-year-old Jewish-American photographer living in Islington,
north London. I had travelled in the Middle East before: as a student, I
went to the Palestinian West Bank during the intifada. I also went to
Afghanistan as a photographer for Newsweek.
The human shields appealed to my anti-war stance, but by the time I had
left Baghdad five weeks later my views had changed drastically. I
wouldn't say that I was exactly pro-war - no, I am ambivalent - but I have a
strong desire to see Saddam removed.
We on the bus felt that we were sympathetic to the views of the Iraqi
civilians, even though we didn't actually know any. The group was less
interested in standing up for their rights than protesting against the
US and UK governments.
I was shocked when I first met a pro-war Iraqi in Baghdad - a taxi
driver taking me back to my hotel late at night. I explained that I was
American and said, as we shields always did, "Bush bad, war bad, Iraq
good". He looked at me with an expression of incredulity.
As he realised I was serious, he slowed down and started to speak in
broken English about the evils of Saddam's regime. Until then I had only
heard the President spoken of with respect, but now this guy was
telling me how all of Iraq's oil money went into Saddam's pocket and that if
you opposed him politically he would kill your whole family.
It scared the hell out of me. First I was thinking that maybe it was
the secret police trying to trick me but later I got the impression that
he wanted me to help him escape. I felt so bad. I told him: "Listen, I
am just a schmuck from the United States, I am not with the UN, I'm not
with the CIA - I just can't help you."
Of course I had read reports that Iraqis hated Saddam Hussein, but this
was the real thing. Someone had explained it to me face to face. I told
a few journalists who I knew. They said that this sort of thing often
happened - spontaneous, emotional, and secretive outbursts imploring
visitors to free them from Saddam's tyrannical Iraq.
I became increasingly concerned about the way the Iraqi regime was
restricting the movement of the shields, so a few days later I left Baghdad
for Jordan by taxi with five others. Once over the border we felt
comfortable enough to ask our driver what he felt about the regime and the
threat of an aerial bombardment.
"Don't you listen to Powell on Voice of America radio?" he said. "Of
course the Americans don't want to bomb civilians. They want to bomb
government and Saddam's palaces. We want America to bomb Saddam."
We just sat, listening, our mouths open wide. Jake, one of the others,
just kept saying, "Oh my God" as the driver described the horrors of
the regime. Jake was so shocked at how naive he had been. We all were. It
hadn't occurred to anyone that the Iraqis might actually be pro-war.
The driver's most emphatic statement was: "All Iraqi people want this
war." He seemed convinced that civilian casualties would be small; he
had such enormous faith in the American war machine to follow through on
its promises. Certainly more faith than any of us had.
Perhaps the most crushing thing we learned was that most ordinary
Iraqis thought Saddam Hussein had paid us to come to protest in Iraq.
Although we explained that this was categorically not the case, I don't think
he believed us. Later he asked me: "Really, how much did Saddam pay you
to come?"
It hit me on visceral and emotional levels: this was a real portrayal
of Iraq life. After the first conversation, I completely rethought my
view of the Iraqi situation. My understanding changed on intellectual,
emotional, psychological levels. I remembered the experience of seeing
Saddam's egomaniacal portraits everywhere for the past two weeks and
tried to place myself in the shoes of someone who had been subjected to
seeing them every day for the last 20 or so years.
Last Thursday night I went to photograph the anti-war rally in
Parliament Square. Thousands of people were shouting "No war" but without
thinking about the implications for Iraqis. Some of them were drinking,
dancing to Samba music and sparring with the police. It was as if the
protesters were talking about a different country where the ruling
government is perfectly acceptable. It really upset me.
Anyone with half a brain must see that Saddam has to be taken out. It
is extraordinarily ironic that the anti-war protesters are marching to
defend a government which stops its people exercising that freedom."
By CasX
#4741
I could just as easily post an article form the local paper where a guy from NZ who has worked in Iraq - Baghdad - for 10 years says the country is doing well, despite the sanctions imposed upon the average Iraqi. He says that any act of war upon them will further destabilise the region, cause large civilian casualties, and will be of no real benefit the Iraqi people. It will cause only suffering.
By CasX
#4745
Not to mention that it will send terrorist numbers through the roof.
User avatar
By UrbanLandscape
#13461
No evidence still. As for this oversized ass, Michael Moore is the one producing fiction. His latest "documentary" was full of lies, and pretty much everything he says is a lie, or somehow twisted by his disturbed way of thinking.
User avatar
By Demosthenes
#13469
Hey Urban! a Jayhawk, or maybe a Wildcat... Howdy Neighbor! I'm just east of you apparently. As far as Michael Morre, c'mon you guys can hang your hats on somebody better than this... He's a hack at best and a total moron at worst. As for the actors in this country being pro-Bush, pro-USA, etc. I don't know where you base this but Hollywood is notoriously liberal, they may not all be anti-US like some of you are but that doesn't mean they're any less liberal. In fact I can count on one hand the number of actors I've heard come out as being pro-Bush, or at least pro-war, 1)Ahnold Swartzenegger,2) James Woods,3) John Travolta, and 4) Bruce Willis. So to say Hollywood is not liberal is...well quite funny.

As far as this:
Yesterday it was 76%...today it is 70%...tomorrow 60%...what else??? People don't support the war...people say they "support our troops"...NOT the war. When they get it through their fat heads that supporting "our troops" is NOT the same thing as supporting the war...
This is not accurate for most of the country. Maybe you guys don't realize you're talking to a Texan, a Kansian (?), and somebody from the Show-me-state. We know how to take care of business, unlike Hollywood types... :knife: WE DO SUPPORT THE WAR, and the troops, of course.
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