Why are left wing libertarian/classical liberals hated in the Asperger's Syndrome community - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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Classical liberalism. The individual before the state, non-interventionist, free-market based society.
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#14834881
just my belives on how the individual is more important the the sosidty gets me hate then if i go in to how kid should raze them selfs and that people should be more self centered and not family centered thay hate me i also get hate from lgbt people for the same shit i feal like the olny place i can have a legit convo is on 4chan because atlest thay know what i am talking abought but its like every time i try to reach out to any one thats not an outlaw or dose not understand outlaw couture i run in to problems
#14847417
Well, most people will bristle at being told they "should" do something. I think individuals "should" do what fulfills them and makes them happy, and for most of us I think that means being part of a family (which is different than being part of a society). If you want to allow your kids to raise themselves, more power to you. But I don't know that I'd go around telling people that everybody "should" do that.

As an aside, I find "left-wing libertarian" (different than 'classical liberal' although you seem to conflate the two in your thread title) to be somewhat of an oxymoron, so if they're trying to present a libertarian position I'd take it with a large grain of salt.
#14847534
Can I ask what you mean that "kids should raise themselves"? From what age?

As far as I know, these days aspergers is generally understood as a developmental disorder, rather than a problem of attachment to the care-giver. Therefore, an extreme position on separation and individuation may be as alien to people with aspergers as it is to the general population.
#14917751
I have to some degree frequented WrongPlanet.com , and have found that those on the autistic spectrum espouse a wide range of views , which encompasses the entire political spectrum . I actually tend to feel that libertarian socialism might hold a special appeal to autistic persons , as it counterbalances the desire for personal liberty with the longing for social order . Really the only ideology with which there seems to be a mutual disdain , generally speaking at least , would be fascism . In all my life online , I have only encountered about two persons whom claimed to be both fascist , and having Asperger syndrome . One , on WrongPlanet.com , would be "Joker" , and the other calls himself Cody Strasser , and is the significant other of Evalion http://en.rightpedia.info/w/Evalion#2017_Changes . So I feel that this has especially helped to make my mind up for me , in deciding to choose something along the lines of libertarian Marxism , rather than say national anarchism . The neo-fascist third position seems to be over all intolerant towards neurodiversity , deeming autistic people to not fit the mold of the ideal man , and either they do not know , or care that Dr. Hans Asperger had this to say on the matter . http://www.azquotes.com/quote/641004
#14929650
LaDexter wrote:Libertarian socialism is an oxymoron.Libertarian is 180 degrees from socialism.

No, I'm afraid not … there are lots of variables with libertarianism, including classical "left-libertarianism" which is extremely socialistic and anti-capitalism. You're referring (I think) to the Ancap variety, which is extremely right wing.

The thing all libertarian's share is a strong conviction about "personal autonomy."

(welcome to Pofo)

Zam ;)
#14929651
There is no personal autonomy in socialism. The state is in charge of everything.

There is a huge effort to discredit and demonize those who are in favor of smaller/less government. The motives of those doing such are very very bad.

The truth of course is that America's prosperity as a nation is inversely correlated with government spending. When we had no spending increases for 6 straight years in the 1990s, we had a budget surplus and a booming economy. Since then, we have spent like drunken sailors, and we are now $21 trillion in debt, up from $5 trillion when W lied his ass off in his swearing in ceremony.
#14929665
LaDexter wrote:There is no personal autonomy in socialism. The state is in charge of everything.

Never been to Sweden have you ? You have a lot to learn about socialism. Reading is all well and good, but until you've experienced a few things, you should probably stick to asking questions rather than making empirical statements.

Zam
#14929667
Zamuel wrote:Never been to Sweden have you ? You have a lot to learn about socialism. Reading is all well and good, but until you've experienced a few things, you should probably stick to asking questions rather than making empirical statements.

Zam

Sweden isn't really socialist though because private property is not abolished. It's basically capitalism with a very large welfare state on top. High taxes + big state = turbo keynesianism not socialism. Keynes was very much a capitalist.

