President Trump wishes to improve US relations with Russia which is long overdue - Politics Forum.org | PoFo

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#14785067
President Trump wishes to improve US relations with Russia which is long overdue

Article from stephen50right

President Trump wishes to improve US relations with Russia which is long overdue. It's great to see this and makes good sense for both countries.

The United States and Russia fought as allies during World War 2 to defeat Nazi Germany. However after successfully doing that, the relations rapidly soured.

Joseph Stalin was the dictator of Russia who ruled the Soviet Union with an iron fist. When WW2 ended, rather than Stalin bringing his soldiers back to Russia, instead he forcefully occupied a number of European countries. Thus formed the Iron Curtain and began the Cold War. The occupation continued until the breakup of the Soviet Union in 1991.

The breakup of the Soviet Union was a success for the West. The West was considered the winner of the Cold War. Germany which had been split in two was reunited. The other countries under Soviet Union occupation were freed. It was a new beginning for Europe.

However an ongoing diplomatic problem was that too many political leaders in the West handled the success of this win quite badly as the bragging never seemed to end. US president George W Bush was one of those who foolishly bragged.

Russian president Vladimir Putin has ruled Russia since 1999, about the time that Bush was elected US president in 2000 for his first term. While there were substantive meetings between Bush and Putin, Bush would too often condescendingly speak at Putin rather than properly communicating with him. Every chance Bush got, he seemed to spike the football in Putin's face about winning the Cold War, which is an awfully rude way to act towards the leader of Russia.

Russia has a brutal history with Europe going back a number of centuries which includes many wars. Fast forward to WW2, Russia suffered approximately 26 million dead in that war, far more than any other country in the European theater. While Stalin's actions after the war of occupying other countries was despicable, it was understandable considering the horrific carnage that took place in Russia.

Near the end of WW2, the last major battle in Europe was Russia attacking the German capital of Berlin, in which the outcome was a certainty. Russian soldiers overwhelmingly captured Berlin. Considering that the Nazis during the war had tried their "Master Race" best to exterminate every Russian, the conquering Russians could have killed every man, woman, and child in Berlin during that time, and everyone would have understood why.

The fact that vengeful Russian soldiers showed mercy to the Germans in Berlin, proves that Russians are a merciful people. Russia is not evil by any means, like some in the West make them out to be.

Russia does have many nuclear missiles which can destroy the West, but the West has many nuclear missiles which can destroy Russia. So we shouldn't both be pointing fingers at each other as to who is the most evil. Neither the West or Russia is evil.

Bush for some reason didn't fully comprehend all this history, and Barack Hussein Obama didn't comprehend hardly anything at all. It's really not debatable that Obama is by far the worst US president of all time. This assessment is illustrated by the manner in which Obama handled US relations with Russia.

Obama has an irritating tendency of talking down to people, perhaps because of a superiority complex. But putting aside the psychoanalysis of this presidential failure, Obama was the US president and so he did represent America. Putin knew that Obama was a weak, feckless leader. However, Obama as Commander in Chief had his finger on the nuclear button. So Putin had to deal with Obama accordingly, and out of respect for the powerful military of the United States.

Anyone can visualize how Obama's personality must have grossly irritated Putin in their personal meetings and phone conversations. Not that Putin has been an angel. For example his annexation of the Crimea region from Ukraine should not have happened.

In this day and age, the borders and sovereignty of all countries should be acknowledged as etched in stone. Putin did not respect Ukraine's borders, and that disrespect continues. So while this was an issue that needed to be addressed, President Obama as with everything he attempted did not handle it well.

The West should face the fact that Russia is not going to give up Crimea. Russia's ties to Crimea go back centuries and is embodied in the Russian psyche. Most of the people living in Crimea are of Russian ethnicity. While the annexation was horrendous, should many decades be spent threatening each other about it? There is not plausible sense at this point to continue tensions over this and accomplish nothing.

Some believe that sanctions must continue against Russia as punishment for annexing Crimea, and as a warning for Putin not to go any further. The sanctions were understandable, but really not constructive.

A lesson should be learned from World War 1, when harsh sanctions were placed on Germany after the war, and it angered the German people to the point of allowing Adolph Hitler to gain power.

