[Puffer Fish]

This is part of the so-called "war on cash", with government seeking tighter control over the population and the economy.
If it's paid in cash, government can't track it, so government wants to make it illegal, forcing people to have to use banks or electronic money transfer methods, for any large transaction.

Many Americans would never go along with this. They are too freedom-loving, and distrustful of excessive government control in individual's lives.


The European Council agreed on its position on an "anti-money laundering anti-money regulation" and a new directive (AMLD6) aimed at "protecting EU citizens and the EU’s financial system against terrorist financing." The directive includes a limit on cash payments exceeding €10,000.

The question of limitations on cash payments has been topical in Europe ever since the Global Financial Crisis. Seventeen out of 27 Member States of the European Union already have cash payment limitations, ranging from €500 in Greece to over €14,000 in Poland. With an EU wide-limitation of €10,000, 13 countries would see existing constraints increase.

Greece, France, Spain, Italy, Portugal, and several Eastern European countries currently have the lowest thresholds.

In December 2022, Italy's prime minister Giorgia Meloni proposed to lift the legal limit for cash transactions to €5,000, reversing a pledge by previous Italian governments to cut the limit from €2,000 to €1,000. Meloni also wants to give merchants the right to refuse to accept digital payments for transactions below €60 without fear of penalty.

European Council Agrees on a €10,000 Limit on Cash Payments – Cash Essentials - December 20, 2022
https://cashessentials.org/the-european ... -payments/

In France and Italy, the limit for cash payments is 1000 euros and 3000 euros. Failure to comply with the rules is subject to a fine of 3,000 to 15,000 euros. In these two countries, the primary motivation for these limits is the fight against tax evasion.

The European Commission wants to introduce a limit on cash payments (biteffect.net)

The Netherlands, Belgium, France, Italy and Spain together had petitioned the European Commission to limit the amount an individual can pay in cash within the European Union to 5 thousand euros. They also asked that the 500 euro note be taken out of circulation, caretaker Finance Minister Wopke Hoekstra said in a letter to parliament.
Both these measures are intended to help combat organized crime and money laundering. Cash poses a major risk as it is anonymous and untraceable.
The Netherlands has been calling for a cash limit of 3 thousand euros for some time, but could not find enough support for that amount among other EU Member States.

EU asked to ban cash payments of over €5,000 in money laundering fight | NL Times - September 2021

The Italian government’s draft budget for 2023 will increase the ceiling for cash payments to €5,000 ($5,280), despite criticism from a Bank of Italy official. Under current law, Italians may use cash for payments of up to €2,000, but this ceiling had been set to fall to €1,000 from January 1. The new budget will instead raise that limit.

Italy to allow larger cash payments despite central bank objections - Central Banking - December 9, 2022

[Monti]

The limitation of cash payments is a reduction of FORMAL liberty but not a limitation of FUNDAMENTAL liberty (choice of the way of living: to pay in cash is not a way of living).
It is clear that most cash-payments of more than €10.000 aim at concealing some income to the tax administration, which is punishable in all countries.
If the law prevents you to pay more than 10.000 in cash, do you really suffer? Do you suffer above the psychological inconvenience that nobody likes being told "do not do that"?
And tax evasion does not belong to the Human Rights.

[Puffer Fish]

The limitation of cash payments is a reduction of FORMAL liberty but not a limitation of FUNDAMENTAL liberty (choice of the way of living: to pay in cash is not a way of living).

What this really has to do with is the right to privacy, and not having to give information to government.
(or to maybe be more exact, government putting in place a system making it much more difficult to avoid government getting the information)
Let's remember, these laws don't just apply to money, they also apply to anything of value that is traded. Like gold coin, foreign currency, etc.

I think there are some civil liberties issues.

Imagine for example if no one was able to buy or sell anything without government automatically knowing about it.


Going a little bit more into the philosophical side, when you talk about "fundamental liberty", would you be totally okay with absolutely all powers going into the hands of government, and then people just trust and are made to be completely reliant on government for all their fundamental liberties to be protected?
I think that comes to the core of the issue.

[ingliz]

@Puffer Fish

If you are worried the bank is dobbing you in, put in and take out just under the limit. If what you want to buy is over the limit, pay the vendor a cash deposit and pay the balance in cash the next day. If you are sensible and don't take the piss, the government will be none the wiser.

[JohnRawls]

Banks are more convenient, faster and safer. Also they provide security safeguards regarding money laundering, terrorism and so on. If you have problems with the behavior of some banks then request harder oversight through your democratic process and regulation of banks.

So to all you here:

[Monti]

If my tax inspector can control my payments above €3000 (by bank), I have no problem with that. I know that he does not personally care with what I do. My person does not interest him.
I understand the psychological aspect: but some reflection leads to the conclusion that there is nothing concrete in this fear.
Personally, I am much more troubled by being watched by a series of firms when I surf on Internet, because I do not bear being pressed to buy this or that when I have not asked anyrhing.