10 world-shaping Swedish companies
#14929676
SolarCross wrote:Sweden isn't really socialist though because private property is not abolished. It's basically capitalism with a very large welfare state on top.

Sweden is a practical and evolved socialist state. Businesses are controlled by regulation but may remain privately owned or become partners with the government. Markets are also regulated and in some cases subsidized. Taxes are extremely high (though there is no property tax) and it's fair to say that EVERYONE is on welfare. The state maintains a high standard of living for all it's citizens. It's an excellent text book on socialism. Studying it and experiencing it will educate the student in all the facets of socialism and the various modifications that have both succeeded and failed.

Zam :D
#14929677
Zamuel wrote:Sweden is a practical and evolved socialist state. Businesses are controlled by regulation but may remain privately owned or become partners with the government. Markets are also regulated and in some cases subsidized. Taxes are extremely high (though there is no property tax) and it's fair to say that EVERYONE is on welfare. The state maintains a high standard of living for all it's citizens. It's an excellent text book on socialism. Studying it and experiencing it will educate the student in all the facets of socialism and the various modifications that have both succeeded and failed.

Zam :D

Sweden was briefly a socialist state lite, then realised it didn't work, let capitalism happen turned up the taxes, turboed keynes and called it a win.

Controlling business and people though regs is standard keynesian nationalism. Subsidies are the very opposite of socialism because that is a transfer of wealth to the private sector not from it, that is not exactly expropriating the expropriators is it? DOH!

It's not socialism, it is keynesianism, heavy keynesianism but keynesianism all the same. It has more in common with fascism actually than socialism, fascism with a smiley face.

Libertarians and others of the Adam Smith/Hayek/Mises persuasion are apt to slander Sweden as "socialist" but they mean that as an insult the way I might call you an arsehole, if I did that I wouldn't be asserting that you were literally an arsehole only that I wanted to associate you with something ugly and smelly.

There is an ancient debate, a to and fro, back and forth on how much governance is good governance. On one end of the see-saw you have Mercantalism, Bismark, Keynes and Hitler and on the other Adam Smith, Hayek and Mises. The former say a big state is best and the latter say a light state is best. Socialism has basically nothing to do with this debate because socialism is about abolishing humans of their status as human beings and reducing them to ants or cattle. Even the Keynesisans don't go that far at least not for their own people (hitler obviously made exceptions for jews, for the jews he did give them actual socialism).
Last edited by SolarCross on 03 Jul 2018 01:41, edited 3 times in total.
#14929681
SolarCross wrote:Sweden was briefly a socialist state lite, then realised it didn't work,

You're getting closer. Try "they realized they could improve it." So they did. What they have is not really capitalism. The state absorbs the profit and in many instances provides the capital. Workers participate in financial decisions. The states attitude towards it's citizens is not exploitive or coercive, It's best described as "Parental." Economics are only one facet.

Zam 8)
#14929685
Zamuel wrote:You're getting closer. Try "they realized they could improve it." So they did. What they have is not really capitalism. The state absorbs the profit and in many instances provides the capital. Workers participate in financial decisions. The states attitude towards it's citizens is not exploitive or coercive, It's best described as "Parental." Economics are only one facet.

Zam 8)

Face it you don't know what you talking about. If you weren't so vain you'd get it.
#14929692
SolarCross wrote:Face it you don't know what you talking about. If you weren't so vain you'd get it.

"socialism is about abolishing humans of their status as human beings."

Well, I guess that sort of explains your attitude. Surprisingly, the swedes kind of like it.

Zam
#14930001
Decky wrote:Americans are bizarre. The second a capitalist country introduces a welfare state they they think is has magically changed into the Soviet Union. :lol: Belarus is the only socialist state on European soil, Sweden is capitalist.


So unless you are totally Socialist, you default to Capitalist? There are no stages involved in the evolution?
I thought the whole idea was stages. I find the aversion of modern socialism to being attached to USSR efforts bizarre. It is even more bizarre for Communists to not want to take the credit for the acceptance of Socialism.
Maybe just my lack of understanding?

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