General George Marshall was instrumental in winning WW2 for the Allies. Marshall did learn from that WW1 mistake regarding harsh sanctions. After WW2 as Secretary of State, he organized the Marshall Plan which helped rebuild Germany and made them into a valued American and Western ally. Germany is also a solid member of NATO.

The military alliance of NATO was formed in 1949 to stifle any plan of Stalin to occupy any NATO member country. NATO's key principle is "An attack against one Ally is considered as an attack against all Allies." If any NATO member is attacked by Russia or anyone else, then NATO forces would immediately come to their defense. NATO is still relevant today, and no one with any credibility is talking about disbanding it. Peace through strength is always a vital idea to prevent war.

NATO is armed to the teeth with nuclear weapons. Russia is also armed to the teeth with nuclear weapons. Russia should never invade a NATO country because it would lead to catastrophic events for all. It would be MAD.

MAD is an acronym for Mutual Assured Destruction. In 1945 the US was first to obtain nuclear weapons. Since 1949 when Russia also obtained nuclear weapons, MAD has kept all countries with nuclear weapons from directly attacking each other's country.

The premise of MAD is a suicidal outcome for the attacker. The attacked side would strike back with nuclear weapons and cause similar destruction to the attacker. But even if one side did technically win a nuclear war on the battlefield, the so-called winner would still lose. The radioactive material from a nuclear bomb blast gets carried into the upper atmosphere and dispersed around the world. Then comes down as deadly fallout and poisons the earth for everyone.

Neither the West or Russia wishes for destruction of their society and mankind. MAD must never be activated. Nuclear war simply cannot be allowed to happen. Maybe some day MAD could instead mean Mutual Assured Determination to prevent a nuclear holocaust.

Everyone in Russia including Putin, needs to fully realize that the West has no intention of ever invading their country. Besides the fact that doing so would lead to a MAD scenario, the West truly has no aggressive interest whatsoever in doing harm to Russia. Today's West is a polar opposite of Nazi Germany which believed in Lebensraum.

Lebensraum meaning "living space" was an insidious Nazi concept to justify Germany invading Russia in WW2. It basically inferred that Germany had the inherent right to other country's territory. Fortunately, the Nazi quest for Lebensraum died when Hitler fired a suicide bullet thru his head in 1945.

Unfortunately, Putin still seems to be tinkering with the thought of bringing back part of the Soviet Union, perhaps in the Baltic states and Ukraine. The Baltic states are members of NATO, and NATO will defend to the death the right of the Baltic states to remain free. This is unquestionable, and that resolute point should always be made perfectly clear to Putin or any other Russian leader so that they never attempt to invade.

Ukraine is a questionable situation because they are not part of NATO. But if Putin makes the wise choice, and if the West makes the right overtures, Putin would give up any idea of occupying Ukraine because pursuing this would be detrimental to him and the Russian people.

So now we have Donald Trump as the new US president. Trump doesn't seem to have a condescending bone in his entire body, but that doesn't mean he is weak. Trump is tough, but he is fair and he listens. Unlike Bush and Obama, Trump will listen to and recognize Putin's viewpoints, and that bodes well for possible warm relations.

Half the challenge of nations getting along well is that their leaders sincerely like and respect one another. The likability factor between leaders to achieve positive results is often underrated. Without a doubt Putin respects Trump, and Putin already appears to like him as well. This could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship, and a new era of peace and prosperity between the West and Russia.

The West and Russia should not be enemies or even adversaries in this modern day and age. We can mutually benefit from each other with trade and many other endeavors. Especially because the real enemy to the West and Russia is radical Islam. We should form an alliance to defeat ISIS and radical Islam whenever its terrorist evil emerges.

The present between the West and Russia shows promise, with expected bumps in the road at times, but hopefully moving forward to a bright future for all of our people.
#14785091
Godstud wrote:Right, because making buddies with murderous dictators is what America is best known for.

Again, it's all about white supremacy(mostly money) and convenience. These people don't care if minorities(tax paying ones) are getting killed by their race soldiers. It's all about control. No good person would support trump, not even an sane person, unless he's an enemy of america would support trump. It's all about White control, that's it.
#14785904
Godstud wrote:Right, because making buddies with murderous dictators is what America is best known for.


Barack Obama and Raul Castro could certainly be included in your comment, but I imagine that you probably found those two buddies to be wonderful.

Besides, what is the alternative? Waiting for the "flash" and in that split second before getting vaporized, wishing that we should have at least tried to be "buddies" with Vladimir Putin.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

@stephen50right
If this was 10 years ago or even 3, you be saying nuke the russians. Which proves conservatism in america is like 4 quarters, they change for a dollar. Trump already broke so many laws, but as long as you rich and white, you don't care?

I have never stated to nuke the Russians. Besides the mass murder thing, it's because even if the US did win a nuclear war against Russia, I prefer my fruits and vegetables served without strontium 90.
Last edited by stephen50right on 15 Mar 2017 05:17, edited 1 time in total.
#14785908
Don't be obtuse. Nuclear war with Russia isn't a threat.

I never said Obama was better, did I? Can you quote me on that? I was talking about AMERICA.

Anyhow, try watching episode 5 of Michael Ware Uncensored(the whole thing), where he takes a trip to Cuba. You might learn a bit more about Cubans and how they feel about Castro and the Revolution(which for many, is ongoing).

This is a snippet...


In short, learn more before making assumptions, particularly about Castro. The US blockade did more damage to Cuba than Castro ever did. All because US failed in their take-over bid at the Bay of Pigs... Americans were always sore losers.
#14786027
Godstud wrote:Don't be obtuse. Nuclear war with Russia isn't a threat.

I never said Obama was better, did I? Can you quote me on that? I was talking about AMERICA.

Anyhow, try watching episode 5 of Michael Ware Uncensored(the whole thing), where he takes a trip to Cuba. You might learn a bit more about Cubans and how they feel about Castro and the Revolution(which for many, is ongoing).

This is a snippet...


In short, learn more before making assumptions, particularly about Castro. The US blockade did more damage to Cuba than Castro ever did. All because US failed in their take-over bid at the Bay of Pigs... Americans were always sore losers.



<<< Nuclear war with Russia isn't a threat. >>>

Stop being silly. You know that is a threat. Fortunately, NATO and MAD keeps the threat from turning into action.

As far as Cuba, the Bay of Pigs incident had absolutely nothing to do with dictator Castro's decades of failed socialist policy. His brand of socialism did the damage to Cuba all by itself.
#14786032
:roll: WRONG. Typical American answer.

Decades of US blockadesand trade sanctions(much like how USA wrecked Iraq), was much of the reason for Cuba's problems. They still manage to healthcare almost as good as the USA.
#14786065
Godstud wrote::roll: WRONG. Typical American answer.

Decades of US blockadesand trade sanctions(much like how USA wrecked Iraq), was much of the reason for Cuba's problems. They still manage to healthcare almost as good as the USA.


You seem to conveniently forget that Russia for decades was giving an awful lot of free money to Castro...it made him filthy rich, but didn't help the Cuban people all that much. That's what dictators always do, steal money from the people under the guise of themselves being noble, while the gullible people suffer except for the elite closely associated with the dictator such as the political staff, army generals, etc.

You posted a video which i have no intention of viewing because I have already seen numerous news videos about Cuba. My take on the result of over 50 years of Castro rule from watching these videos with the dilapidated buildings and ancient automobiles, is that a paint salesman would never meet his quota...he would be lucky to sell one can of paint per year - LOL
#14786198
So, you won't see a video of Cuba(from a people perspective by a well known Australian journalist) because it doesn't fit your biased narrative? Your "take" is via American news(over 50 years) that tells you how terrible and bad communism is. No bias there... :roll:

Continue to live in ignorance, as that seems to be your preferred state.

:peace:
#14786227
Umm...the article does a poor job of examining Russia and the US. You make claims but the support is flimsy. And yes, we all know what MAD is.

Russia does have many nuclear missiles which can destroy the West, but the West has many nuclear missiles which can destroy Russia. So we shouldn't both be pointing fingers at each other as to who is the most evil. Neither the West or Russia is evil.


The point in this passage is too simplistic. So the West has nukes and Russia has nukes, so no one is planning to use them? Why do you think that? I do not see a connection. Also, who is pointing fingers?

There is very little examination in the article, overall. It seems like random items are just strewn together in an incohesive manner.
#14786246
Godstud

I haven't seen your video either, I asked Hubby to down load it for the weekend.

Canadians seem to love Cuba, but maybe it's because so many of us go there, then tell their friends. I hope Trump lets American go down too.
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